K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

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TomAiello
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby TomAiello » Sat Apr 27, 2019 3:48 pm

crazywednesday wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 2:03 pm
Like many of you, I love k390. It would be great to have a k390 fixed blade the size of the waterway or or sprig!
Yes. Yes, it would. :)

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JonLeBlanc
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby JonLeBlanc » Sat Apr 27, 2019 4:43 pm

Deadboxhero wrote:
Fri Apr 26, 2019 12:04 pm
anagarika wrote:
Fri Apr 26, 2019 11:34 am
Shawn,

You did have experience with CS BS in XHP and if I recall correctly, you had quite good impression of high sharpness edge holding it has. I found it to my liking also, opposite to S110V. How different is this P4 in K390 or how much similarities with XHP?

All these talks about it making me wanting one. Alas, currently no budget to get one. A full Seki run is going to be very tempting.
Chris they are not really comparable. I'd say that's a closer match between PSF27, CPM D2 and CPM Cruwear

The K390 has a higher obtainable hardness thanks to the drop in Cr and not being stainless. K390 has a huge volume of very fine Vanadium Carbides which are the hardest next to Niobium and K390 will be more durable at the edge than XHP yet still cut longer. I haven't found a production folder that holds the front end sharpeness as long with this much aggression.

Custom world is a different story.

I'm talking about what you can buy sub $300 production.
Hi Brown Bear, I'm very much interested in K390 because I'm a huge fan of tool steels and non-stainless steels in general. I notice your comment that K390 shares some characteristics with D2/CruWear, and while I defer to your knowledge which is doubtless greater than mine, I also note that it's composition has some differences, especially in the carbon-chromium-vanadium levels. Could you elaborate on your view that K390 is similar to D2/CruWear? Do you think it's a heat treat thing more than actual composition etc? I'm genuinely interested ;) thanks !
My collection so far: 52100 Military (2); 52100 PM2 (2); 52100 Para3; Stretch2 V-Toku; KnifeWorks M4 PM2; BentoBox M390 PM2; BentoBox S90V Military; Police4 K390; S110V PM2; SS Delica AUS-6; Wayne Goddard Sprint VG-10
Wish list: Hundred Pacer; Sliverax; Mantra; 52100 PM2 SE; Kapara

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Deadboxhero
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby Deadboxhero » Sat Apr 27, 2019 6:14 pm

JonLeBlanc wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 4:43 pm
Deadboxhero wrote:
Fri Apr 26, 2019 12:04 pm
anagarika wrote:
Fri Apr 26, 2019 11:34 am
Shawn,

You did have experience with CS BS in XHP and if I recall correctly, you had quite good impression of high sharpness edge holding it has. I found it to my liking also, opposite to S110V. How different is this P4 in K390 or how much similarities with XHP?

All these talks about it making me wanting one. Alas, currently no budget to get one. A full Seki run is going to be very tempting.
Chris they are not really comparable. I'd say that's a closer match between PSF27, CPM D2 and CPM Cruwear

The K390 has a higher obtainable hardness thanks to the drop in Cr and not being stainless. K390 has a huge volume of very fine Vanadium Carbides which are the hardest next to Niobium and K390 will be more durable at the edge than XHP yet still cut longer. I haven't found a production folder that holds the front end sharpeness as long with this much aggression.

Custom world is a different story.

I'm talking about what you can buy sub $300 production.
Hi Brown Bear, I'm very much interested in K390 because I'm a huge fan of tool steels and non-stainless steels in general. I notice your comment that K390 shares some characteristics with D2/CruWear, and while I defer to your knowledge which is doubtless greater than mine, I also note that it's composition has some differences, especially in the carbon-chromium-vanadium levels. Could you elaborate on your view that K390 is similar to D2/CruWear? Do you think it's a heat treat thing more than actual composition etc? I'm genuinely interested ;) thanks !
No, Chris was asking if it K390 was similar to XHP. I was telling him that XHP is closer to CPM D2 but stainless.

K390 is Like 10v.

The direct analog to 10v from Bohler is k294.

There are a lot of these A11 type steels from different steel companies.

They cut longer than s90v but are tougher and stronger but are not stainless.

They are surprisingly durable at the edge as well.

In situations where M4 rolls, A11 type steels will not and are more wear resistant and can operate at higher hardness and still be stable.

They're just not the most shock resistant. I find it difficult to swing a small knife like an axe for that to play a pivotal role and strength is very important for an edge to hold shape. That's not to say M4 is a great shock resistant steel either. Trade offs trade offs trade offs
Big Brown Bear
[url]https://www.youtube.com/user/shawnhouston[/ur]
Triple B Handmade Knives

The Meat man
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby The Meat man » Sat Apr 27, 2019 6:32 pm

Hey Shawn, I've been having a little difficulty in getting my P4 as sharp as I wanted it to be. This thread inspired me to sit down and give it another go.

Image


It's not perfect but it's better than I've ever gotten it so far. Thanks. ;)
I should use this knife more.
- Connor

Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." (John 14:6)

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Deadboxhero
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby Deadboxhero » Sat Apr 27, 2019 6:42 pm

The Meat man wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 6:32 pm
Hey Shawn, I've been having a little difficulty in getting my P4 as sharp as I wanted it to be. This thread inspired me to sit down and give it another go.

Image


It's not perfect but it's better than I've ever gotten it so far. Thanks. ;)
I should use this knife more.
Nice looking edge brother.

Love how the patina is developing naturally man.
Big Brown Bear
[url]https://www.youtube.com/user/shawnhouston[/ur]
Triple B Handmade Knives

The Meat man
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby The Meat man » Sat Apr 27, 2019 6:57 pm

Deadboxhero wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 6:42 pm
The Meat man wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 6:32 pm
Hey Shawn, I've been having a little difficulty in getting my P4 as sharp as I wanted it to be. This thread inspired me to sit down and give it another go.

It's not perfect but it's better than I've ever gotten it so far. Thanks. ;)
I should use this knife more.
Nice looking edge brother.

Love how the patina is developing naturally man.
Thanks! It can just so whittle free hanging hair. I've gotten it close to that level before but always with a microbevel, and I like to avoid using microbevels if at all possible.

Yeah I like that faint golden sheen. I think that came mostly from slicing tomatoes.
- Connor

Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." (John 14:6)

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JonLeBlanc
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby JonLeBlanc » Sat Apr 27, 2019 7:46 pm

Deadboxhero wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 6:14 pm
JonLeBlanc wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 4:43 pm
Deadboxhero wrote:
Fri Apr 26, 2019 12:04 pm
anagarika wrote:
Fri Apr 26, 2019 11:34 am
Shawn,

You did have experience with CS BS in XHP and if I recall correctly, you had quite good impression of high sharpness edge holding it has. I found it to my liking also, opposite to S110V. How different is this P4 in K390 or how much similarities with XHP?

All these talks about it making me wanting one. Alas, currently no budget to get one. A full Seki run is going to be very tempting.
Chris they are not really comparable. I'd say that's a closer match between PSF27, CPM D2 and CPM Cruwear

The K390 has a higher obtainable hardness thanks to the drop in Cr and not being stainless. K390 has a huge volume of very fine Vanadium Carbides which are the hardest next to Niobium and K390 will be more durable at the edge than XHP yet still cut longer. I haven't found a production folder that holds the front end sharpeness as long with this much aggression.

Custom world is a different story.

I'm talking about what you can buy sub $300 production.
Hi Brown Bear, I'm very much interested in K390 because I'm a huge fan of tool steels and non-stainless steels in general. I notice your comment that K390 shares some characteristics with D2/CruWear, and while I defer to your knowledge which is doubtless greater than mine, I also note that it's composition has some differences, especially in the carbon-chromium-vanadium levels. Could you elaborate on your view that K390 is similar to D2/CruWear? Do you think it's a heat treat thing more than actual composition etc? I'm genuinely interested ;) thanks !
No, Chris was asking if it K390 was similar to XHP. I was telling him that XHP is closer to CPM D2 but stainless.

K390 is Like 10v.

The direct analog to 10v from Bohler is k294.

There are a lot of these A11 type steels from different steel companies.

They cut longer than s90v but are tougher and stronger but are not stainless.

They are surprisingly durable at the edge as well.

In situations where M4 rolls, A11 type steels will not and are more wear resistant and can operate at higher hardness and still be stable.

They're just not the most shock resistant. I find it difficult to swing a small knife like an axe for that to play a pivotal role and strength is very important for an edge to hold shape. That's not to say M4 is a great shock resistant steel either. Trade offs trade offs trade offs
Oh I see, I must've misread, but thanks for the info, that clears some things up.
My collection so far: 52100 Military (2); 52100 PM2 (2); 52100 Para3; Stretch2 V-Toku; KnifeWorks M4 PM2; BentoBox M390 PM2; BentoBox S90V Military; Police4 K390; S110V PM2; SS Delica AUS-6; Wayne Goddard Sprint VG-10
Wish list: Hundred Pacer; Sliverax; Mantra; 52100 PM2 SE; Kapara

GarageBoy
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby GarageBoy » Sat Apr 27, 2019 8:59 pm

Yeah, why is the mule not sold out? Come on Spyderco forum, we're better than that

DukeNiemand
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby DukeNiemand » Sat Apr 27, 2019 9:30 pm

This thread has given me the itch to play with some A11 class steels. Just ordered a Mule team 26 :)

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Tucson Tom
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby Tucson Tom » Sat Apr 27, 2019 10:03 pm

GarageBoy wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 8:59 pm
Yeah, why is the mule not sold out? Come on Spyderco forum, we're better than that
I did my part and bought several.

I presume you are talking about the PM A11 blades. Great stuff. Almost K390, same as 10V as near as I can tell. Holds an edge pretty much forever.

I don't know what is up with all the slackers on the forum. I guess they got burned out on the mule project, which is too bad.

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anagarika
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby anagarika » Sat Apr 27, 2019 11:53 pm

Shawn,

My only experience with D2 was a BM HK which lost the high sharpness quickly to working edge and Luong’s K110 which is better (but I haven’t compared it to the CS XHP). The XHP however, holds the high sharpness better than BM HK and easily brought back. It also doesn’t suffer from losing the edge while being carried unused like VG10. This is from sharpening myself, and use case is shaving.

Sorry for the OT, just wanted to clarify what intrigues me when you said K390 has so much potential for high sharpness edge holding. Again, thanks for explaining. 👍🏻
Chris :spyder:

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ferider
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby ferider » Sun Apr 28, 2019 9:20 am

Tucson Tom wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 10:03 pm
GarageBoy wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 8:59 pm
Yeah, why is the mule not sold out? Come on Spyderco forum, we're better than that

I did my part and bought several.


I presume you are talking about the PM A11 blades. Great stuff. Almost K390, same as 10V as near as I can tell. Holds an edge pretty much forever.

I don't know what is up with all the slackers on the forum. I guess they got burned out on the mule project, which is too bad.
Me too. Hard to believe that of all Mules, A11 and PD#1 (basically = CPM Cruwear) are still available. My two favorites right there.

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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby steelcity16 » Sun Apr 28, 2019 10:18 am

Tucson Tom wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 10:03 pm
GarageBoy wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 8:59 pm
Yeah, why is the mule not sold out? Come on Spyderco forum, we're better than that

I don't know what is up with all the slackers on the forum. I guess they got burned out on the mule project, which is too bad.

I would be all for a folding mule platform and would buy every one. Just use something existing like the Para 3 LW (I would say Manix LW is a good option as well if they CQI it to screw construction) and use white FRN as the scale to differentiate it as a "mule". I think a lot of people just don't have the opportunity to carry and use a fixed blade that often. A small folder is much easier to have on you at all times.
:spyder: CRU-CARTA THEM ALL! :spyder:

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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby Woodpuppy » Sun Apr 28, 2019 6:37 pm

ferider wrote:
Sun Apr 28, 2019 9:20 am
Tucson Tom wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 10:03 pm
GarageBoy wrote:
Sat Apr 27, 2019 8:59 pm
Yeah, why is the mule not sold out? Come on Spyderco forum, we're better than that

I did my part and bought several.


I presume you are talking about the PM A11 blades. Great stuff. Almost K390, same as 10V as near as I can tell. Holds an edge pretty much forever.

I don't know what is up with all the slackers on the forum. I guess they got burned out on the mule project, which is too bad.
Me too. Hard to believe that of all Mules, A11 and PD#1 (basically = CPM Cruwear) are still available. My two favorites right there.
Drooling on spyderco website now...
:spyder: My other blade is a Kelly Perfect :spyder:

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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby TomAiello » Sun Apr 28, 2019 7:54 pm

steelcity16 wrote:
Sun Apr 28, 2019 10:18 am
I would be all for a folding mule platform and would buy every one. Just use something existing like the Para 3 LW (I would say Manix LW is a good option as well if they CQI it to screw construction) and use white FRN as the scale to differentiate it as a "mule". I think a lot of people just don't have the opportunity to carry and use a fixed blade that often. A small folder is much easier to have on you at all times.
I agree.

But I think that the UKPK would be a better platform, because it would give members in more restrictive jurisdictions a better chance to play too. Tons of people in europe can't carry a Para 3 (or fixed blade) and would be interested in a UKPK style "mule" project.

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Brock O Lee
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby Brock O Lee » Sun Apr 28, 2019 8:50 pm

+1 for UKPK, +100 for the new G10 version!
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Favourites at the moment: Military 204P, Spydiechef, Sage 2, Pits, Heinnie UKPK, Native Cruwear, Chaparral Ti

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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby jpm2 » Mon Apr 29, 2019 4:37 pm

TomAiello wrote:
Sun Apr 28, 2019 7:54 pm
steelcity16 wrote:
Sun Apr 28, 2019 10:18 am
I would be all for a folding mule platform and would buy every one. Just use something existing like the Para 3 LW (I would say Manix LW is a good option as well if they CQI it to screw construction) and use white FRN as the scale to differentiate it as a "mule". I think a lot of people just don't have the opportunity to carry and use a fixed blade that often. A small folder is much easier to have on you at all times.
I agree.

But I think that the UKPK would be a better platform, because it would give members in more restrictive jurisdictions a better chance to play too. Tons of people in europe can't carry a Para 3 (or fixed blade) and would be interested in a UKPK style "mule" project.
I agree with UKPK or Urban as a folding mule.
If it had to be locking, I think a LW backlock would appeal to a broader audience than other style locks.

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Donut
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby Donut » Mon Apr 29, 2019 5:58 pm

I would say that K390 is a good friend of M4 and they have a good time competing with each other. :p
-Brian
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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby marty_bill_ » Mon Apr 29, 2019 6:10 pm

My P4 showed up today and is just laser sharp! Really looking forward to trying the K390. Thanks to Shawn for pushing this topic and talking me into this.

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Re: K390 IS "The M4 Killer"

Postby The Meat man » Mon Apr 29, 2019 8:45 pm

marty_bill_ wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 6:10 pm
My P4 showed up today and is just laser sharp! Really looking forward to trying the K390. Thanks to Shawn for pushing this topic and talking me into this.

I wonder how many Police 4 knives have been sold so far by Deadboxhero and Vivi... :D
- Connor

Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." (John 14:6)


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