Province edge angle

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kgasp
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Province edge angle

Postby kgasp » Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:10 am

Hi
First post but not my first knife. :D

Got the Province and it is real slicer!! Happy to see that in large knifes from non-custom makers. Very nice scales with very nice pattern. Great fit and finish.

Just got it so not used it much. But started to convex it on an ken onion work sharp grinder attachment. 18dps. Have not completed the convexing. The steel is harder than I am used to so ran out of time (due to kids).

Planing on using as general camping knife. Some batoning on birch logs approx half the blade length. No crazy hardwood.

Question: So what do you think about 18dps? Will 4V and the ??HRC support it?
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sal
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby sal » Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:36 pm

Hi Kgasp,

Welcome to our forum and thanx for the support.

On the edge, I'd suggest leaving it alone and use it as is before sharpening on a motorized sharpener. You can always mess with the edge later when it needs sharpening. No sense in grinding away edge when you don't have to. Also, in my opinion, I don't think grinding a new edge will make it cut better.

sal

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Surfingringo
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby Surfingringo » Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:25 pm

Hey kgasp, I haven’t used 4v at all but ive handled the Province prototype and it has good geometry and enough steel behind the edge to support some fairly hard use. On a knife like the province, steels like s30v should handle the work you describe at 18dps with no issues. I don’t think you will have any problems with that knife in 4v at that angle for the what you’ll be doing.

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Archimedes
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby Archimedes » Fri Sep 13, 2019 5:31 pm

Why a convex edge? How will this improve the knife?

kgasp
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby kgasp » Sun Sep 15, 2019 2:18 am

Thanks for the replies!

Then I just keep it between 18 and 20.

Att Archimedes: as I understand convex is a little bit stronger than v edge and then I can go lower in angle?! In my case I have a work sharp and stones. Both creates convex so convex it is.

Regards
Kristian

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sal
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby sal » Mon Sep 16, 2019 12:04 pm

Hi Kristian,

Convex edges work best when the entire grind is convex from the spine to the edge. This creates a very thin edge and very little friction at any point along the grind. Convexing the very edge on a flat ground knife, in my opinion, offers no advantage and has for a few disadvantages.

sal

kgasp
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby kgasp » Tue Sep 17, 2019 12:56 am

Hi Sal
Thanks for you experience.
What are the disadvantages with partial convex?
I hate to throw out 3x naniwa prof stones and 2x naniwa diamond stones and a work sharp and a lot of small stones to get a guided system that gives V edge. (I have a sharpmaker. Like it but limited angles.)
Regards
Kristian

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sal
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby sal » Tue Sep 17, 2019 4:45 pm

Hi Kgasp,

It's too thick of an edge to be really sharp. I might add, though I dn't know your skill levels, that there are very few that can improve on our factory edges.

sal

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Surfingringo
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby Surfingringo » Tue Sep 17, 2019 6:40 pm

Hey Sal, your Taichung maker deserves a TON of respect for the quality of the knives they are producing. There are very few production facilities in the world that can compete with those guys. I’ll say this though...Golden, CO still has them beat when it comes to the edge. Many of the Taichung folders I have bought were sharpened a bit too obtuse for my taste and often get a reprofile straight away. (The last few have been better actually so this might be something they have improved) Golden on the other hand is incredibly consistent with their edge angles. At least that’s been my experience with the dozen or so knives I have from each factory. Taichung offers incredible fit and finish, but you guys in Golden are King when it comes to the edge.

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Re: Province edge angle

Postby AccountDeletedUserRequest » Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:03 pm

I put a thin convex edge on my Scrapyard Dofather, and it chops much better now.

It's fun chopping with a knife sharp enough to shave with.

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knivesandbooks
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby knivesandbooks » Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:00 pm

I wouldn't reprofile the edge out of the box to 18. If you're going to take the time to do that, might as well go lower and then microbevel it. But the factory edge probably isn't bad. I agree with Sal, use it until dull and then sharpen it. 4v should hold a good edge (I have 3v and it does great) and if you're using it for woodsy stuff, the edge edge shouldn't dull too quick.

I also agree with Sal on the full flat grind / convex edge thing. All my LT Wrights in full flat came with convex. Can't stand that. But my full convex grind Bark Rivers do well. But I even put a V edge on one of them and I like how it cuts better (looks meh now though).

Also, nice knife. I love the look of that thing.
I own an assisted knife and am embarrassed to admit I enjoy it.

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Cambertree
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby Cambertree » Tue Sep 17, 2019 10:49 pm

Surfingringo wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 6:40 pm
Hey Sal, your Taichung maker deserves a TON of respect for the quality of the knives they are producing. There are very few production facilities in the world that can compete with those guys. I’ll say this though...Golden, CO still has them beat when it comes to the edge. Many of the Taichung folders I have bought were sharpened a bit too obtuse for my taste and often get a reprofile straight away. (The last few have been better actually so this might be something they have improved) Golden on the other hand is incredibly consistent with their edge angles. At least that’s been my experience with the dozen or so knives I have from each factory. Taichung offers incredible fit and finish, but you guys in Golden are King when it comes to the edge.
Yeah, I agree - Taichung quality exceeds some custom knives I've seen. But the Golden factory edges reign supreme for consistency and sharpness. At least for my similar sample size of about a dozen knives from each place.

Question for you Kgasp: how are you finding the handle in extended use for comfort? I'm considering a Province, but the flat top and bottom of the handle have prompted me to wait for a bit more user feedback. The most comfortable fixed blades I have, feature more of an oval or 'inverted egg' cross section in their handle contouring.

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dj moonbat
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby dj moonbat » Wed Sep 18, 2019 10:58 am

Also, if the Province is much like other Spydies I've bought, the factory edge is probably somewhere near 18 per side anyway.

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Re: Province edge angle

Postby bearfacedkiller » Wed Sep 18, 2019 12:29 pm

I like convex edges.

I have never found that I needed a knife with and edge over 30 degrees (15dps). Even my large choppers and some of my axes run 30 degree edges.

I have battoned various knives in 1095 through 5-6 inch round seasoned oak without damaging an edge. The trick to safe battoning is to avoid knots. White birch is soft, black birch is harder but splits easy and yellow birch is slightly less forgiving. Most birch is soft compared to oak, beech or sugar maple which are the common hardwoods around me.

When I get a Province it will get a 30 degree inclusive edge.

My only experience with 4V is with the Mule so I cannot comment much on 4V and hard use.
-Darby
sal wrote:Knife afi's are pretty far out, steel junky's more so, but "edge junky's" are just nuts. :p
SpyderEdgeForever wrote: Also, do you think a kangaroo would eat a bowl of spagetti with sauce if someone offered it to them?

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Archimedes
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby Archimedes » Sun Sep 22, 2019 7:12 am

kgasp wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 2:18 am
Thanks for the replies!

Then I just keep it between 18 and 20.

Att Archimedes: as I understand convex is a little bit stronger than v edge and then I can go lower in angle?! In my case I have a work sharp and stones. Both creates convex so convex it is.

Regards
Kristian
Interesting concept. Sharpen the knife to your sharpening tools results, instead of using sharpening tools to sharpen the knife to its design.

kgasp
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby kgasp » Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:26 am

Archimedes wrote:
Sun Sep 22, 2019 7:12 am
kgasp wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 2:18 am
Thanks for the replies!

Then I just keep it between 18 and 20.

Att Archimedes: as I understand convex is a little bit stronger than v edge and then I can go lower in angle?! In my case I have a work sharp and stones. Both creates convex so convex it is.

Regards
Kristian
Interesting concept. Sharpen the knife to your sharpening tools results, instead of using sharpening tools to sharpen the knife to its design.
I am open to suggestions. What should I do then without buying an assisted system like wicked edge?

How do you sharpen both convex and V edges?

Regards Kristian

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Re: Province edge angle

Postby TomAiello » Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:39 am

Archimedes wrote:
Sun Sep 22, 2019 7:12 am
kgasp wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 2:18 am
Thanks for the replies!

Then I just keep it between 18 and 20.

Att Archimedes: as I understand convex is a little bit stronger than v edge and then I can go lower in angle?! In my case I have a work sharp and stones. Both creates convex so convex it is.

Regards
Kristian
Interesting concept. Sharpen the knife to your sharpening tools results, instead of using sharpening tools to sharpen the knife to its design.
I'd bet that's how 99% of the world does it. Usually they use those cheap pull through sharpeners, because they saw them in a plastic jar at the check out stand of their hardware store, and they've never used anything else. Heck, most of the people I know have never sharpened any of the knives in their kitchen.

kgasp
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby kgasp » Sun Sep 22, 2019 12:44 pm

Cambertree wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 10:49 pm
Surfingringo wrote:
Tue Sep 17, 2019 6:40 pm
Hey Sal, your Taichung maker deserves a TON of respect for the quality of the knives they are producing. There are very few production facilities in the world that can compete with those guys. I’ll say this though...Golden, CO still has them beat when it comes to the edge. Many of the Taichung folders I have bought were sharpened a bit too obtuse for my taste and often get a reprofile straight away. (The last few have been better actually so this might be something they have improved) Golden on the other hand is incredibly consistent with their edge angles. At least that’s been my experience with the dozen or so knives I have from each factory. Taichung offers incredible fit and finish, but you guys in Golden are King when it comes to the edge.
Yeah, I agree - Taichung quality exceeds some custom knives I've seen. But the Golden factory edges reign supreme for consistency and sharpness. At least for my similar sample size of about a dozen knives from each place.

Question for you Kgasp: how are you finding the handle in extended use for comfort? I'm considering a Province, but the flat top and bottom of the handle have prompted me to wait for a bit more user feedback. The most comfortable fixed blades I have, feature more of an oval or 'inverted egg' cross section in their handle contouring.
I have not used it for more than 5-10 min each occasion. And not many occasions (two kids :) ). Done some feathers sticks and lite chopping and light batoning. When feather sticking and putting pressure downwards I feel the square shape of the top of the handle. Not super comfortable but ok. It is not comfortable like a rounded bark river handle or mora. Lite chopping and lite batoning is fine due to I am not gripping the handle so tightly (sorry English not first language). Another small thing is that this knife is very slicy! So compared to thick heavy 6,5 inch survival knife this knife requires a little less pressure on the handle.

I do not do long carving sessions (if I did I would get a malanika puukko) :) .

The rest of the handle is nice. Thick and contoured (I have large glove size). AND very good looking polished G10 in my opinion. Not very helpful for you maybe.

If I remember correctly Sal said in an interview that one of the features was the removable scales so the customer can get custom scales.

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Cambertree
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby Cambertree » Wed Sep 25, 2019 8:47 pm

kgasp wrote:
Sun Sep 22, 2019 12:44 pm
I have not used it for more than 5-10 min each occasion. And not many occasions (two kids :) ). Done some feathers sticks and lite chopping and light batoning. When feather sticking and putting pressure downwards I feel the square shape of the top of the handle. Not super comfortable but ok. It is not comfortable like a rounded bark river handle or mora. Lite chopping and lite batoning is fine due to I am not gripping the handle so tightly (sorry English not first language). Another small thing is that this knife is very slicy! So compared to thick heavy 6,5 inch survival knife this knife requires a little less pressure on the handle.

I do not do long carving sessions (if I did I would get a malanika puukko) :) .

The rest of the handle is nice. Thick and contoured (I have large glove size). AND very good looking polished G10 in my opinion. Not very helpful for you maybe.

If I remember correctly Sal said in an interview that one of the features was the removable scales so the customer can get custom scales.
Thanks Kristian, your answer was very useful and clearly expressed.

I'll look forward to any further notes you have on the Province.

I like this design and steel very much. I also like the way Spyderco have allowed for custom handles on this and the Respect.

I imagine in future, that we will have some third party handle options. Unfortunately in Australia, we rarely have the option to handle a model in a bricks and mortar shop, before committing to buy. One of the other extra costs I would have to factor in is the aftermarket Boltaron sheath so I can carry it on my dominant left hand side.

I'll be keeping a close eye on this model, though.

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Bloke
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Re: Province edge angle

Postby Bloke » Thu Sep 26, 2019 5:49 pm

Cambertree wrote:
Wed Sep 25, 2019 8:47 pm
I'll be keeping a close eye on this model, though.
Hey Camber, if first impressions, cutting a little cardboard and dry Ghost Gum end grain are anything to go by ... very, very nice. :cool:
A day without laughter is a day wasted. ~ Charlie Chaplin


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