What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
I only own a Para 3 in CPM Cruwear. It is a favorite, but I think either the grey g10 Manix 2 or grey g10 PM2 could easily have become my favorite. I hadn't been bitten yet when those were released.
I hope for a CPM Cruwear Manix LW and eagerly await the micarta Shaman with CPM Cruwear.
I hope for a CPM Cruwear Manix LW and eagerly await the micarta Shaman with CPM Cruwear.
Have: old S30V Native, HAP40 Endura, ZDP DF2, S110V Manix LW, Cru-wear Para 3, SE H1 DF2, S90V Native 5, K390 Urban, SE Pac Salt, P.I.T.S., XHP Manix LW, SB Caly 3, B70P, PMA11, K03, Kapara, REX 45 Military, 154CM Manix LW, Swick, AEB-L Urban, KC Cruwear Manix, M390 PM2, Mantra 2, CruCarta Shaman, M390 Manix, K390 Police 4, S90V Manix LW, Rex 45 Manix LW, 20CV Manix, Rex 45 Lil’Native, Shaman, C208GP, Cruwear Manix, Cruwear Manix, M4 Chief, Z-max!!!
Want: SPY27, K490, Swick 5.
Want: SPY27, K490, Swick 5.
Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
This was my introduction to Spyderco and Cruwear!
If you're wielding the sharpest tool in the shed, who's going to say that you aren't...?
- RadioactiveSpyder
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Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
This was my heaviest use Military until I recently sold it (to buy a different Military! )
The original light gray scales were swapped onto a DLC S30V Millie and that was also a really sharp-looking knife (and sold eons ago). The checkered light gray G10 on the Cruwear Manix is really nice as well, thought we’d see just a bit more of stuff like that (patterned G10) out of Golden but it seems they dropped that style.
The original light gray scales were swapped onto a DLC S30V Millie and that was also a really sharp-looking knife (and sold eons ago). The checkered light gray G10 on the Cruwear Manix is really nice as well, thought we’d see just a bit more of stuff like that (patterned G10) out of Golden but it seems they dropped that style.
It's better to be good than evil, but one achieves goodness at a terrific cost. ––– Stephen King
Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
Hands down, Manix KC exclusive. My most carried Manix out of my 6 variations of the model I own (until the Fradon Lock exclusive hit the scene), and probably my most carried :spyder: . one of the few I've ever bought a backup of... 2 backups actually. :o
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Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
Ok went to the safe deposit box and liberated the Safe Queen in CPM Cruwear will EDC this for a while and get a feel for the factory edge which is razor sharp.
Something I noticed the shoulder where the bevel becomes flats is very subdued and not pronounced, this can be felt with my thumbnail. I compared this fresh factory edge to a CPM S30V Military and the cutting difference is very noticeable this is a sharper steel fresh from the factory.
In the second picture you can see how the Ikuchi has very short steep bevels and the Military has wider more gradual bevels with less of an abrupt step transition to the flats.
I am thinking of getting rid of these step transitions to the flats as I have noticed on other knives this does influence how easily they slice the Spydiechef has a notoriously short bevel and does not cut as well as it should.
What happens is the material being sliced encounters a step going to the flats of the blade and hangs there causing resistance and snagging.
Something I noticed the shoulder where the bevel becomes flats is very subdued and not pronounced, this can be felt with my thumbnail. I compared this fresh factory edge to a CPM S30V Military and the cutting difference is very noticeable this is a sharper steel fresh from the factory.
In the second picture you can see how the Ikuchi has very short steep bevels and the Military has wider more gradual bevels with less of an abrupt step transition to the flats.
I am thinking of getting rid of these step transitions to the flats as I have noticed on other knives this does influence how easily they slice the Spydiechef has a notoriously short bevel and does not cut as well as it should.
What happens is the material being sliced encounters a step going to the flats of the blade and hangs there causing resistance and snagging.
Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
ive put blurple scales onto my PM2 Cru - best combo ever!!
Andy
Necker - Ladybug Hawkbill Salt
Mon-Fri - Delica4 in Cruwear
Sat-Sun - Para3 in Cruwear
Urban K390 (2.61"), Bow River (for slicing jerky)
Want to try- PM2 CF M4 OR Cruwear , GB2, Bradley Bowie
Gone - Delica ZDP189, PM2 Cruwear, Para3 LW BD1N, Para3 S30V, Junction, Ti UKPK
Necker - Ladybug Hawkbill Salt
Mon-Fri - Delica4 in Cruwear
Sat-Sun - Para3 in Cruwear
Urban K390 (2.61"), Bow River (for slicing jerky)
Want to try- PM2 CF M4 OR Cruwear , GB2, Bradley Bowie
Gone - Delica ZDP189, PM2 Cruwear, Para3 LW BD1N, Para3 S30V, Junction, Ti UKPK
Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
Manix 2 and Military are my favorites. I consider the Manix 2 to be a tough work knife, and I likt to think the toughness of Cruwear when I see the long blade of the Military.
Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
G10 Native 5.
Well at least it would be if they'd make the darn thing.
Well at least it would be if they'd make the darn thing.
Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
I dig that knife! Must have been late to the party. When was that a KC exclusive?Lumpy620 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 11, 2019 10:08 am1554998704355619483245348822334.jpg
Hands down, Manix KC exclusive. My most carried Manix out of my 6 variations of the model I own (until the Fradon Lock exclusive hit the scene), and probably my most carried :spyder: . one of the few I've ever bought a backup of... 2 backups actually. :o
15 's in 10 different steels
1 - Bradford Guardian 3 / Vanadis 4E Wharnie
1 - Monterey Bay Knives Slayback Flipper / ZDP 189
1 - CRK Small Sebenza 31/Macassar Ebony Inlays
1 - CRK Large Inkosi Insingo/ Black Micarta Inlays
1 - CRK Small Sebenza 31 Insingo/Magnacut
-Rick
1 - Bradford Guardian 3 / Vanadis 4E Wharnie
1 - Monterey Bay Knives Slayback Flipper / ZDP 189
1 - CRK Small Sebenza 31/Macassar Ebony Inlays
1 - CRK Large Inkosi Insingo/ Black Micarta Inlays
1 - CRK Small Sebenza 31 Insingo/Magnacut
-Rick
- youmakemehole
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Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
Apparently there is one source that rates the peel ply CruWear at 61-63HRC, a point or two higher than the norm. I have this theory that the peel ply CF is a material reserved only for what Spyderco considers to be their very best steels that have also gone through the best possible heat treatments. A couple other steels wearing their peel ply CF such as 51200 and 154/S90V have been reported by this source to be higher than typical as well, if I remember right they were both also said to be 61-63HRC. Nothing to compare 52100 to as far as Spyderco models, but 63 HRC is pretty hard for a simple carbon steel, and S90V typically runs at 59-61 HRC.
"Sometimes I think that we're all little kids trying to act like grown ups, in our parents clothes. "
-sal
-sal
- Cambertree
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Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
This one for me:
Actually, I only own two, and the KC PM2 is still waiting to be thinned out behind the edge and used, so the Manix wins by default. :)
Actually, I only own two, and the KC PM2 is still waiting to be thinned out behind the edge and used, so the Manix wins by default. :)
- Spydersense
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Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
Para 3 all the way! I guess it has to be though, since it's the only Cruwear I currently own.
Time for another :spyder:!
-Matt
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Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
Sounds like a fun legend but Sal always says Spyderco Heat Treats go by the book according to the steels manufacturer, so gotta go aight he master on this.youmakemehole wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 1:16 amApparently there is one source that rates the peel ply CruWear at 61-63HRC, a point or two higher than the norm. I have this theory that the peel ply CF is a material reserved only for what Spyderco considers to be their very best steels that have also gone through the best possible heat treatments. A couple other steels wearing their peel ply CF such as 51200 and 154/S90V have been reported by this source to be higher than typical as well, if I remember right they were both also said to be 61-63HRC. Nothing to compare 52100 to as far as Spyderco models, but 63 HRC is pretty hard for a simple carbon steel, and S90V typically runs at 59-61 HRC.
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Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
Doeswhateveraspidercan wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 8:37 pmSounds like a fun legend but Sal always says Spyderco Heat Treats go by the book according to the steels manufacturer, so gotta go aight he master on this.youmakemehole wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 1:16 amApparently there is one source that rates the peel ply CruWear at 61-63HRC, a point or two higher than the norm. I have this theory that the peel ply CF is a material reserved only for what Spyderco considers to be their very best steels that have also gone through the best possible heat treatments. A couple other steels wearing their peel ply CF such as 51200 and 154/S90V have been reported by this source to be higher than typical as well, if I remember right they were both also said to be 61-63HRC. Nothing to compare 52100 to as far as Spyderco models, but 63 HRC is pretty hard for a simple carbon steel, and S90V typically runs at 59-61 HRC.
That may be where they start but I'll bet they do their own experimenting and CQI with HT. I can't imagine Spyderco not tweaking and experimenting with manufacturer's recommendations.
- Connor
"What is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?"
"What is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?"
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Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
I too like to think this way also but Sal is a very straight forward no nonsense type of guy if he says it I believe I can trust his word to be the final authority on all things Spyderco.The Meat man wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 8:50 pmDoeswhateveraspidercan wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 8:37 pmSounds like a fun legend but Sal always says Spyderco Heat Treats go by the book according to the steels manufacturer, so gotta go aight he master on this.youmakemehole wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 1:16 amApparently there is one source that rates the peel ply CruWear at 61-63HRC, a point or two higher than the norm. I have this theory that the peel ply CF is a material reserved only for what Spyderco considers to be their very best steels that have also gone through the best possible heat treatments. A couple other steels wearing their peel ply CF such as 51200 and 154/S90V have been reported by this source to be higher than typical as well, if I remember right they were both also said to be 61-63HRC. Nothing to compare 52100 to as far as Spyderco models, but 63 HRC is pretty hard for a simple carbon steel, and S90V typically runs at 59-61 HRC.
That may be where they start but I'll bet they do their own experimenting and CQI with HT. I can't imagine Spyderco not tweaking and experimenting with manufacturer's recommendations.
This is for production models outside of that who knows? I am not privileged enough to know or guess. So will forgo speculation.
I may be wrong but have never seen Sal say anything different about production. Until he does gonna stick with that.
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Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
Wouldn't you think it'd be a bit strange for Sal to be so secretive about the ratings and treatment process though if it was all info we could find on the cpm website? Also, if we were to assume they just went with the the manufacturer HT protocol, it could still mean they have a choice to pick different ones for a single steel for different hardness. So I dont think the possibility of the same steel multiple hardness ratings across the product line is really that far fetched. I agree that we will probably never know definitively based off anything Sal says, however we do see some youtubers that take quite a keen interest in this and are collecting quantifiable data on the steels every week! Bless those souls who have the courage to expose heat treat secrecy and boldly defy such tyrannical knife steel information suppression!! /sDoeswhateveraspidercan wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 9:37 pmI too like to think this way also but Sal is a very straight forward no nonsense type of guy if he says it I believe I can trust his word to be the final authority on all things Spyderco.The Meat man wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 8:50 pmDoeswhateveraspidercan wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 8:37 pmSounds like a fun legend but Sal always says Spyderco Heat Treats go by the book according to the steels manufacturer, so gotta go aight he master on this.youmakemehole wrote: ↑Fri Apr 12, 2019 1:16 amApparently there is one source that rates the peel ply CruWear at 61-63HRC, a point or two higher than the norm. I have this theory that the peel ply CF is a material reserved only for what Spyderco considers to be their very best steels that have also gone through the best possible heat treatments. A couple other steels wearing their peel ply CF such as 51200 and 154/S90V have been reported by this source to be higher than typical as well, if I remember right they were both also said to be 61-63HRC. Nothing to compare 52100 to as far as Spyderco models, but 63 HRC is pretty hard for a simple carbon steel, and S90V typically runs at 59-61 HRC.
That may be where they start but I'll bet they do their own experimenting and CQI with HT. I can't imagine Spyderco not tweaking and experimenting with manufacturer's recommendations.
This is for production models outside of that who knows? I am not privileged enough to know or guess. So will forgo speculation.
I may be wrong but have never seen Sal say anything different about production. Until he does gonna stick with that.
"Sometimes I think that we're all little kids trying to act like grown ups, in our parents clothes. "
-sal
-sal
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Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
Cool never saw that before. Well there’s you have it Sal has indeed confirmed these thoughts people are speculating on concerning different heat treats. Glad you shared this.Cambertree wrote: ↑Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:15 amSal answering a past question about their HT procedures:
- Cambertree
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Re: What is your favorite Spyderco in CPM Cruwear?
No worries. I couldn't find that quote you were probably referring to earlier, where he said most of their heat treat regimes end up being fairly close, if not identical, to the recommendations from the foundry, but I remember seeing it too.Doeswhateveraspidercan wrote: ↑Sat Apr 13, 2019 8:25 amCool never saw that before. Well there’s you have it Sal has indeed confirmed these thoughts people are speculating on concerning different heat treats. Glad you shared this.
I took the quote above to mean that sometimes adjustments are made early on in bringing a particular steel to market, based on customer feedback. I daresay their R&D is extensive, but it can't cover every contingency in use, especially when Spyderco are the industry leader at introducing so many new production steels.
I believe the CPM S30V heat treat may have been adjusted fairly early on, to provide a better toughness/hardness balance.
ZDP-189 had some issues in the Mule, which may have resulted in the heat treat being tweaked a little in the folders.
The Cruwear Mule had some issues too IIRC? Although I think that may have been from an error in processing, which they owned and acted on as soon as it became apparent.
The early Gayle Bradleys with the solid liners were supposedly run harder than the later ones.
Maxamet, as we all know has had some challenges to it.
It's possible that the same steel may come out slightly differently in different factories in different countries. Even following the same heat treat 'recipe' there may be tiny variations based on different heat treat equipment, speed of quenches, tempering, cryo ramp and hold times etc. (I'm only conjecturing here.)
It's also possible that if large batches of different model blades in the same steel are heat treated together, there may be minor variation in outcomes based on different sizes, steel cross sections, cooling rates etc. For example a Chaparral CTS-XHP blade compared to a Manix blade in the same steel could heat and cool at slightly different rates. Also temps may vary slightly in different parts of ovens.
Personally, I don't think it's likely that Spyderco have 'special' heat treat variations which they roll out for certain premium models.
It seems to be a fairly common thing to simply think that steel should be run harder for better performance. My understanding, is that you can get to a point of swiftly diminishing returns. For example, if you knew that that making X steel 5% harder would also result in it being 30% less tough and 10% less corrosion resistant, would you still choose that incremental hardness increase?
I'm guessing that Spyderco are pretty good at finding that performance sweet spot, and then sticking to the same heat treat from that point on.
Last edited by Cambertree on Wed Apr 24, 2019 9:51 pm, edited 2 times in total.