it is the same lock for the para 3 they meant that the lock side liner is streamlined. the lock and its function and use are the same.MichaelScott wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:00 amI think the objections to a knife like the Shaman being offered as a lightweight are sound. Such a LW knife would no longer be a Shaman. By extension, will the LW Para 3 still be a Para 3? Different scales, no liners, different lock, wire clip, tip up only, one ounce lighter. Looks like a Para 3 from a distance. Is it better? Depends on what you mean by “better”. It will certainly will offer a different experience than the Para 3 HW.
I think the weight difference is basically negligible. My keys weigh more than the weight savings.
What if Spyderco released a Military LW? Would it still be a Military with all of the attributes of the original? Would people who haven’t bought a Military HW buy a LW version?
I hope we get some real criticism (both good and bad) on the Para 3 LW. That will be really interesting.
I share your thoughts with regards to LW vs the regular G10 version. I have only ever kept one LW model I bought and that is a Manix LW in Maxamet but that was because of the steel. I would have preferred it in the G10 version (I have 2 of those).Tucson Tom wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:49 amOK, I just have to speak my mind. I am not into this lightweight thing at all. Not even a little bit. Of the umpteen Spyderco knives I have, there is one lightweight, a Native 5 Maxamet that I bought mostly because of the steel, but also I sort of caved in to see what an FRN blade is like.
Give me G10 (or Carbon Fiber) any day. Not that my N5 LW has let me down, or that I expect it to, but G10 just looks like it is serious and ready for business and FRN looks like a kids toy. Just sayin'
This is of course simply my view, and I don't know how widely it is shared. I am glad there are FRN (or FRCP) knives there for those who like them and more power to those who do. Don't expect me to rush out and buy them however.
I should also point out that there isn't that much weight savings, nor do I see why a weight savings is really a concern. I was happily carrying my Manix 2 "heavy" in my pocket all day and was scarcely aware of it. I am very much the ultralight backpacker, and my linerless G10 Native (not the Maxamet, the one with S90V) is my "backpacking knife".
Now I can see from Spydercos point of view (insofar as I can delude myself into thinking that I do). What I see is that each G10 knife involves what looks like a fair bit of CNC machining -- whereas when you absorb the cost of having a mold for FRN made, then you can just squirt stuff into the mold and crank 'em out. (I imagine Sal or someone at Spyderco with his head in his hands at this point). So the economics are totally different, and I presume that an FRN knife is cheaper to manufacture. Nothing is quite that simple though. Anyway, gimme that G10.
In terms of economics, FRN knives are cheaper to produce as long as there is enough demand to offset the initial tooling cost. The FRN molds are quite an expensive investment. As an example, Spyderco released the Stretch 2 in brown G-10 when they first introduced it to gauge interest before tooling up for the FRN versions. Additionally, when the Caly 3 was first released it was also in G-10 with Sal saying that a FRN version was on the back burner if the demand was present. So, the FRN models are more economically sound, but only once the demand is proven.Tucson Tom wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:49 amNow I can see from Spydercos point of view (insofar as I can delude myself into thinking that I do). What I see is that each G10 knife involves what looks like a fair bit of CNC machining -- whereas when you absorb the cost of having a mold for FRN made, then you can just squirt stuff into the mold and crank 'em out. (I imagine Sal or someone at Spyderco with his head in his hands at this point). So the economics are totally different, and I presume that an FRN knife is cheaper to manufacture. Nothing is quite that simple though. Anyway, gimme that G10.
Tucson Tom wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:49 amOK, I just have to speak my mind. I am not into this lightweight thing at all. Not even a little bit. Of the umpteen Spyderco knives I have, there is one lightweight, a Native 5 Maxamet that I bought mostly because of the steel, but also I sort of caved in to see what an FRN blade is like.
Tucson Tom wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:49 amI should also point out that there isn't that much weight savings, nor do I see why a weight savings is really a concern. I was happily carrying my Manix 2 "heavy" in my pocket all day and was scarcely aware of it. I am very much the ultralight backpacker, and my linerless G10 Native (not the Maxamet, the one with S90V) is my "backpacking knife".
1.) Honestly I have no idea what "ITT" means - ? Would appreciate a short reply on that...Vivi wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:58 amITT: People that don't understand an ounce of weight makes a difference when carrying a knife in running shorts while tackling mountain trails, wearing basketball shorts, in sweats / pajamas, bringing it on an ultralight backpacking trip, packing it on an ultralight bicycle tour, when you're carrying a knife in addition to a gun/light/multitool etc. and want to trim ounces where you can, or that the lower price is nice too.
I feel like we have this same discussion every month
I'll take my tools as light as I can while still having them function. If Spyderco could make a 1.5oz Police, and Glock could make a 5oz 43, I'd EDC those.
Not in mountaineering, when you push it to the (your personal) limits, believe me... At least then it is quite important to consider every ounce that could be saved.MichaelScott wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:24 am
The actual importance of an ounce in hiking, backpacking and all that is vastly over rated.
Colin Fletcher was a bit of an odd bird, let's just leave it at that.MichaelScott wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:24 amI remember Colin Fletcher advocated cutting the handles down on toothbrushes and trimming the margins off topo maps. He wore three pound boots.
The actual importance of an ounce in hiking, backpacking and all that is vastly over rated.
For me in running shorts even a Pacific Salt is "too heavy". I carry instead a Dragonfly Salt or a Manbug Salt. A larger or heavier knife bounces around too much and gets annoying.Tucson Tom wrote: ↑Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:41 pmIf I was running with some elastic waist shorts I would have to pick something different (perhaps a Pacific Salt, if I still had one).
Thanks!