History is the best teacher in circumstances such as these, and history shows repeatedly that tariffs cause more harm than good. Sal, was Spyderco production affected by the steel tariffs imposed on China in 2002? I imagine Spyderco's production and output has changed drastically since that time, but how, if at all, was Spyderco impacted by previous steel tariffs? Was Spyderco even producing anything in China or using materials made there?
From 1789 until 1913 the US relied solely on corporate taxes and tariffs. We stayed out of foreign bs for the most part. We didn't give aid to every country that demanded it. We minded our own business. We were the freest country in the world. We were also, per capita, one of the, if not the, most individually prosperous countries in the world. A man could generally provide for his wife and 5 kids on his one paycheck. Kids in the 6th grade then were had higher levels of education than even a lot of college attendees now. Government basically stayed out of everything because they only had the money from corporations and tariffs. People were generally left to their own devices unless they were robbers or murderers or rapists. This country and how it was was genuinely the best country on the earth until they scammed us into the individual income tax, the federal reserve, and dropping tariffs. Next thing you know, we got involved in two world wars, the korean war, and everything since. We killed our own country because of taxing individual Americans rather than solely corporations and foreigners seeking to operate in the US.
Now i guess the paradigm is different. People would rather be taxed to death and corporations pay 0 after they exploit every loophole they can and foreign countries are free to drive us into the dirt. And Americans scream for it to happen because our economy has become so dependent on cheap materials and third world labor. We went from being a powerhouse who minded our own business to a house of cards in everyone else's business, ready to fall.
I almost welcome the American glasnost and perestroika. Maybe it'll wake us up.
The US didn't have much choice but to enter WW1 and WW11 after the attacks that occurred that made the US enter and declare war.
Plus the Zimmerman telegram re Mexico/Germany.
The rest after WW11 are debatable.
Re "foreigners seeking to operate in the US." Er, you can't have it both ways. Look at Toyota for example and
how many plants it has in the US.
3 x Endura 1 SE, 1 x Endura ? CE and a Black Pacific Salt. Want Aqua Salt, Fish Hunter and a Pacific Salt Yellow.
History is the best teacher in circumstances such as these, and history shows repeatedly that tariffs cause more harm than good. Sal, was Spyderco production affected by the steel tariffs imposed on China in 2002? I imagine Spyderco's production and output has changed drastically since that time, but how, if at all, was Spyderco impacted by previous steel tariffs? Was Spyderco even producing anything in China or using materials made there?
From 1789 until 1913 the US relied solely on corporate taxes and tariffs. We stayed out of foreign bs for the most part. We didn't give aid to every country that demanded it. We minded our own business. We were the freest country in the world. We were also, per capita, one of the, if not the, most individually prosperous countries in the world. A man could generally provide for his wife and 5 kids on his one paycheck. Kids in the 6th grade then were had higher levels of education than even a lot of college attendees now. Government basically stayed out of everything because they only had the money from corporations and tariffs. People were generally left to their own devices unless they were robbers or murderers or rapists. This country and how it was was genuinely the best country on the earth until they scammed us into the individual income tax, the federal reserve, and dropping tariffs. Next thing you know, we got involved in two world wars, the korean war, and everything since. We killed our own country because of taxing individual Americans rather than solely corporations and foreigners seeking to operate in the US.
Now i guess the paradigm is different. People would rather be taxed to death and corporations pay 0 after they exploit every loophole they can and foreign countries are free to drive us into the dirt. And Americans scream for it to happen because our economy has become so dependent on cheap materials and third world labor. We went from being a powerhouse who minded our own business to a house of cards in everyone else's business, ready to fall.
I almost welcome the American glasnost and perestroika. Maybe it'll wake us up.
The US didn't have much choice but to enter WW1 and WW11 after the attacks that occurred that made the US enter and declare war.
Plus the Zimmerman telegram re Mexico/Germany.
The rest after WW11 are debatable.
Re "foreigners seeking to operate in the US." Er, you can't have it both ways. Look at Toyota for example and
how many plants it has in the US.
The US really didn't have to get involved in WW2 in Europe, they were already at War with the Japanese.
Germany declared war on the US because Canada was already involved, so we got drug into it, but the US could have still stayed out of it until Germany was a real threat to the US. Nobody knows for sure if they would have really even been a real threat or not.
But I do agree everything after WW2 was a waste for the US and I don't believe the US should have been involved in any of them.
As the old saying goes and it's very true:
"If the Politicians had to fight the wars there wouldn't be any."
War only really benefits the very few, the small percentage that makes a fortune off of exploiting the masses.
Thanx for the clarification. Thanx also for the kind words.
154 is now powdered. We would use the powdered version. We probably won't use AUS8, but steels like VG-10, CTS-BD1N, are always in the schedule.
The current design in-the-works is planned for Seki construction in FRN. I'm waiting on a prototype. The US model I'm working on is still on the drawing board.
sal
C99c,
Im with you on lockbacks and less carbide rich steels! I've lost count of how many Spyderco lockbacks I own
One of my all time favs is the foliage green G10 Endura (VG10). I own lots of exotic super steels too but for day to day often carry "simpler" fare.
Well, here's the breaking news on the tariff situation: There is now a 90-day halt on imposing these new 25% tariffs. The existing tariffs will stay at 10%. That is contingent on China making reforms to stop their "intellectual property theft, non-tariff barriers and cyber theft". So we have a few more months.
Well, here's the breaking news on the tariff situation: There is now a 90-day halt on imposing these new 25% tariffs. The existing tariffs will stay at 10%. That is contingent on China making reforms to stop their "intellectual property theft, non-tariff barriers and cyber theft". So we have a few more months.
If you were to speculate on this, do you think China will make serious overtures to stop the counterfeit productions or is that so entrenched in their economic models and way of life that they will do everything they can to keep that going and to get around any rules against it?
I remember asking this question way back when it was still unknown how it would play out.
Thank you Sal for being so open and forthcoming with the information.
Well, here's the breaking news on the tariff situation: There is now a 90-day halt on imposing these new 25% tariffs. The existing tariffs will stay at 10%. That is contingent on China making reforms to stop their "intellectual property theft, non-tariff barriers and cyber theft". So we have a few more months.
If you were to speculate on this, do you think China will make serious overtures to stop the counterfeit productions or is that so entrenched in their economic models and way of life that they will do everything they can to keep that going and to get around any rules against it?
Makers in China counterfeit almost everything we make. Free trade, fair trade. BS.
sal
Sal, we all try the best we can to follow shiny footprints. You're a stellar exemplar of that motto. It's good to hear you say something that let's us know you're actually human :)
Thanks.
They who dance are thought mad by those who do not hear the music.
I will let my subconscious chew on Sal's question at the beginning of the thread, but my initial thought is: I will continue to trust Spyderco to deliver quality knives at fair prices.
Makers in China counterfeit almost everything we make. Free trade, fair trade. BS.
sal
Exactly. :)
And at what point is this BS going to change?
Ebay knows it, doesn't care. Reported about a dozen, even escalated to management. Nada. Every listing they remove they lose money.
When will the PRC change? Only when it costs them more than they make from cheating and stealing. Their mouth says one thing but their actions say another. The more you tolerate the less they respect you.
When will the PRC change? Only when it costs them more than they make from cheating and stealing. Their mouth says one thing but their actions say another. The more you tolerate the less they respect you.
I agree. But I think it’s harder than that.
It’s more a cultural thing, they just don’t think it’s wrong in any way.
In fairness, the cultural aspect of it is not confined to China. "Intellectual property" is a Western concept. After WW II we managed to impose respect for it on Japan and South Korea, but it took a couple decades. The way I see it, China now is where Japan was in the late 50's. Don't know if, when, or how much that will change, or whether the internet will further erode respect for IP in the West instead.
HI Sal well the way I see it premium steels with premium desirable qualities like those exhibited by LC200N or Elmax have always costed more. People like me will tend to purchase them anyway so I do not mind the price increase due to prevailing conditions which are completely out of your ability to control anyway.
In practical terms how much will it raise the suggested retail price of a Spydiechef for example?
I think where it will impact your business most of all will be in the budget knives so why not switch to a higher grade steel produced elsewhere and offer the budget knives with a better grade of steel if the end suggested retail price will be the same or even close.
There are some budget knives like the tenacious you produce in 8Cr13MoV that I will not purchase because of the steel used in them but really love the design.
