Newbie with knife steel question...

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sal
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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby sal » Fri Oct 04, 2019 4:10 pm

constructor wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 3:41 pm
Edge retention, which was why I was thinking a coated blade on both with an oil regiment would really pretty much nullify the rust issues? Ive also come across a used pm2 in rex45???


If Edge retention is more important, then I would go with the steels other than LC and I personally have found that rust can happen on coated blades, but it's under the coating so you don't know it's there. M390 family are also good steels as mentioned.

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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby prndltech » Fri Oct 04, 2019 4:12 pm

I agree with sock... or just pick a spydie like Chris_P_Bacon and go for it. It won’t be pretty but it’ll hold up good!
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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby JuPaul » Fri Oct 04, 2019 4:26 pm

constructor wrote:
Fri Oct 04, 2019 2:04 pm
I have thought about the Manix variants too. So funneling the steels down looks like the Caribbean lc200n, Manix2 in s30v and Para2's in s30v and m390. I found the PM2 in s35vn or the coated s35vn so the s35vn probably trumps the s30v's I guess? Coated and non-coated m390's, since it was mentioned that its less maintenance/up keep than the lc200n steel. The best choices running seem to be the coated s35vn and m390/20cv, correct? I also do not mind spending more money or waiting a little if need be in order to get a better performing knife/steel.
The "2019 Delivered and Upcoming" models thread on here also shows a brown/satin and a brown/dlc Manix 2 in m390 in the works. No idea when that will be available, though. So if I was you, I'd get a pm2 in s30v or s35vn now, then a manix2 in m390 when they come out! Or get a pm2 in m390 now, and a Manix in s30v later! Btw, you will not find help saving your money here. :p ;)
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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby soc_monki » Sat Oct 05, 2019 7:59 am

For construction I'd pick a Manix. The PM2 is great, I have 2 (standard S30v and a BBS black/blue m390), but the manix is a tank. Thicker at the tip. I wish BBS would do a black/blue m390 manix, I'd be all over it!

Either would be fine, honestly. Just depends on if you want a more tanky knife (manix) or a lighter all rounder (pm2). S30v is a great steel, but I do love m390/20cv. You really can't go wrong!
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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby emanuel » Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:09 am

Go for S110V if you value edge retention, its a normal production so you won't be paying a premium price like you would on M390, which has lower corrosion resistance (this thing is basically rust proof) and significantly lower edge retention, particularly if cutting abrasive material, no other stainless on the general production market can match S110V as of now in this regard. Some people mention that its brittle, well I failed to see it, maybe I just had a good heat treatment in all the knives I had in it. As for care regarding torquing the blade, well any steel will snap, Paramilitary 2 is a great cutter with a thin geometry and a fine tip, this has nothing to do with the steel. If all you do is cut and use something else as a pry-bar, S110V would be your best buy.

Just make sure to not polish the edge, don't go over 800-1000 grit when sharpening, then strop it to remove the burr and it will cut forever. With so much carbide embedded in this steel, it likes a toothy edge, which is perfect for construction working where you need cutting aggression.

Also, if you want a stronger tip on your knife, have a look at Manix 2, also in S110V.
Last edited by emanuel on Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby Doc Dan » Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:29 am

S30V and S35VN are good all around steels. A Paramilitary 2 in these steels would be perfect. I prefer the Manix 2 myself. Either would be great.
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emanuel
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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby emanuel » Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:36 am

Doc Dan wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:29 am
S30V and S35VN are good all around steels. A Paramilitary 2 in these steels would be perfect. I prefer the Manix 2 myself. Either would be great.
He needs higher abrasive resistance steels for a professional construction work than these, unless he doesn't mind sharpening them 3-4 times a day. They work, but there are better options (s110v, m390). Sadly non-stainless are out of the equation, there are some great ones that would work well for him with some light maintenance.

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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby Doc Dan » Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:38 am

Those steels are too hard to sharpen. I’d not want to be on the job and have to stop and spend a long time getting my knife sharp again.

Really BD1N would do the job nicely.
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emanuel
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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby emanuel » Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:50 am

You won't need to sharpen these high vanadium steels in a day of work, unless you're scraping sand off of something. The last thing I wanted when working 14-16 hours a day jobs was to stop my flow every few hours (or even less if the job was harsh) to sharpen my tool. But yes, anything works, even bd1n. Question is, is that the best option?

@constructor, what exactly are you doing at work? What are you cutting? Here in Europe we build houses out of mostly concrete and bricks, so sand and ceramic brick dust is pretty much everywhere, while in the USA it seems to be more common for wood and more light materials to be used, correct?

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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby tonijedi » Sat Oct 05, 2019 11:45 am

emanuel wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:50 am

@constructor, what exactly are you doing at work? What are you cutting? Here in Europe we build houses out of mostly concrete and bricks, so sand and ceramic brick dust is pretty much everywhere, while in the USA it seems to be more common for wood and more light materials to be used, correct?
This is an important question. I've been in several construction sites, from roads to dams to house rehabilitation and in nine I've seen work for a PM2 style of knife. In some works a Mora fixed blade is best, on others box cutters style knives. I've used hollow grind and saber grind knives because as Emanuel pointed out here in Europe construction is more related with rocks rather than wood.

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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby knivesandbooks » Sat Oct 05, 2019 4:12 pm

What about finding one of the coated m4 bladehq exclusives. Tough, holds an edge, and not real difficult to hone.
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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby ugaarguy » Sat Oct 05, 2019 5:50 pm

If you're concerned about durability, skip the compression lock, and skip CBB lock. Every Spyderco I've owned that had steel liners developed rust on the liners. Get a Native 5 lightweight in whatever steel you want, because the Native 5 LW doesn't have liners. Cleaning a bit of rust off of a blade is much easier, and much less time consuming than taking a knife apart to clean the liners.

I'll be giving Spyderco knives with steel liners another chance when the Sage 5 lightweight becomes available.

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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby constructor » Sat Oct 05, 2019 5:57 pm

I guess my last post didn't get posted last night, I think I read that a mod has to review my post first, but anyway. I bought a PM2 20cv off of the bay last night. Looks like it was the DLT exclusive? So while I was searching the web I also saw the new Bento K390 too.

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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby Mattysc42 » Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:19 pm

The s110v manix lightweight would be one of the least expensive and most corrosion/wear resistant option. The knife has pinned contruction and no liners, which bothers some people, but works fine imo. The m390 pm2 would be an easier to sharpen and slightly tougher but less wear resistant and more expensive option. According to Larrin’s (from knifesteelnerds.com) testing, m390 is tougher than s30v, s35vn, s110v, and d2.

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That being said, if you use you’re knife hard enough to dull it in a day or two like I do in my automotive production job, and I imagine construction would as well, you’ll need to get some good diamond or cbn plates to resharpen in a reasonable amount of time. After a year or two of working with s110v, you’ll be a near master sharpener.
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Top 5 knives I’ve owned: Serrated Caribbean Leaf, Shaman, Manix XL, ZDP-189/CF Caly 3.5, Native LW.
Top 5 steels I’ve owned: LC200N, K390, CPM S90V, M390, CPM M4.
Top 3 steels I want more of: M390 class, A11 class (including K390), serrated LC200N.

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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby Cambertree » Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:51 pm

constructor wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 5:57 pm
I guess my last post didn't get posted last night, I think I read that a mod has to review my post first, but anyway. I bought a PM2 20cv off of the bay last night. Looks like it was the DLT exclusive? So while I was searching the web I also saw the new Bento K390 too.
Good choice, that's a great option for the work you described. FYI, CPM 20CV (made by Latrobe/Crucible) is basically the same steel grade as M390 (Bohler Uddeholm) and CTS-204P (Carpenter).

Depending on what sharpening gear you have, you might wanna think about getting a Sharpmaker too. The diamond or CBN rods are extra, but with those and the basic setup, you're well fixed to keep your PM2 razor sharp for years of use.

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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby Wartstein » Sat Oct 05, 2019 11:56 pm

Cambertree wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:51 pm
constructor wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 5:57 pm
I guess my last post didn't get posted last night, I think I read that a mod has to review my post first, but anyway. I bought a PM2 20cv off of the bay last night. Looks like it was the DLT exclusive? So while I was searching the web I also saw the new Bento K390 too.
Good choice, that's a great option for the work you described. FYI, CPM 20CV (made by Latrobe/Crucible) is basically the same steel grade as M390 (Bohler Uddeholm) and CTS-204P (Carpenter).

Depending on what sharpening gear you have, you might wanna think about getting a Sharpmaker too. The diamond or CBN rods are extra, but with those and the basic setup, you're well fixed to keep your PM2 razor sharp for years of use.

I want to second the suggestion to get a sharpmaker. Even if you think of getting more Spyderco knives than your PM2 (which could EASILY happen, believe me... :rolleyes: ) get a sharpmaker first...

(@Cambertree: I honestly always really like to read your posts and advices, even if those are not concerning a question I have myself. It's just so much knowledge presented in a very modest manner).
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby VooDooChild » Sun Oct 06, 2019 12:40 am

Save yourself the worry of picking a steel and get the shaman. The pm2 is an amazing slicer but you will have to be mindful of the tip. If you get careless with it, or more likely let someone else use it, that tip is the only weak point and sometimes stuff just happens. Im aware of all the ways someone shouldnt be using a knife but like I said sometimes stuff happens.
Closest thing to a pm2 with a tip you wouldnt have to worry about would be the shaman. Other people are recommending manix and its a tank too. I just dont like the lock on it. Another consideration, foliage green sabre ground combo edge endura 4. Cheap, rugged, and takes one heck of a beating. Or any sabre grind endura 4.
I realize my reccomendations avoid your question but if there was even a possibility of me doing something dumb with a knife im grabbing one of those two. And yes sometimes I do dumb things.

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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby Cambertree » Sun Oct 06, 2019 5:49 am

Wartstein wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 11:56 pm
I want to second the suggestion to get a sharpmaker. Even if you think of getting more Spyderco knives than your PM2 (which could EASILY happen, believe me... :rolleyes: ) get a sharpmaker first...

(@Cambertree: I honestly always really like to read your posts and advices, even if those are not concerning a question I have myself. It's just so much knowledge presented in a very modest manner).
Thanks Wartstein, that's very kind of you, mate. :)

Yeah, regarding the Sharpmaker, there's not many purchases in the knife world that increase the value and pleasure in use of all your knives and cutting tools, but that's one of them.

Constructor, I'd be interested to hear some feedback on what you think of the knife and steel after putting it to work a bit.

Also, if you get the Sharpmaker, so you can sharpen serrations easily, I also highly recommend the rustproof Pacific Salt SE. You can get some great deals on the discontinued first gen models at the moment. It's the supreme super tough, beater knife.
Last edited by Cambertree on Sun Oct 06, 2019 9:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby sok » Sun Oct 06, 2019 6:02 am

ugaarguy wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 5:50 pm
If you're concerned about durability, skip the compression lock, and skip CBB lock. Every Spyderco I've owned that had steel liners developed rust on the liners. Get a Native 5 lightweight in whatever steel you want, because the Native 5 LW doesn't have liners.
You just sold a knife.

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Re: Newbie with knife steel question...

Postby Wartstein » Sun Oct 06, 2019 6:09 am

Cambertree wrote:
Sun Oct 06, 2019 5:49 am
Wartstein wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 11:56 pm
I want to second the suggestion to get a sharpmaker. Even if you think of getting more Spyderco knives than your PM2 (which could EASILY happen, believe me... :rolleyes: ) get a sharpmaker first...

(@Cambertree: I honestly always really like to read your posts and advices, even if those are not concerning a question I have myself. It's just so much knowledge presented in a very modest manner).
Thanks Wartstein, that's very kind of you, mate. :)

Yeah, regarding the Sharpmaker, there's not many purchases in the knife world that increase the value and pleasure in use of all your knives and cutting tools, but that's one of them.

Constructor, I'd be interested to hear some feedback on what you think of the knife and steel after putting it to work a bit.

Also, if you get the Sharmaker, so you can sharpen serrations easily, I also highly recommend the rustproof Pacific Salt SE. You can get some great deals on the discontinued first gen models at the moment. It's the supreme super tough, beater knife.
Cambertree, the NEXT suggestion I just have to second... ;) Got one myself just two days ago, don´t regret it AT ALL.
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40


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