V-Toku2 vs HAP40 vs VG10 vs ZDP189

[vivi]

I'm quickly becoming a fan of the Stretch 2. I'm tempted to pick up a sprint run.

I have the VG10 version clipped to my pocket. I know this steel well and really enjoy using it.

I've used ZDP189 in the past, but it's been a while. I know it will trade some toughness and corrosion resistance for improved edge holding and a higher hardness.

I have never used HAP40 or VTOKU2.

I know neither will resist corrosion well compared to the two stainless steels...but being laminates they should do well enough.

What I'm curious is how the edge holding, toughness and ease of sharpening / grindability compares to the two stainless steels I've used.

Any input from members with experience with these steels is welcome.

[Sharp Guy]

I'm definitely not the steel expert that some are here but I do have experience with all the steels you mention. V-TOKU seems like it takes a keen edge as easy as VG10, maybe even easier. HAP40 is probably closure to Cruwear IMO.

V-TOKU will definitely patina much faster/easier than HAP40. In fact, I can't seem to get any of my HAP40 knives to patina but I've only really tried with one. My V-TOKU Delica was easy to get a patina on.

I can't really help you on the toughness aspect because I haven't had any toughness issues with any of my knives including the ones I bring to work.

[knivesandbooks]

I have both and prefer hap40. V-toku sharpens like most other simpler carbon steels. Hap40 is easy to sharpen too but I find it to be a great steel for toughness and edge holding. I've only ever had one spot on hap40 too, fwiw.
Both will take your low angles just fine. You'd get a better toothy edge out of hap40 than vtoku but vtoku should be easier to bring to a high polish (I never do though).

[Marulaghost]

I have both and prefer hap40. V-toku sharpens like most other simpler carbon steels. Hap40 is easy to sharpen too but I find it to be a great steel for toughness and edge holding. I've only ever had one spot on hap40 too, fwiw.
Both will take your low angles just fine. You'd get a better toothy edge out of hap40 than vtoku but vtoku should be easier to bring to a high polish (I never do though).

Would you by any chance know if v toku works better with some tooth or a mirror polish?

[Wartstein]

Vivi, I don't feel entitled to evaluate steels and their properties on your level, just wanted to state that my HAP 40 Stretch 1 works great fo me, I have no problems keeping it sharp on a basic sharpmaker (white/brown rods) and it takes a bit harder use (carving and a bit wisting in hard wood for example) really well without chipping or the like.

More importantly: In Hap 40 you'll only get the Stretch ONE as far as I am aware of. I personally prefer the Stretch 1, but for your bigger hands (mine are between L and XL) the ergos of the "2" will be better most likely.

One advantage of the ZDP Stretch 2 (at least the G10 version): It has a longer, more handle filling blade compared to the VG 10 model.
(The blade and especially edge of the Stretch ONE is noticeable longer in any case than the "2"s)

[knivesandbooks]

I have both and prefer hap40. V-toku sharpens like most other simpler carbon steels. Hap40 is easy to sharpen too but I find it to be a great steel for toughness and edge holding. I've only ever had one spot on hap40 too, fwiw.
Both will take your low angles just fine. You'd get a better toothy edge out of hap40 than vtoku but vtoku should be easier to bring to a high polish (I never do though).

Would you by any chance know if v toku works better with some tooth or a mirror polish?

Well, many people on here are way more experts in steel than me. But, I think for low carbide steels like vtoku, you may as well go polished. But, either way. Maybe just sharpen at a lower grit, try it out, and the next time you tough it up give it a polish. Or give a toothy primary with a polished microbevel. That way it would be a little of both, in a way.

[Wartstein]

V-TOKU will definitely patina much faster/easier than HAP40. In fact, I can't seem to get any of my HAP40 knives to patina but I've only really tried with one. My V-TOKU Delica was easy to get a patina on.

I had to purchase my HAP 40 Endura on the secondary market for I could not find a new one, and it already came with a Patina (below the laminate line of course). I don' t know if this just developed or the pre-owner forced it.

My HAP 40 Stretch (purchased new) is still shiny across the whole blade though I don't take too much care of it

[vivi]

I overlooked the fact that the HAP40 run was only for the Stretch 1. Thanks for pointing that out Wartstein.

I haven't handled them side by side, and it's been over a decade since I last owned a Stretch 1, but I'd imagine I'd prefer the 2 for the bigger handle. That being said I have nothing against trying out another Stretch 1. I remember the CF/ZDP version I owned being quite comfortable.

[Wartstein]

I overlooked the fact that the HAP40 run was only for the Stretch 1. Thanks for pointing that out Wartstein.

I haven't handled them side by side, and it's been over a decade since I last owned a Stretch 1, but I'd imagine I'd prefer the 2 for the bigger handle. That being said I have nothing against trying out another Stretch 1. I remember the CF/ZDP version I owned being quite comfortable.

Bentoboxshop (hope it's ok to mention that here?) still has the HAP 40 Stretch 1 in stock for a good price (but with high shipping costs and questionable return policy). If your big hands are ok with the ergos (and still I think for bigger hands than mine the "2" will be better in that capacity) I just can strongly recommend the knife.

[youmakemehole]

I have all 4 of those steels you mention and although I have not really seen much action with my V-Toku delica or have handled a Stretch, I can vouch for HAP40 as well by a long shot. The corrosion resistance will beat out the other steels save for VG-10, and it will hold an edge better than most all of them aside from maybe ZDP, which may (or may not, they both perform great) have slightly better edge retention but at the cost of a good bit of toughness. In fact ZDP is quite infamous for causing issues related to its brittleness. If everyone started only making knives with HAP40 laminate and nothing else, I could totally live with that. To sum it up, HAP40/SUS410 laminate imo has edge retention good enough if not much better than what the average knife owner will need, corrosion resistance that most people can easily manage, and a more than satisfactory amount of toughness for a folding knife application.

[SolidState]

I also have them all, and vastly prefer Hap40. Hap40 is my favorite aside from Aogami. I even have a Hap40 santoku kitchen knife because I liked it so much.

[Bloke]

I only shaved a small patch on my left arm with a factory edge on a V-Toku2 Stretch 2 before I sold it so I can’t say anything about the steel.

I’m quite partial to all the steels you mention Vivi. It’s a hard choice but if I could only have one I s’pose I’d go with HAP40. My folders don’t see any serious work and I’m happy with any of these steels.

I find it easy to take all three to hair whittling sharpness and would have to say HAP40 sits in the middle in regards to ease of sharpening and edge retention. :)

[weeping minora]

* EDITED - Please see our forum rules. Thanks much. - TazKristi

[araneae]

Fyi, offering knives for sale is against the rules here.

[ZrowsN1s]

Hap40 is nice. It's my favorite of the Japanese steels. Easy to sharpen, takes a high polish, good edge holding, decently tough.

[weeping minora]

My apologies :o

[TkoK83Spy]

Vivi is one of the handful around here that seriously uses his knives...I respect the heck out of that and love to read his findings/reviews or watch his videos.

That said, last I knew KnifeWorks still had the V-Toku2 Stretch 2 available for under $100. You don't seem like the type to strike me as someone to worry about a patina...though possibly rust issues could arise with all your outdoors use. I think that's the knife I would choose though, as long as you give it a little TLC. Steel you've never tried...I feel your obligated to give it a shot.

[anagarika]

Vivi,

Since you have tried ZDP, I suggest getting HAP 40 unless the handle is not suitable. Well, in that case probably VTOKU is next better option. It should take low angle well.

[Wartstein]

I overlooked the fact that the HAP40 run was only for the Stretch 1. Thanks for pointing that out Wartstein.

I haven't handled them side by side, and it's been over a decade since I last owned a Stretch 1, but I'd imagine I'd prefer the 2 for the bigger handle. That being said I have nothing against trying out another Stretch 1. I remember the CF/ZDP version I owned being quite comfortable.

Vivi, should you decide on a Stretch 1, I'd really be interested in your impressions and opinion since I love that model so much.

[vivi]

I may have to find a knife shop that carries them to see if I'd like the 1 as much. Part of why I'm enjoying the Stretch 2 so much is the roomy handle. Behind the index choil that grip offers more real estate than the Manix XL I was carrying before I put the Stretch in my pocket.

Either way I'll be making a Stretch thread sometime this month, posting photos, impressions etc. I plan to make more knife videos this year, they're fun.