Spyderco Forums

lonerider1013 wrote: ↑

Mon Jun 17, 2019 9:44 pm

^Doeswhateveraspidercan... To reiterate, it was not my intention to hurt anyone. A woman was robbed at knife point a block from my house in broad daylight today in front of a crowded store. I was simply asking what I should do if this happened to me, as I've never really thought of it before... never had to, but i pass thru there at all times of day. Essentially I was asking if there was a way to for instance disarm the attacker or if it was better to run, in fact I think I explicitly stated my position was one of "unarmed" because although I carry a knife as a tool i have no intention of using it as a weapon. I certainly don't plan on getting into a knife fight in the street, I am sorry if anyone got that impression. I'm just a peaceful dude but when I hear of something like that happening I ask myself what should i do? Seemed a normal thing to ask.

Of course you are, we know that your a good dude. Good dudes must protect themselves from the system. Please understand Prison is big business and it is unfortunate but the system does not protect us.

We must become wise and work with the system in order to protest ourselves.

Shameful really. Insurance is a must or run.

It can go dozens of different ways-
1) you give him your wallet he says thanks and walks away
2) you give him your wallet he stabs you a couple times to give himself more time before the authorities are called.
3) you give your wallet he finishes you off then and there, so there will be no witness.
4) You get into a knife fight-
a) you lose
b) he loses
c) Most likely- you both lose
5) you run, he stabs you in the back
6) you run he lets you go, or can't keep up
7) you pull a firearm
8) ect, ect, ect.

If I know I will be in a particularly sketchy area and I can't have my CCW on me (traveling to states my ccw doesn't apply) I'll sometimes keep an old wallet full of those fake credit cards you get in the mail and $15 in ones. Just remember, just because you comply don't let your guard down and think he won't still stab you for the fun of it. The best option I've seen is to pull your wallet out show the money throw it one way and run (or draw) once he turns towards the wallet. In some videos I've seen the mugger will just start stabbing and pull the wallet and phone from your pocket once your down on the ground trying to figure out what happened. Situational awareness is very important.

I'd recommend watching Active Self protection videos on youtube, the youtuber reviews security cam footage of shootings, stabbings, muggings, robberies, ect.

CALMLY give him what he wants without acting threatening at all. If he runs after taking my wallet, call the police immediately after he’s out of sight and hearing range (ask someone to call the police if the mugger took my phone). If he attacks, do my best to cripple or kill him as quickly and efficiently as possible to limit the amount of harm he can inflict onto me, and take him down with me in the worst case.

i’m running. i don’t care how slow i am. if they’re looking for easy money, they haven’t found it if they have to chase it. otherwise, i’m not fighting if i don’t have to and i’ll just give up the money. if they aren’t interested in money and i have to protect my life or the lives of my family, i might die, but they will absolutely regret only bringing a knife.

Roundhouse kick, right to the face. :cool:

restless ghost wrote: ↑

Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:30 pm

Roundhouse kick, right to the face. :cool:

OP,

When it comes to a subject like this, I wouldn't assume that a street thug (especially if he's a hardened criminal) is 'untrained'. I have heard from some reputable sources (including some I've known personally) that to many convicts who have used (and faced) a lot of physical violence, prison is almost like a finishing school to become more efficient at it, with many even practicing together in secret (sometimes even in slow motion so as not to attract unwanted attention from the guards or other convicts). This is common among prison gangs. What such people practice are not 'formal' martial arts, but simple methods of setting up and quickly dispatching another person, whether for a "hit" or simply to survive on the inside, or to be more effective for when they get out. Most involve ambushing methods to end it as quickly as possible. Some of them reach the equivalent of 'expert' level. Combine that with a hardened (or sociopathic) attitude and a willingness to 'go all the way'. This isn't everyone, and not even the majority, but you can never tell just by looking at someone's physical appearance how formidable they are or aren't.

I only mention this because many people, especially many martial artists, simply assume that street criminals are unsophisticated, untrained and unprepared in the realm of hand to hand or weapons combat. Which may be true if the criminal is inexperienced. Unfortunately, some people have discovered too late that that's not always the case.

Jim

If you are alone and unarmed:

Immediately create distance and based on the circumstances, decide whether it is best to run immediately, or comply with his demands. If he attempts to close the distance you've created, run. As you're running, try to attract attention by screaming. The introduction of more witnesses can be a big deterrent. There is no winner in a knife fight, and no tangible item is worth being stabbed over.

We live in a crazy world and nothing is 100% preventable. But at the same time, preventing/avoiding these types of situations is best. Good life decisions go a long way.

ladybug93 wrote: ↑

Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:36 pm

restless ghost wrote: ↑

Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:30 pm

Roundhouse kick, right to the face. :cool:

That's a crescent kick

The real question is what do I do when they try to rob me with a knife and all I have on me is knives. I don't really carry cash or valuables.

distance and pepper spray. and then more distance.

Give him what he wants and then go home and hug your family. It is only stuff and stuff can be replaced.

I got mugged once. I gave them my wallet and there was no cash in it so they took my credit cards and gave me my wallet back. He was going to take the whole wallet but I asked him to just take the credit cards so i wouldn’t have to replace everything else. I walked away and immediately cancelled my cards. That was it.

There is no reason to be a hero.

That's easy...throw my wallet and run to the closest public place that I can. I regularly carry a gun but I really don't want shooting somebody over money, even someone who is trying to rob me, on my conscience.

Hey rider, if all else fails you could always come live in Oz where you’d have more chance of being bitten by a shark, venomous spider, snake or maybe eaten by a salty croc if you decide to live up north but you wouldn’t have to worry about being stabbed of shot.

Knife violence went through the roof in western Europe,and i suspect the dynamic is different from the violence in the US.Without going into politics,we have now people who will stab you in plain day light just because.They don't care getting arrested,they don't want to rob you,they just want to stick a blade into you.It comes to this:if the attacker wants your resources,give them to him.If he wants you or wants to move to another location you have to deal with him physically.Put distance/obstacles between you and the attacker,and if you make contact,be sure to have the right mind set,meaning your goal is to rip his head off.Anything less,don't even bother.
If he's available,i think Mike Janich's advice will be most welcome for all of us.

You give them what they ask for and hope they leave and/or you give it up and run. Even with training, even with a gun, a person who already has a knife in their hands, you had better be a legit well trained hand to hand fighter or a wild west gun fighter who can draw and shoot in the blink of an eye if you hope to fight back and not die. High stress means high heart rate which means one significant cut on a forearm can mean you'll bleed out before you get help, and that's only if they cut you once and leave you alone. Even if you do manage to defend yourself and even kill the attacker, you yourself may also die from your injuries.

The old saying "bringing a knife to a gun fight" may have had a stronger meaning back when it was a duel at high noon at 30 paces but in the real world the gun on your hip becomes a talisman unless you have a lot of distance between you and the attacker.
https://youtu.be/Y49rv3QBtkk

Naperville wrote: ↑

Mon Jun 17, 2019 8:48 pm

I might drop my wallet at his feet and as he bent over to pick it up, use my knife on his jugular.

HAHAH oh man, that was good for a laugh! Pretty sure that's murder in some states..

I think the most important things you can do to avoid these scenarios start before the knife is even drawn. Maintain good situational awareness, scan your surroundings, walk confidently and with purpose. If someone approaches you who looks a little shady, or like they may have ill intentions, acknowledge them.. making it known that you are distinctly aware of their presence in your personal space may dissuade them from further action.

If they do pull a knife, comply as calmly as possible, and make mental notes of as many of the distinguishing features as possible so that you are able to provide a complete and accurate a description to the police.

If it's clear that the person intends to attack you, obviously fight back, but generally in these circumstances, it is likely the mugger will run once he gets what he wants.. Your life is not worth a wallet.

I used to work in a group home for 16-21 year-old boys and many had emotional/aggression issues. Very different situation than a robbery in the street, I know.. but I've had knives and other weapons brandished in my direction on multiple occasions, and I've been involved in/witness to altercations with violent people. Part of our staff training was very basic self-defense techniques (how to break free of a chokehold, defense against biting/hair-pulling, restraints, etc). In my experience, all the tough guy/ninja moves you think you'd do in the moment tend to go right out the window as soon as these incidents jump off, and if you're lucky you can think quickly enough to resort to the most basic of training. Of course training is important, but the best defense is to be able to de-escalate a situation before it happens . Generally, everything tends to work out best when you remain as calm and level-headed as possible..

I always run across these types of conversations and I'm always surprised that no one advises getting involved with your local PD. I started going to crime watch meetings with my wife last year. I got to meet my local police officers that patrol my area. They printed out arrest reports and heat maps for me with information on what's happening in my neighborhood, places to avoid, and trending crimes. I got to ask the police officers that patrol my streets questions instead of random internet people that live in different counties, states, and countries that have wildly different laws on self defense.

1. Get involved with your local PD. I was surprised at how cool they were and how much they wanted to help. It's sad how few people attend crime watch events for their communities. The DPD brought in pizza and cokes and I got to meet a ton of neighbors(which is helpful in itself).
2. Invest in good running shoes

eRoc wrote: ↑

Tue Jun 18, 2019 8:59 am

I always run across these types of conversations and I'm always surprised that no one advises getting involved with your local PD. I started going to crime watch meetings with my wife last year. I got to meet my local police officers that patrol my area. They printed out arrest reports and heat maps for me with information on what's happening in my neighborhood, places to avoid, and trending crimes. I got to ask the police officers that patrol my streets questions instead of random internet people that live in different counties, states, and countries that have wildly different laws on self defense.

1. Get involved with your local PD. I was surprised at how cool they were and how much they wanted to help. It's sad how few people attend crime watch events for their communities. The DPD brought in pizza and cokes and I got to meet a ton of neighbors(which is helpful in itself).
2. Invest in good running shoes

I think this is excellent advice!

how has no one suggested to do a crocodile dundee yet??

Thats not a knife......