Why does tooling get destroyed?

[SpyderEdgeForever]

I read and have been told that at some point with Spyderco and other knife-making companies, the actual tooling gets destroyed after a certain amount of time, when a knife or knives is discontinued. I once contacted an unnamed knife company and explained to the owner/originator that I really enjoyed a model that was discontinued. The said person told me they were very glad that I enjoyed that knife, but, it was at the time discontinued, and they had only one model of it left, and that was for their personal collection. They proceeded to then tell me that the original factory tooling was gone, destroyed.

Why does this happen? Why not store the tool and die shapes somewhere for the future, in case they ever want to bring them back? Or is it easier nowadays to just keep the software and blueprints?

[jpm2]

... They proceeded to then tell me that the original factory tooling was gone, destroyed.
Why does this happen? ...

Why didn't you ask them?

[Doeswhateveraspidercan]

I read and have been told that at some point with Spyderco and other knife-making companies, the actual tooling gets destroyed after a certain amount of time, when a knife or knives is discontinued. I once contacted an unnamed knife company and explained to the owner/originator that I really enjoyed a model that was discontinued. The said person told me they were very glad that I enjoyed that knife, but, it was at the time discontinued, and they had only one model of it left, and that was for their personal collection. They proceeded to then tell me that the original factory tooling was gone, destroyed.

Why does this happen? Why not store the tool and die shapes somewhere for the future, in case they ever want to bring them back? Or is it easier nowadays to just keep the software and blueprints?

You have raised a question and supplied the answer as well. :)

[Doc Dan]

Sometimes it is because the tooling wears out. Sometimes after they discontinue them all and then people retire or leave their jobs there’s no one left that knows how to actually make the product. Also it’s easier to store the blueprints than it is the machinery with the limited space that companies have. Sometimes they’ve come out with a new model it is actually just an improvement over the old model and they see no reason to keep it. Sometimes it’s just poor planning.

If I remember correctly up in the Northeast went all of the American traditional live companies were closing down other companies were trying to ramp up and make the knives again. The problem was not that they didn’t have the machinery nor was it they did not have the blueprints. They had those things. What they didn’t have was the skilled labor to make them.

[SG89]

I thought they destroyed it so the counterfeiters couldn't get it

[Bloke]

They proceeded to then tell me

[The Mastiff]

Tooling includes jigs made for certain tasks such as assembling the parts into a knife. If there is no chance of a knife being brought back why pay for maintenance and storage ? There are better uses of resources. For many companies storage space itself is a resource that has to be managed.

[JD Spydo]

I thought they destroyed it so the counterfeiters couldn't get it

How could counterfeiters get the tooling if it's in Spyderco's possession? Not trying to be a troll or anything of the like but I would think it would be far too risky for counterfeiters to try to invade a company's manufacturing facility and risk getting caught stealing a company's private property. But you've also got me at a disadvantage in a way because I'm starting to think that maybe I might be overlooking something obvious to others? Maybe you and others here could shed some light on it?

Actually I tend to believe that the way these people who make counterfeits and knock offs I'm sure they just replicate the design as best they can. But it's great you bring that aspect up because the theft of company property or a company's intellectual property I've heard is truly an international problem>> the second one being a far more prevalent problem IMO. However I tend to believe they don't steal tooling I think they just steal the designs by replicating them. But if I'm wrong I would like to know how?

[Evil D]

I think the cold harsh truth here is most businesses don't stay in the past very long. Regardless of what they're making, they're creating new updated versions and moving forward with designs, out with the old and in with the new. At some point the decision is made to change something and update it, and that decision is almost always based on sales. If sales slow and push you to update something, why exactly would you keep the tooling for the old model when sales had dropped? Nobody really does this, you don't see car companies saving the dies that stamped out a fender for a car they made 30 years ago. Time also has a way of losing things and many of these things could be lost in a warehouse somewhere or accidentally destroyed.

[SG89]

I thought they destroyed it so the counterfeiters couldn't get it

How could counterfeiters get the tooling if it's in Spyderco's possession? Not trying to be a troll or anything of the like but I would think it would be far too risky for counterfeiters to try to invade a company's manufacturing facility and risk getting caught stealing a company's private property. But you've also got me at a disadvantage in a way because I'm starting to think that maybe I might be overlooking something obvious to others? Maybe you and others here could shed some light on it?

Actually I tend to believe that the way these people who make counterfeits and knock offs I'm sure they just replicate the design as best they can. But it's great you bring that aspect up because the theft of company property or a company's intellectual property I've heard is truly an international problem>> the second one being a far more prevalent problem IMO. However I tend to believe they don't steal tooling I think they just steal the designs by replicating them. But if I'm wrong I would like to know how?

My first thought would be inside job, not invasion. Think disgruntled employee trying to make a quick buck. I thought we were all just guessing anyways. I'm sure the logical reason is storage space/cost. My mind just always goes to the worst lol

[Ez556]

I thought they destroyed it so the counterfeiters couldn't get it

How could counterfeiters get the tooling if it's in Spyderco's possession? Not trying to be a troll or anything of the like but I would think it would be far too risky for counterfeiters to try to invade a company's manufacturing facility and risk getting caught stealing a company's private property. But you've also got me at a disadvantage in a way because I'm starting to think that maybe I might be overlooking something obvious to others? Maybe you and others here could shed some light on it?

Actually I tend to believe that the way these people who make counterfeits and knock offs I'm sure they just replicate the design as best they can. But it's great you bring that aspect up because the theft of company property or a company's intellectual property I've heard is truly an international problem>> the second one being a far more prevalent problem IMO. However I tend to believe they don't steal tooling I think they just steal the designs by replicating them. But if I'm wrong I would like to know how?

My first thought would be inside job, not invasion. Think disgruntled employee trying to make a quick buck. I thought we were all just guessing anyways. I'm sure the logical reason is storage space/cost. My mind just always goes to the worst lol

In cases like that that’s usually how it happens. Either an employee actively takes part in arranging the transfer to another entity under the table, or by accident like leaving it outside, in an off-site storage facility and *poof* it disappears only to reappear somewhere it shouldn’t be.

[FK]

Most manuf. companies have a fixed amount of sq. ft. for machinery and assembly of products.
Storage of old or obsolete tooling takes away from that valuable production area.
Why pay taxes, insurance and maintenance for floor space that is not making the company a profit?

Regards,
FK

[bbturbodad]

Destroying dies before sending them to a recycling facility keeps a recycler from having the ability to sell them as 'scrap metal' intact.

[SpyderEdgeForever]

They proceeded to then tell me

Bloke, I am so glad to know you on here :) You have such a funny sense of humor my friend :)

[SpyderEdgeForever]

... They proceeded to then tell me that the original factory tooling was gone, destroyed.
Why does this happen? ...

Why didn't you ask them?

When I did, said person wanted to be very brief and not get into the details and said it had to do with market issues and no more demand for the particular model.

[SpyderEdgeForever]

The answers I received here seem to cover all of the possibilities. It is very sad: I wish there were some way for knife makers to somehow store good designs somewhere that will be perpetually-available for future producers and knife collectors to have access to.

[SpyderEdgeForever]

I think the cold harsh truth here is most businesses don't stay in the past very long. Regardless of what they're making, they're creating new updated versions and moving forward with designs, out with the old and in with the new. At some point the decision is made to change something and update it, and that decision is almost always based on sales. If sales slow and push you to update something, why exactly would you keep the tooling for the old model when sales had dropped? Nobody really does this, you don't see car companies saving the dies that stamped out a fender for a car they made 30 years ago. Time also has a way of losing things and many of these things could be lost in a warehouse somewhere or accidentally destroyed.

Does this mean it is possible that there may be some designs out there somewhere, in storage, that have been forgotten, and perhaps could be rediscovered and remade in the future?

[Doc Dan]

I thought they destroyed it so the counterfeiters couldn't get it

How could counterfeiters get the tooling if it's in Spyderco's possession? Not trying to be a troll or anything of the like but I would think it would be far too risky for counterfeiters to try to invade a company's manufacturing facility and risk getting caught stealing a company's private property. But you've also got me at a disadvantage in a way because I'm starting to think that maybe I might be overlooking something obvious to others? Maybe you and others here could shed some light on it?

Actually I tend to believe that the way these people who make counterfeits and knock offs I'm sure they just replicate the design as best they can. But it's great you bring that aspect up because the theft of company property or a company's intellectual property I've heard is truly an international problem>> the second one being a far more prevalent problem IMO. However I tend to believe they don't steal tooling I think they just steal the designs by replicating them. But if I'm wrong I would like to know how?

While I do not think this is why the equipment is gotten rid of, I would like to point out that it is a possibility. Old equipment is often simply sold. So there is an opportunity for others to make use of that equipment or get their hands on it somehow.

[Evil D]

I think the cold harsh truth here is most businesses don't stay in the past very long. Regardless of what they're making, they're creating new updated versions and moving forward with designs, out with the old and in with the new. At some point the decision is made to change something and update it, and that decision is almost always based on sales. If sales slow and push you to update something, why exactly would you keep the tooling for the old model when sales had dropped? Nobody really does this, you don't see car companies saving the dies that stamped out a fender for a car they made 30 years ago. Time also has a way of losing things and many of these things could be lost in a warehouse somewhere or accidentally destroyed.

Does this mean it is possible that there may be some designs out there somewhere, in storage, that have been forgotten, and perhaps could be rediscovered and remade in the future?

Oh I'm certain there are, otherwise I'm not sure we would ever get sprints of some models that have been around for 20+ years. I'd be surprised if they have tooling for models that have been replaced, like the earlier Delicas for example.

[p_atrick]

For many companies storage space itself is a resource that has to be managed.

Just how big can tooling be? I never gave it much thought, but I assumed it wasn't all that big.