Spyderco Forums

Hi Steelcity,

FYI, We built a number of prototypes with different textures and they were all too rough because of the 3D scales. Had I used peel-ply, I would have had to drop the 3D scales which I didn't want to do for this design.

sal

I think the native 5 model not being the most popular is the main reason. And while Cru-Wear is great stuff, there are many steels that are in a similar performance range like 3v, 4v, m4, rex45 so that not everyone needs another knife. Unless it is a very desirable model/steel/scale combo. I love smooth G10 scales though.

And i don't think BBS ever sold out quick on a sprint. Many don't seem to like them as a company. Even though the K390 price seems reasonable for Americans to me. Since they don't offer free shipping and returns there is no "out of jail free card" for any flipper for when a sprint isn't popular. This stops people from gambling on a sprint run. Since it doesn't sell quick there is no FOMO run on them i think.
For me it is the exorbitant shipping costs they charge for international sales. I'd love me some K390 but i'd rather have it in a Para 3, Chaparral or Shaman. So i skip on the PM2 anyway. Not a huge fan of the color either.

steelcity16 wrote: ↑

Sat Oct 12, 2019 5:45 pm

JuPaul wrote: ↑

Sat Oct 12, 2019 5:01 pm

VooDooChild wrote: ↑

Sat Oct 12, 2019 3:41 pm

Gotta point out the cruwear native 5 exclusive is also still available. Given how much cruwear talk and demand has been going on lately, thats a bit of a suprise. Im just saying the predictability of the success rate of a sprint or exclusive is probably very difficult. Even for people who are "in the know".

A lot of people passed on those because of the smooth black g10 scales. I like cruwear and the native enough that I bought one knowing I'd replace the scales eventually. But that turns a $130 knife into a $200 knife, so it's a choice not everyone will make. You just never know, so I can see why dealers and spyderco want to err on the side of being conservative. Makes much more financial sense.

Agreed. I'm about as big a Cruwear fan boy as they come, and I passed on all of the KC Cruwear exclusives because of the smooth scales. If those would have all been an earth tone PEEL PLY G10, they would have all sold out very quickly and I would have bought one of each. They also don't hype their exclusives with a week lead to a specific drop date/time. That plays a lot into the FOMO pack mentality of the hours/minutes/seconds sellouts at other dealers.

+1 & 1

I purchased a very expensive PM2 in Cruwear because it was only available on the secondary market it was a knife center exclusive and replaced those scales.

Cost me a bundle to make it the way I wanted it with Peel Ply G10 will not do that twice. Love the knife hate what I paid to make it right.

Was it worth it for cruwear in that awesome design? Heck yeah! Otherwise I would not have done it! If I had my way though would have preferred to have been aware of how great cruwear was during the initial runs of the knife in Peel Ply G10 with Cruwear.

Would also have been very angry not to be able to get one due to shortages with retailers.

I mean can you imagine the frustrations people go through trying to make a purchase on a website only to get the order in and it will not go through because they are all sold out?

Definition of collector **** in my book, have to protect myself from that kind of build up to disappointment and really do not want to be part of a process that leads others to loosing out. Ugggh!

When DLT ran out of 20CV DLC PM2 I had one frustrated member here PM me to see if I would sell him one of the two I purchased.

I felt terrible because I was already committed to giving it away to someone else as a gift. So I remained silent and was very happy for them when they got one they were so relieved and excited!

He or she lucked out big time and was able to get one after all even as they were going up on eBay.

The one I will not revel knows I speak the truth.

sal wrote: ↑

Sat Oct 12, 2019 6:07 pm

Hi Steelcity,

FYI, We built a number of prototypes with different textures and they were all too rough because of the 3D scales. Had I used peel-ply, I would have had to drop the 3D scales which I didn't want to do for this design.

sal

Oooohhh now that is interesting.

sal wrote: ↑

Sat Oct 12, 2019 6:07 pm

Hi Steelcity,

FYI, We built a number of prototypes with different textures and they were all too rough because of the 3D scales. Had I used peel-ply, I would have had to drop the 3D scales which I didn't want to do for this design.

sal

Hey Sal, are you referring the Shaman I am assuming? That makes sense and I appreciate the added context as a peel ply G10 fanatic and had been wondering that since the Shaman came out.

My post was actually referring to the smooth G10 KnifeCenter exclusive Native in Cruwear though. My feeling is that the slow sales of this Native are due only to the smooth G10. I would have been all over a peel ply G10 Native in Cruwear (especially a linered model). I'm still hoping we will see one some day. Along with a Cruwear Native LW and Manix LW. Given the hype of this Shaman, I suspect 2020 will be the year of Cruwear exclusives.

Can't say enough good things about this Cruwear Shaman. You really hit a home run here!

Rutger wrote: ↑

Sat Oct 12, 2019 6:35 pm

I think the native 5 model not being the most popular is the main reason

This didn't stop the two M4 Jade BHQ Natives from same day sellouts. There is a formula and KC and BBS don't follow it.

Flagship model + desirable steel + good color peel ply G10 scale + map pricing + free shipping + social media hype days/weeks in advance = same day sellout

DLT, BHQ, and now St Nicks have this figured out. Its not a difficult model to follow. If (when) St Nicks does a Red 4V Native, care to guess how many seconds it will take them to sell 600 Natives?? :D

Thanx Steelcity,

I'm sure the exclusive distributor will see your post.

sal

I would love some micarta scales on a Manix with a saber cut.

Speaking of a Manix, no news on the 3 that are supposed to still be out this year? It makes it hard when they all fall close together. $$$$$$$

This might just be me, but with the advent of social media in the knife aficionado community, I've observed that interest about particular models can be extra intense but also fickle. I've seen a number of sprints and exclusives move pretty slowly, it's not a guarantee to sell out.

And with lead times often longer than a year, you can't rely on what's currently hot to stay hot when, say, your dealer exclusive finally hits.

steelcity16 wrote: ↑

Sat Oct 12, 2019 5:45 pm

JuPaul wrote: ↑

Sat Oct 12, 2019 5:01 pm

VooDooChild wrote: ↑

Sat Oct 12, 2019 3:41 pm

Gotta point out the cruwear native 5 exclusive is also still available. Given how much cruwear talk and demand has been going on lately, thats a bit of a suprise. Im just saying the predictability of the success rate of a sprint or exclusive is probably very difficult. Even for people who are "in the know".

A lot of people passed on those because of the smooth black g10 scales. I like cruwear and the native enough that I bought one knowing I'd replace the scales eventually. But that turns a $130 knife into a $200 knife, so it's a choice not everyone will make. You just never know, so I can see why dealers and spyderco want to err on the side of being conservative. Makes much more financial sense.

Agreed. I'm about as big a Cruwear fan boy as they come, and I passed on all of the KC Cruwear exclusives because of the smooth scales. If those would have all been an earth tone PEEL PLY G10, they would have all sold out very quickly and I would have bought one of each. They also don't hype their exclusives with a week lead to a specific drop date/time. That plays a lot into the FOMO pack mentality of the hours/minutes/seconds sellouts at other dealers.

Very true. Interesting that they don't get into the hype. It's kinda nice.

Rutger wrote: ↑

Sat Oct 12, 2019 6:35 pm

And i don't think BBS ever sold out quick on a sprint. Many don't seem to like them as a company. Even though the K390 price seems reasonable for Americans to me. Since they don't offer free shipping and returns there is no "out of jail free card" for any flipper for when a sprint isn't popular. This stops people from gambling on a sprint run. Since it doesn't sell quick there is no FOMO run on them i think.

I think this is 100% correct and it is actually a better/more workable solution than Spyderco trying to make more of a given model with limited time and resources and risk getting stuck with unsold inventory. I am convinced that the actual "demand" for sprint models is significantly skewed by the flippers/profiteers who latch on to the "FOMO drop" style marketing campaigns.

I for one am really hoping BBS does watch this forum as Sal mentioned and are planning to do a nice Shaman exclusive so I can actually have a fair chance to purchase one without having to schedule a day off of work to hit "refresh" on their web site a million times at 10am sharp.

For me not buying the native in cruwear while living cruwear is the stock black color again, and smoothed out, but also because of the lock. So many people on our forums love lockbacks, not saying they are bad just I hate them for my own reasons.
Had this run been in a different color or heaven forbid micarta which we have asked for years would have made it a sellout. No more black sprint runs, without giving us colored production models.

rabbitanarchy14 wrote: ↑

Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:17 pm

For me not buying the native in cruwear while living cruwear is the stock black color again, and smoothed out, but also because of the lock. So many people on our forums love lockbacks, not saying they are bad just I hate them for my own reasons.
Had this run been in a different color or heaven forbid micarta which we have asked for years would have made it a sellout. No more black sprint runs, without giving us colored production models.

Fidgeting should never rank higher than a particular knifes ergos/steel etc. You clearly love the fidget friendly compression lock, based on what you own and have got rid of... but you're really missing out on some GREAT knives for the purpose of playing instead of using... those ZT flippers seem right up your alley, or better yet Kershaw makes plenty of them for under $50 :rolleyes:

Lock rock has nothing to do with fidgeting, have tried spyderco and others (case, buck, swiss) i don't like any. I have a dice and I do like it I use the hole more than the flipper and have owned a steel will, not a fan. Had Kershaw steel is just not up to my tasks, plus no hole.
I am not going to lie I do fidget quite often but I use my knives as well. To be honest and Frank (lol) spyderco has quite a few locks I like in many different styles and sizes so I have more choice than money to afford everything I want to try. Plus there is no replacement for a spyder hole sorry.
I was merely asking for more colors in production. Less black. I see more of the colored variations sellout more than the black.

None of my native 5s or the chief have lock rock. I cant recall any review or post of someone having it or being able to detect it. The newer backlocks on the golden made models is a totally different animal than what you would get with the delica/endura series. The tolerances and engineering that went into the new golden made backlocks of the last few years are impressive. Every time I use one I can tell just how well thought out they are, and why they took a long time to get to this level. If someone hasnt tried one I would say give it a shot. If its still not to their liking theres other great options as well.

Ok. In the spirit of honesty I just grabbed my chief and really tried to see if I could detect some and it does have a hair of lock rock. Not nearly as bad as my endura 4. I should have checked before posting. I cartainly havent detected it in use. I dont detect any in my native 5s though. There could be other examples though that have it so I cant say ots not possible, I dont really feel like doing a long search right now. The chief is big. Any big back lock can be hard to eliminate lock rock on. I also prefer backlocks over all other lock types so I could have some bias coming in.
Doesnt the chaparral lightweight have an internal stop pin so it cant have lock rock?

VooDooChild wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 13, 2019 2:25 am

Doesnt the chaparral lightweight have an internal stop pin so it cant have lock rock?

Yes, integral to the blade that runs in a slot in the liners. This thread, like many recently, has really gotten off track!

Done

BLUETYPEII wrote: ↑

Mon Oct 14, 2019 1:35 pm

Does anyone know what day the M4 Dodo from BHQ is going to drop??

Not yet.

I hope it doesn't come out too quick, the Cruwear Shaman is taking a chunk out of the budget. I don't like the thought of trying to reason that one out with the wife...

DLT Trading Exclusive Para3 Lightweight M390 Red FRN will go on sale on Tuesday, October 29, 2019 at 11am Central Time for $129.95 shipped.