Advantages of 4 " (plus) blades?

[cycleguy]

My EDC knives are plain edge Delica 4, UK Penknife, BM Bugout, and stockman folder ... these are my sweet-spot for my EDC needs. A Stretch will work but is approaching being on the too long/big side, and a Chaparral will work but is approaching being on the too short/small side.

Don't think this came up in the discussion, but if I was to do a combo edge ... I would be looking for approx 1.5" serrated section and approx 2.5" plain edge section as minimums. This would put me in the 4" plus range for blade requirement.

CG

[Wartstein]

Amazing! First of all, once again, Wartstein my friend, you prove to be a great thinker and knife user. I am very glad to read this topic thread and I am very glad you made it, thank you.

My answer is similiar in some respects to others. At least for me, I have found that the "ideal" knife blade length is in the 3 to 4 inch range. While I understand and respect the use of knives with blade lengths below three inches, and above four inches, I believe there is not only a practical, but a deep "mathematically mystical sweet spot" for knife blades being within the 3-4 inch range. I know that may sound strange and I do not want to get into the particulars of why I believe that to be so, but, I also see the uses for knives with blades larger than four inches.

SEF, thank you very much, I absolutely do appreciate if you find something usefull and interesting for you in my posts and threads, no question!! :)
But to be honest, you are too kind and giving me way too much credit..
I am a "knife user", that´s right for sure in the true sense of the words. I am using practically all of my (not too many) knives in varying tasks and the (quite little) I know about knives and feel entitled to give an opinion on, is based on that.
And, like most people on this forum, I am a "thinker" in that I think about knives and am interested in and fascinated by them. But: I really don´t feel like I´d be a "great thinker" ... unless we ALL on this forum are "great thinkers" when it comes to knives! Let´s agree on that, ok? :)

So, thanks again, "also-great-thinker-SEF"

/ I´d definitely be interested in your "mathematical-mystical-sweetspot"-theorie...

[BigKenbo]

I dont really believe in knives for SD, still i like to EDC larger knives (Military etc.). And yes, some food prep and whittling is easier, but thats not the only aspect. It comes down to ergonomics and handle size: i’m most comfortable with handles 5 1/4 “ and up, and like to have a proportional blade. For example, i feel a Manix XL to be more comfortable than an Endura, while the Endura actually has a longer cutting edge.

Roland.

I have XL hands myself. I just havent been able to find a manix xl to put my mitts on yet. I appreciate your perspective.

[BigKenbo]

Stimulated by some recent posts and discussions I´d like to adress a question to all of you who like to carry folders with blades of 4 inches or longer:

What are the actual advantages of such a long blade in various EDC-scenarios compared to a not short, but around 3.5 to 3.8 blade ?

Let me specify my question:

I came to prefer a quite narrow range when it comes to length of the actual EDGE (so not blade) of my main EDC knives, and that would between 8 and 9 cm. ( about between 3.1 and 3.5 in inches) of EDGE, normally that means 3.5 to 3.8 overall BLADE length. (for reference: That's the PM2 to Endura size range)

Anything noticeable shorter has its limits when it comes to for example minor food prep on the road, or generally in many cutting tests really.

But anything LONGER (so 4 " and more) does not give me personally really even more benefit, tends to get a little long in the pocket and a little less good for finer tip work and the like.

That´s just my personal preference and opinion of course, and I am aware of that many even think, a 3.5 to 3.8 blade is unnecessarely LONG for a regular EDC-knife.

Still ,I´d really appreciate the input of you out there who like to regularely carry even longer blades than I do!

I am pretty much in the same boat as you. I carry my Natives or Chap LW for EDC and only really feel lacking for blade length when it comes to food like out at a restaurant that may not have knives and I need to cut things up for my kids. These knives get the job done, but a little longer blade is easier to use on food in a lot of cases. That is why I carry a PE Pacific Salt in my briefcase for use at the office in cutting up my lunch. The extra length is nice in that regard.

I agree about not liking to carry longer blades in my pocket and generally prefer a shorter blade. In the kitchen I do however do 90% of my cutting with an 8" chefs knife.

I do like and use longer blades around the house and outdoors like a SE Pacific Salt and Military. I just don't like to carry them as they aren't as comfortable for me.

Thanks for your reply! As said, I actually DO like longer blades and carry such most of the times (Endura has the perfect blade length for me), but not what I consider REALLY long blades (Police...)

Native would definitely be to small for my regular EDC.

As a possible alternative, carry two or even more lol! I love the natives for finer point work, but usually gravitate to longer blades generally, so i carry both, and frequently more besides. I just HATE wishing i had something on me that i dont. Normal day off work you will find a native LF an endura in RF any of a variety of O1 or A2 fixed blades on my belt and likely another endura in my right boot. Variable would be my Smith 629 L-comp, but thats an entire other forum!

[vivi]

I dont really believe in knives for SD, still i like to EDC larger knives (Military etc.). And yes, some food prep and whittling is easier, but thats not the only aspect. It comes down to ergonomics and handle size: i’m most comfortable with handles 5 1/4 “ and up, and like to have a proportional blade. For example, i feel a Manix XL to be more comfortable than an Endura, while the Endura actually has a longer cutting edge.

Roland.

I have XL hands myself. I just havent been able to find a manix xl to put my mitts on yet. I appreciate your perspective.

XL-XXL here. It's an incredibly comfortable knife for me. I'm carrying mine today in fact.

You can find the XL under $95 on the secondary market very easily.

[BigKenbo]

Amazing! First of all, once again, Wartstein my friend, you prove to be a great thinker and knife user. I am very glad to read this topic thread and I am very glad you made it, thank you.

My answer is similiar in some respects to others. At least for me, I have found that the "ideal" knife blade length is in the 3 to 4 inch range. While I understand and respect the use of knives with blade lengths below three inches, and above four inches, I believe there is not only a practical, but a deep "mathematically mystical sweet spot" for knife blades being within the 3-4 inch range. I know that may sound strange and I do not want to get into the particulars of why I believe that to be so, but, I also see the uses for knives with blades larger than four inches.

doesnt sound strange to me. I totally hear you! As some of our friends have mentioned it probably is as much handle size aa actual blade length, but i actually totally got what you were alluding to!

[Wartstein]

You can find the XL under $95 on the secondary market very easily.

Thanks, that´s good news and info for me too. I´ve been eyeballing the Manix XL for quite a while now. What I did not like in the regular Manix, was the relatively small amount of actual edge you get for the overall package. As far as I understand, that is not the case with the XL, since the choils of the "regular" and the "XL" are of the same size (= sacrifice the same amount of edgelength), so proportionally or in percentage the XL should have MORE edge compared to the overall blade length, am I right?

What I really DID like in the Manix was the BBL. Maybe my second favorite after a good backlock, but I had my Manix lw not long enough to really give a final opinion.

[vivi]

You can find the XL under $95 on the secondary market very easily.

Thanks, that´s good news and info for me too. I´ve been eyeballing the Manix XL for quite a while now. What I did not like in the regular Manix, was the relatively small amount of actual edge you get for the overall package. As far as I understand, that is not the case with the XL, since the choils of the "regular" and the "XL" are of the same size (= sacrifice the same amount of edgelength), so proportionally or in percentage the XL should have MORE edge compared to the overall blade length, am I right?

What I really DID like in the Manix was the BBL. Maybe my second favorite after a good backlock, but I had my Manix lw not long enough to really give a final opinion.

I'm with you on both counts. CBBL is my second favorite lock from Spyderco, though I want to try the stop lock and power lock still.

The mini Manix (That's what the Manix 2 is, a mini version) always felt too small to me as well. The cutting edge feels way too short for how bulky the handle is. I also missed the pinky hook, as that extreme grip security it offers is a defining feature of the Manix to me.

The cutting edge on the Manix XL / C95 has never felt lacking to me. It does not have an exceptional cutting edge to handle ratio, but I'm less concerned with ratios compared to "Does the handle offer a full grip? Does the blade do the things I want?"

I've never liked the mini Manix / Manix 2. It feels like trying to make a mini hummer or mini deagle. Some things are meant to be big. Some things don't scale down well in size. Manix is one of them. If you want a 3" blade you're better off with a design that started with a 3" blade from the ground up IMO.

Obviously a lot of folks feel differently looking at the number of sprints each version gets :)

[Wartstein]

You can find the XL under $95 on the secondary market very easily.

Thanks, that´s good news and info for me too. I´ve been eyeballing the Manix XL for quite a while now. What I did not like in the regular Manix, was the relatively small amount of actual edge you get for the overall package. As far as I understand, that is not the case with the XL, since the choils of the "regular" and the "XL" are of the same size (= sacrifice the same amount of edgelength), so proportionally or in percentage the XL should have MORE edge compared to the overall blade length, am I right?

What I really DID like in the Manix was the BBL. Maybe my second favorite after a good backlock, but I had my Manix lw not long enough to really give a final opinion.

I'm with you on both counts. CBBL is my second favorite lock from Spyderco, though I want to try the stop lock and power lock still.

The mini Manix (That's what the Manix 2 is, a mini version) always felt too small to me as well. The cutting edge feels way too short for how bulky the handle is. I also missed the pinky hook, as that extreme grip security it offers is a defining feature of the Manix to me.

The cutting edge on the Manix XL / C95 has never felt lacking to me. It does not have an exceptional cutting edge to handle ratio, but I'm less concerned with ratios compared to "Does the handle offer a full grip? Does the blade do the things I want?"

I've never liked the mini Manix / Manix 2. It feels like trying to make a mini hummer or mini deagle. Some things are meant to be big. Some things don't scale down well in size. Manix is one of them. If you want a 3" blade you're better off with a design that started with a 3" blade from the ground up IMO.

Obviously a lot of folks feel differently looking at the number of sprints each version gets :)

Don´t want to turn this into a "Manix-thread" , but a bit off topic sure is ok (after all it was me who started the thread... ) :

I just did fresh up my "Manix-knowledge" via the Spyderco-page. The original Manix (discontinued of course) looks very good at first glance: long enough blade/egde, backlock (which I definitely like the most, while I just can remember that I liked the BBL very much while I had my Manix) are great features.
But then I saw that it was (is) really quite heavy and had (has) a massive (imho unnecessarely thick) 4mm bladestock.
If they brought that model back with a 3 mm blade and maybe linerless or made lighter in another way, it would sure be a knife I´d really want.

[Wartstein]

Just my opinion my friend, but the main reason is under 4 inches may not be long enough to reach a vital organ in a SD scenario. If you are attempting to incapacitate an assailant, a longer blade capable of reaching the heart diaghram or liver while going the long way, may be the difference between success or failure, which is to say living or dieing. Most certainly longer folders are uncomfortable and often inconvenient to carry, but i frequesntly carry a 6.5 inch fixed blade, for the aforementioned reasons.

Sure, in an SD scenario a long blade will most likely be advantageous, and you are describing very well why that is.

But to be honest, thats´s something I never think of at all when choosing a knife. I sure feel, that clearly everyone including myself has the right to defend their lifes utilizing anything that could serve as a weapon, and to be actively prepared for that is not a bad idea.

It´s a bit off topic, but anyway: I guess I am living in a (still) very safe area, and honestly I probably am looking a bit like a guy most people would think twice before attacking (don´t want to boast in any way, but I happen to be quite large, not too weak from all the climbing and mountain sports I do, most of the times I am unshaved or bearded and have some scratches or bruises on me (from climbing, not fighting of course... ) - I guess that can be intimidating... (not to forget the VERY SCARY pocket clip that´s always to be seen on me... :D )

The few fights I had (long ago, when I was young and more hot blooded... ) were all fought quite "fair" and solely fist/bare hand fights; So I guess if someone attacked me in order to really harm or kill me, I´d realize that too late to be able to reach for my knife. I´d probably reckon much too long that this will become another comparatively benign fist fight...

And, last point: I actually think it is very hard to stab or even slice an opponent from a psychological point of view if one is not trained for that. I am quite sure it is much easier to bring oneself to shoot someone or beat him up even in a life and death situation (in any other situation I would never do that anyway...)

[BigKenbo]

I dont really believe in knives for SD, still i like to EDC larger knives (Military etc.). And yes, some food prep and whittling is easier, but thats not the only aspect. It comes down to ergonomics and handle size: i’m most comfortable with handles 5 1/4 “ and up, and like to have a proportional blade. For example, i feel a Manix XL to be more comfortable than an Endura, while the Endura actually has a longer cutting edge.

Roland.

I have XL hands myself. I just havent been able to find a manix xl to put my mitts on yet. I appreciate your perspective.

XL-XXL here. It's an incredibly comfortable knife for me. I'm carrying mine today in fact.

You can find the XL under $95 on the secondary market very easily.

Thank you sincerely for the input!

[BigKenbo]

Just my opinion my friend, but the main reason is under 4 inches may not be long enough to reach a vital organ in a SD scenario. If you are attempting to incapacitate an assailant, a longer blade capable of reaching the heart diaghram or liver while going the long way, may be the difference between success or failure, which is to say living or dieing. Most certainly longer folders are uncomfortable and often inconvenient to carry, but i frequesntly carry a 6.5 inch fixed blade, for the aforementioned reasons.

Sure, in an SD scenario a long blade will most likely be advantageous, and you are describing very well why that is.

But to be honest, thats´s something I never think of at all when choosing a knife. I sure feel, that clearly everyone including myself has the right to defend their lifes utilizing anything that could serve as a weapon, and to be actively prepared for that is not a bad idea.

It´s a bit off topic, but anyway: I guess I am living in a (still) very safe area, and honestly I probably am looking a bit like a guy most people would think twice before attacking (don´t want to boast in any way, but I happen to be quite large, not too weak from all the climbing and mountain sports I do, most of the times I am unshaved or bearded and have some scratches or bruises on me (from climbing, not fighting of course... ) - I guess that can be intimidating... (not to forget the VERY SCARY pocket clip that´s always to be seen on me... :D )

The few fights I had (long ago, when I was young and more hot blooded... ) were all fought quite "fair" and solely fist/bare hand fights; So I guess if someone attacked me in order to really harm or kill me, I´d realize that too late to be able to reach for my knife. I´d probably reckon much too long that this will become another comparatively benign fist fight...

And, last point: I actually think it is very hard to stab or even slice an opponent from a psychological point of view if one is not trained for that. I am quite sure it is much easier to bring oneself to shoot someone or beat him up even in a life and death situation (in any other situation I would never do that anyway...)

They started training me to kill with a knife in boot camp in 1985. So i probably over-emphasize that in my edc. I live in the hills of Eastern Oklahoma, and between the abundant dangerous animals and the methamphetamine users, i try to stay as prepared as possible lol! When i mention larger A2 and O1 fixed blades n my posts the bears mountain lions and pigs around here are why they are important to have. (Also why i occasionally mention a firearm.) And i have had to defend myself against aggressive animals on several occasions. God willing i will never again have to take weapon in hand against another human. Be blessed.

[SpyderEdgeForever]

Amazing! First of all, once again, Wartstein my friend, you prove to be a great thinker and knife user. I am very glad to read this topic thread and I am very glad you made it, thank you.

My answer is similiar in some respects to others. At least for me, I have found that the "ideal" knife blade length is in the 3 to 4 inch range. While I understand and respect the use of knives with blade lengths below three inches, and above four inches, I believe there is not only a practical, but a deep "mathematically mystical sweet spot" for knife blades being within the 3-4 inch range. I know that may sound strange and I do not want to get into the particulars of why I believe that to be so, but, I also see the uses for knives with blades larger than four inches.

doesnt sound strange to me. I totally hear you! As some of our friends have mentioned it probably is as much handle size aa actual blade length, but i actually totally got what you were alluding to!

Thank you for your understanding and acknowledgement!

[Tucson Tom]

So, why carry a Military or a Police 4? To be honest I am not usually hankering for the big blade. I find that the 3.3 inch blade length (or whatever it is) of the PM2 or Manix hits the sweet spot for my uses. What I like about the 4 inch knives is the handle. I appreciate having something to hold on to that fits my hand nicely.

Of course a big blade is always good for frightening dogs and children.

[Marulaghost]

So, why carry a Military or a Police 4? To be honest I am not usually hankering for the big blade. I find that the 3.3 inch blade length (or whatever it is) of the PM2 or Manix hits the sweet spot for my uses. What I like about the 4 inch knives is the handle. I appreciate having something to hold on to that fits my hand nicely.

Of course a big blade is always good for frightening dogs and children.

Can't go about without seeing fear in the eyes of our youth now....

[vivi]

So, why carry a Military or a Police 4? To be honest I am not usually hankering for the big blade. I find that the 3.3 inch blade length (or whatever it is) of the PM2 or Manix hits the sweet spot for my uses. What I like about the 4 inch knives is the handle. I appreciate having something to hold on to that fits my hand nicely.

Of course a big blade is always good for frightening dogs and children.

I spent a lot of time with both the Para 2 and Police. I loved the Para 2 for days when I knew the cutting I'd be doing would be tip intensive, like cutting the thick tape on boxes when helping a friend move. But I missed the extra cutting edge during general work.

I try to keep a small pair of scissors on me. Leatherman Wave or Micra. Comes in handy when you want to be discrete.

[ZrowsN1s]

For sure it helps to carry a smaller "discrete" knife if your main carry is something on the larger side. But I feel the same way about my 3inch knives. If Im somewhere I wouldn't take out a 4" blade, I'm not likely to take out the 3" either. Dragonflys are your friend :D

[vivi]

To be honest I can't remember the last time I needed to cut something and felt like I couldn't use my 4"+ folder. But it's nice having the keychain scissor option just in case. Plus they're pretty handy for certain things.

[Pelagic]

Vivi brought up good points.

In my irrelevant experience, cutting extra thick rope essentially requires a blade the size of an Endura or larger. And I also cannot stress how convenient larger handles are for extended use (especially with gloves).

[Doeswhateveraspidercan]

The primary greatest advantage I have discovered beyond food prep is keeping ones hands out of the material being cut especially on large boxes.

Some of those edges created on cardboard, that get created while cutting it and breaking it down are as sharp as a knife and will cut the heck out of you. Shorter blades also run out of blade before you run out of material requiring more slices.

A smaller blade can do everything a larger blade can with more effort and angles of attack. A larger blade can do the same things a smaller blade can with less effort and fewer angles of attack required.

A smaller blade will conform to legalities where a 4 inch or more will not.

A smaller blade will draw less attention where a 4 inch or more will gain more.

Discreet usage can easily be achieved with a 4 inch or larger blade just do your cutting when others are not next to you, trust me people are far more interested in what is going on in their own heads than what anyone else is doing and generally speaking the best way to get left alone is to be busy working. :)

Larger handles = more comfort.

Ultimately what you use has to feel right to you. I own blades from a leather-man Micra all the way up to the Police models Hundred Pacer and Military the larger blades just feel right.

The Stretch is close to the slicing cutting ability of a Military and on the super thin side the new Ikuchi gets close also but nothing ever takes the place of a Military.