The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby Extra330SC » Fri Mar 29, 2019 10:28 pm

bwunger wrote:
Fri Mar 29, 2019 10:12 pm
I was coming on here to make the exact same post as the OP. It's such a great knife that I really want to like but I'm really close to returning it because the clip is so bad. I'll try it on a few more pants tomorrow. Maybe this pair is especially bad and maybe I can resend the clip but if it doesn't get better this one may be going back.

It doesn't seem to cause any issues being on the lock bar otherwise. It's just that darn cutout and the really low clearance under the clip. They need more clearance and should have put the cutout on the inside.

I may give Spyderco a call on Monday to see what my options are. I'm seriously contemplating whether I could live with this knife sans clip. And just let it ride in the bottom of my pocket. Maybe I could commission a custom clip?
Unfortunately it's pretty bad! I usually wear cargo shorts year round and it's a TWO HANDER for sure. It gets caught every time on the cutout and stops dead 60 % into the clip! The only clothing that worked well one handed was a North Face windbreaker my wife was using.

Really bummed as the Drunken is stunning and a joy in the hand with great action. The grind is hacked on our sample too :(

James

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby Wright.88 » Fri Mar 29, 2019 10:30 pm

bwunger wrote:
Fri Mar 29, 2019 10:12 pm
I was coming on here to make the exact same post as the OP. It's such a great knife that I really want to like but I'm really close to returning it because the clip is so bad. I'll try it on a few more pants tomorrow. Maybe this pair is especially bad and maybe I can resend the clip but if it doesn't get better this one may be going back.

It doesn't seem to cause any issues being on the lock bar otherwise. It's just that darn cutout and the really low clearance under the clip. They need more clearance and should have put the cutout on the inside.

I may give Spyderco a call on Monday to see what my options are. I'm seriously contemplating whether I could live with this knife sans clip. And just let it ride in the bottom of my pocket. Maybe I could commission a custom clip?
Try taking the clip off and bending it right where it goes above the edge of the lockbar cutout. The clip is pretty thin and bends easily. I did this and it made a big difference in how easily mine goes in the pocket.

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby archangel » Sat Mar 30, 2019 3:51 am

Wright.88 wrote:
Fri Mar 29, 2019 10:30 pm
bwunger wrote:
Fri Mar 29, 2019 10:12 pm
I was coming on here to make the exact same post as the OP. It's such a great knife that I really want to like but I'm really close to returning it because the clip is so bad. I'll try it on a few more pants tomorrow. Maybe this pair is especially bad and maybe I can resend the clip but if it doesn't get better this one may be going back.

It doesn't seem to cause any issues being on the lock bar otherwise. It's just that darn cutout and the really low clearance under the clip. They need more clearance and should have put the cutout on the inside.

I may give Spyderco a call on Monday to see what my options are. I'm seriously contemplating whether I could live with this knife sans clip. And just let it ride in the bottom of my pocket. Maybe I could commission a custom clip?
Try taking the clip off and bending it right where it goes above the edge of the lockbar cutout. The clip is pretty thin and bends easily. I did this and it made a big difference in how easily mine goes in the pocket.

Interesting thread. In fact I would call the Southard clip another example for a sub-standard design, but it was an easy fix of slightly bending the end of the clip to make it better attachable, and rounding the tip to make it less pointy. Just as easy as the above mentioned solution. Still it has to be considered a design flaw. Here, plus the uneven grinds - how'd this happen? Can individual production pieces really find a way to shipping without being quality inspected? Even from Taichung?

Oh, and since the Slysz Bowie found its way into this thread: it's my one true EDC, always (!) on me when I'm at hope except for bedtime and when I shower. And I've had ZERO issues with the clip whatsoever. Yes, there's not much space between where the clip touches the handle and where the cutout starts. But there is some space, and some is enough. I'd say the Slysz has no issue.

But it seems the Drunken does. However, the clip seems to be bendable easily enough though. So I'd say: help yourself, and enjoy this beauty!
Michael
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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby Gsg9 » Sat Mar 30, 2019 3:57 am

The Pocket Clip Affair

An anatomy of the of the current state of the Nation

#######################################################################

That's a problem for los gringos americanos, they can carry the knives inside their pants pockets, they can carry AR15s and .454 Casulls but that's a different topic :D

I can't do that here in the socialist pacifist knife scared schizophrenic Europe without armored police with HK-G33s coming after me, I have to hide them in Maxpedition pouches, bags, backpacks and so on

It's ridiculous to have a $400+ knife and a cheap stamped Spyderco clip, even if that works well

Like the Nirvana, that piece deserved a custom clip

Paysan had the same misfortune

A $400+ knife is supposed to be something more than just an utilitarian cutting tool that you dump into your pockets

It's supposed to have a style, to look 100% nice

That's why they chose these high end materials and the drunken pattern and all that milling that went into it that ultimately costs money

Otherwise just buy a freaking Delica or a Para

That it didn't go quite right it's a bit unfortunate

But I think that custom clips on expensive pieces it's a step in the right direction

If you keep on crying about that clip Spyderco will do what they did with the Reveal policy, for a few "where's my knife" cry babies they punished everybody, they will come back to cheap looking stamped clips that look horrible on all of their $400+ high-end pieces

Or they will just stop making high-end pieces, Spyderco already has a fierce competition from chinese manufacturers

I think it's too much noise for not too big of a problem, just take it out and bend it a bit until it fits your pants or send it to Spyderco and they will do it for you

Otherwise the knife doesn't deserve this negative image, it's a nice design with a S90V blade with that finish similar with Slisz Bowie and with a lot of details put into the scales

I hope Spyderco will continue to put custom clips on at least some of their expensive high-end pieces


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkPq3UaCLpg

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby archangel » Sat Mar 30, 2019 5:42 am

I wouldn't put it that harshly, but I agree that a special design deserves a special unique matching clip. It derserves to be good though.
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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby tvenuto » Sat Mar 30, 2019 5:47 am

@Gsg9

Impatience =/= feedback. Calling people "cry babies" for experiencing an issue and relating it to spyderco is unhelpful. It turns out that different people have different experiences. Acknowledging that everyone's experience or feelings are not like yours is the first step to empathy, which, it turns out, is necessary for a group to thrive.

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby Gsg9 » Sat Mar 30, 2019 6:40 am

@tvenuto

Just to clarify, I didn't call any specific people "cry babies", I didn't quote anybody or named any names

That's referring to a general trend...

We already see the results of Reveal policy due to some people crying about "where's my knife, where's my knife, where's my knife, where's my knife, where's my knife"...

Spyderco fed up with this, hence the Reveal policy, that's one of the reasons why you saw in the Amsterdam Meet topic just 10 out of 100 prototypes

Just don't go the same route with the custom clips on high end pieces

The actual clip is probably fixable, bend it or send it to Spyderco

I didn't come here to cultivate my empathy, just expressing my opinions, as blunt as they are :D

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby RadioactiveSpyder » Sat Mar 30, 2019 6:41 am

Despite the odd interjections into this thread, I’m afraid I must also report on initial negative experiences with this pricey knife. I’ve handled pretty much every knife they offer out of Taichung and have several comparably priced midtechs that this Drunken is competing against.

The others have hit upon the clip issue sufficiently - it’s pretty much a total failure as a useful pocket clip. Ridiculous to think everyone should just take it off and re-bend it to improve it - that is a certain recipe for many folks to completely mess their clip up. To have to send it back to Spyderco for them to “fix it” is equally goofy - they already showed us their design for it (or Sinkovich’s). It just doesn’t work and it really kills the knife unfortunately.

The other thing I notice comparing it especially to another similar mid tech with fluted CF, intricate Ti milling, etc. is the huge distance between the lockbar and the frame. The lockbar gap is so wide I can almost stick my pinky in it! Why was so much Ti removed there? I don’t have concerns for its function or lockup but being able to see so much daylight through there really bugs me.

Overall this was a knife I was very much looking forward to trying in hand but my near-instantaneous response is that it will be a pass for me. And I so wanted a high-end SpydieChef like this! Cheers, Radioactive :)
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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby Zatx » Sat Mar 30, 2019 6:46 am

Gsg9 wrote:
Sat Mar 30, 2019 3:57 am

It's supposed to have a style, to look 100% nice

That's why they chose these high end materials and the drunken pattern and all that milling that went into it that ultimately costs money

But I think that custom clips on expensive pieces it's a step in the right direction

If you keep on crying about that clip Spyderco will do what they did with the Reveal policy, for a few "where's my knife" cry babies they punished everybody, they will come back to cheap looking stamped clips that look horrible on all of their $400+ high-end pieces

Or they will just stop making high-end pieces, Spyderco already has a fierce competition from chinese manufacturers

I think it's too much noise for not too big of a problem, just take it out and bend it a bit until it fits your pants or send it to Spyderco and they will do it for you

Otherwise the knife doesn't deserve this negative image, it's a nice design with a S90V blade with that finish similar with Slisz Bowie and with a lot of details put into the scales

I hope Spyderco will continue to put custom clips on at least some of their expensive high-end pieces

I'd like to respond to this post with some careful thoughts and words because I'm seeing these sentiments from Spyderco defenders in this thread and it should be addressed.

First, I love the look of this custom clip and wouldn't want to see the two standard "stock" clips on this high-end knife. I wholeheartedly agree with you on this point.

Second, let's say I remove the clip and manage to perfectly bend it to the exact tolerances needed, this still won't fix all of the problems with this clip and it could easily damage it and prevent my ability to return it. Spyderco isn't going to bend your clip if you send them your knife. Attempting to bend this thin piece of metal will most likely cause damage to the anodizing that can't be repaired. Bending the clip doesn't magically make the stock material thicker as it's currently too thin and sharp. The end of the clip is also sharp and if I grind it into a more ergonomic shape I've also ruined the anodizing. At the very least it won't be a clean factory produced results.

Lastly, a user shouldn't have to modify their knife to be able to use it as intended. This is a knife that is designed to cut stuff AND clip inside a pocket and it doesn't do that. Also, a user shouldn't have to commission a custom clip to make their knife functional. You may think this issue is minor, but not being able to put your knife in your pocket is very significant.

I can forgive the amateur blade grind, the loose screws, the corroded stop pin, the fact that Spyderco charged me over $1000 for three Drunkens when I only ordered one (did not include this info in the review of the knife), but by gosh if they had received feedback about issues with the clip and left it, well... that is just negligence on their part. This knife has had production prototypes floating around for two years... this could have been avoided. This marks the first time in the fifteen plus years I've collected Spyderco products that I'm disappointed in them.

I guess I should stop complaining now. Look at this elegant solution... a clip from a $30 Boker on a $400 knife. Perfectly functional now!

Image

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby Zatx » Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:47 am

I couldn't just put this issue away, so I've been trying a couple of different options in an attempt to offer solutions rather than just complaints.

Here is an elegant change to eliminate the pocket catching, and it doesn't require a redesign of the clip:

Image


If you move the clip in line with the back of the scale rather than in line with the lock bar, the clip sits flat (on the scale and not the lock bar) and has enough clearance for pocket material, and the knife goes in an out of the pocket perfectly fine. The other advantage of this position is that it sits in the pocket better, allowing more space for your hand to reach into your pocket (this is the angle of the SpydieChef's clip as well).

This doesn't help those of us who already have this version of the knife, but it is a fairly straightforward CQI adjustment. Though, I suspect there won't be a second run if 3/4 of the people return this first iteration. I wonder if I could epoxy the clip in this position; as it stands now, you can't get the screw tight enough to stop the clip from rotating.
Last edited by Zatx on Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:54 am, edited 4 times in total.

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby tvenuto » Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:50 am

Gsg9 wrote:
Sat Mar 30, 2019 6:40 am
@tvenuto

Just to clarify, I didn't call any specific people "cry babies", I didn't quote anybody or named any names

That's referring to a general trend...

We already see the results of Reveal policy due to some people crying about "where's my knife, where's my knife, where's my knife, where's my knife, where's my knife"...

Spyderco fed up with this, hence the Reveal policy, that's one of the reasons why you saw in the Amsterdam Meet topic just 10 out of 100 prototypes

Just don't go the same route with the custom clips on high end pieces

The actual clip is probably fixable, bend it or send it to Spyderco

I didn't come here to cultivate my empathy, just expressing my opinions, as blunt as they are :D
No clarification necessary, I didn't say you were attacking anyone in particular or violating forum rules. My problem is that your opinion seems to be that others should not express theirs, which will tend to have a chilling effect on negative feedback, which is both unhelpful for Spyderco and projects an unwelcoming atmosphere here.

I'm certainly not the arbiter of the kind of atmosphere we have, that will be dictated by how we collectively behave. I think one where we can respectfully disagree is best, don't you?
Last edited by tvenuto on Sat Mar 30, 2019 5:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby JacksonKnives » Sat Mar 30, 2019 8:51 am

Zatx wrote:
Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:47 am
I couldn't just put this issue away, so I've been trying a couple of different options in an attempt to offer solutions rather than just complaints.

Here is an elegant change to eliminate the pocket catching, and it doesn't require a redesign of the clip:

Image
Zatx, if you add a spacer under the clip to raise it slightly (but not far enough that it will start to spin) would the extra clearance be enough?

Someone could make an insert that would re-position the clip, but that would be almost as expensive as a replacement clip.

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby Pelagic » Sat Mar 30, 2019 8:55 am

The term "cry baby" has no place when it comes to a knife at this price point.
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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby Woodpuppy » Sat Mar 30, 2019 12:22 pm

The lockbar cut out is surprisingly wide, not just at the lock face but along its side too.
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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby spyderg » Sat Mar 30, 2019 1:27 pm

As a lefty this knife is useless to me since it can’t be carried left hand but to me the simple solution has already been mentioned. Take the clip off, bend it a little and good to go. I bend all my clips for stronger retention as it is. Also I usually bend down the ramp a little so it doesn’t catch on things as much. As long as I can get the knife out easily and back in ok, it’s all good. I’ve had many occasions where I need to get my knife out quickly but very few times have I needed to rush it back into my pocket. Imo they seem to have a clip that suits the knife and will work fine with a little adjustment however I understand that at the price point folks don’t want to have to do anything for it to be right. Just be happy they didn’t put a wire clip on it, (I know, lots of folks love them but I hate em, they dig in my hand and move around in use. I’m planning on unloading my wire clipped Spydies cause I just can’t use them).
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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby Zatx » Sat Mar 30, 2019 4:23 pm

spyderg wrote:
Sat Mar 30, 2019 1:27 pm
As a lefty this knife is useless to me since it can’t be carried left hand but to me the simple solution has already been mentioned. Take the clip off, bend it a little and good to go. I bend all my clips for stronger retention as it is. Also I usually bend down the ramp a little so it doesn’t catch on things as much. As long as I can get the knife out easily and back in ok, it’s all good.


Please reread the issues with the clip, just bending it isn't going to solve all of the problems and presents several new ones if attempted.

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby Colorodo » Sat Mar 30, 2019 4:42 pm

Would a CRK Clip work?

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby MacLaren » Sat Mar 30, 2019 4:48 pm

Zatx wrote:
Sat Mar 30, 2019 4:23 pm
spyderg wrote:
Sat Mar 30, 2019 1:27 pm
As a lefty this knife is useless to me since it can’t be carried left hand but to me the simple solution has already been mentioned. Take the clip off, bend it a little and good to go. I bend all my clips for stronger retention as it is. Also I usually bend down the ramp a little so it doesn’t catch on things as much. As long as I can get the knife out easily and back in ok, it’s all good.


Please reread the issues with the clip, just bending it isn't going to solve all of the problems and presents several new ones if attempted.
And.....that's overlooking the amateur blade grind ( wow! ) loose screws and corroded stop pin.
Maybe Taichung needs " pep talk" or QC?
Seems like this one is living up to its name.
I know that's rough, but it's a $400+ knife.

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby SpyderEdgeForever » Sat Mar 30, 2019 5:00 pm

Would one solution to this and future problems be for Spyderco to offer pre-packaged Pocket Clip Sets that the customer can use basic tools to trade back and forth on the knife, or, would that be adding additional extra complications?

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Re: The Drunken: Amazing Knife, Ruined by its Pocket Clip.

Postby ABX2011 » Sat Mar 30, 2019 5:39 pm

I wonder if the clip from the ZT 0470 could be used with a little modding. Anyway, this is a big fail.


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