New? Immerse!

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.
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sal
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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby sal » Wed Nov 21, 2018 12:15 pm

Hi Zatx,

Thanx much for sharing your thoughts. And for the most part, I agree. A few corrections though. Gerber, Kershaw, Buck, etc, were around long before Spyderco by decades and in some cases generations.

I fully recognize that knife junky's such as yourself will customize to their preference and I have no problem with that.

We've had a influx of new people join our forum in the past year or so, and many of them have come to learn and share, What I've noticed also is that many folks fairly new to the world of "better" knives are judging them with limited experience and selling them without really giving the design a chance to be experienced. My suggestion was for them to take a second look at the design as a design and try to understand what the designer had in mind before dismissing the design. In that way, they will get more out of their hobby.

sal

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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby Doeswhateveraspidercan » Wed Nov 21, 2018 1:27 pm

Ya know Sal I have been accused of being an enabler here on this site when someone is on the fence about buying a knife but this thread..... ;)

I agree with you I purchased Chris Reeve knives first because of the look. That and they also cut good. I also bought a PM2 it was my first Spyderco and I did not like the big hole it did not look good to me. In fact by comparison I thought it looked cheap. Then I realized how perfect the Spydie Hole is compared to studs which also catch on material.

After a little while I found myself carrying the PM2 and using the heck out of it over the different Sebenza's (Spelling?) I also started off with smaller Sebenza knives before going full sized and found out swiftly a larger blade is really handy, not to mention not as likely to cut myself as was the case with closing the smaller models of that knife.

After selling the Sebenzas at a moderate loss, I was hooked on Spyderco. I have purchased and used severalPara 2's then Para3's some just for collection for the steel alone. Then came the Manix's then the sage5, then Yojimbo2 and man did I ever fall in love with the compression lock!

At first I was still trying not to be that guy with a big honking blade.

After Several Para 2's Then purchased a pair of full sized Lionspy's made with elmax and beautifuly polished blades absolutly love all the belly and awesom steel on these, as well as the incredible fit and finish, from here liking the larger blades purchased my first Military in CTS204P and after that started collecting those as well in different steels.

From here purchased a Spyderco Hungarian, then a Pacific Salt Serrated and of course just had to get 2 Spyderco 2018 Forum knifes. And the latest purchase was a Spydiechef I love it so much that I just purchased another one this time a CQI model today.


This is a very expensive hobby!!!!!


The truth of the matter is I have never met a spyderco I did not like and I usually buy two just in case I loose one.

Over the last few years I have learned what I like and those that I no longer want rarely hurt me that badly on the resale that I feel illused for having had the joy of the research the purchase the use and then the final sale.

Different steels in the same exact model will cut and sharpen differently and it is a joy to discover each one. Right now LC200N is really blowing me away by how well balanced it is in terms of ease of sharpening, blade retention, the way it cuts and of course I can leave it wet or not wipe it down 100% and it is still good to go.

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sal
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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby sal » Wed Nov 21, 2018 1:48 pm

Hi Whatever,

I don't think that many will become as passionate about the designs as perhaps you and I will (and maybe a few others here as well :p ). And I do agree that moderation in all things is good motto. But it does seem that you are surely peeling back the onion in your understanding.

sal

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Ankerson
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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby Ankerson » Wed Nov 21, 2018 1:51 pm

I tend to go more for designs that aren't over designed and or over engineered personally.

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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby colin.p » Wed Nov 21, 2018 1:54 pm

sal wrote:
Sun Nov 18, 2018 3:42 pm
As you keep an open mind and observe and learn, one finds: differences in steel and the "why", handle materials, ergonomics, mechanical (locks, opening methods, etc.), performance, edge geometries and a host of other courses in knife 101 to PHD studies.

I have observed that when someone is new, at least to this forum (and probably others as well), The emphasis is on "what I like". If it doesn't meet what "I think is right", then it is passed over, sold or whatever. I have also observed that when one has this view, one is not as open to what the designer may have had in mind.

What I am suggesting is that when you get a new knife, you use it, sharpen it, live with it, a taste of what the designer had in mind, rather than just how a knife looks, or what you think you like.



sal
I am finding that more and more. I initially did not like the design of Spyderco's blade shape, and even though I'm still not the biggest fan (I am slowly warming up to it), I can certainly appreciate the ergonomics and just how very usable Spyderco knives are. However, there are some aesthetic gems all the same.

A prime example I found is the Positron, among others. That is a knife that some people and some influential youtube reviewers panned rather severely, however I find it is a true gem. As long as we use the knife as it was designed and intended to be used, as an EDC, it is a joy to own and use.

I think we live in a very good period of time for knife buyers/collectors/accumulators. The variety and quality is quite staggering, to say the least. And keep up the great work Sal, I personally appreciate it.

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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby Doeswhateveraspidercan » Wed Nov 21, 2018 6:54 pm

Thanks Sal I love everything about Spyderco. When you and Eric talk on the videos out there you guys feel like family. I feel the same way you guys do about knives and yeah it is kind of strange. In a good way!

Happy Thanksgiving.

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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby bdblue » Wed Nov 21, 2018 7:10 pm

sal wrote:
Sun Nov 18, 2018 3:42 pm
most knives were selected by the "look" and "What I like the looks of". I say; "too much eye and not enough brain" ;)
You are correct and I have done that too although I look at a knife and try to determine how it will feel and function based on its looks. But I still liked the knife to look good. I have realized that function is more important than looks and I like to quote to people the old saying that "beauty is as beauty does", and function is the real beauty.

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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby Cycletroll » Wed Nov 21, 2018 8:49 pm

I've recently been carrying a D'allara 3 as an EDC. Really love the ergos and thin blade grind. Also really disappears in the pocket! At first I was turned off by reports of difficult lock but have come to find that it is quite easy to use and has broken in with use.
As Sal has suggested, I believe that living with a knife for awhile, day in and day out, helps develop a relationship that leads to more than a casual friendship.

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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby 500Nitro » Wed Nov 21, 2018 8:57 pm

bdblue wrote:
Wed Nov 21, 2018 7:10 pm
sal wrote:
Sun Nov 18, 2018 3:42 pm
most knives were selected by the "look" and "What I like the looks of". I say; "too much eye and not enough brain" ;)
You are correct and I have done that too although I look at a knife and try to determine how it will feel and function based on its looks. But I still liked the knife to look good. I have realized that function is more important than looks and I like to quote to people the old saying that "beauty is as beauty does", and function is the real beauty.
It took me a few times to realise this.

One I remember, had a BIG Bowie knife (like Crocodile Dundee). I tried to butcher a Kangaroo with it. Did the job but butcher was an understatement, you cant cleanly gut an animal with a 12' bladed Bowie lol

The other was cutting up heaps of Buffalo (like 20+ dead on the ground). The importance of having the correctly bladed skinners and filleters (and sharp).
3 x Endura 1 SE, 1 x Endura ? CE and a Black Pacific Salt. Want Aqua Salt, Fish Hunter and a Pacific Salt Yellow.

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shunsui
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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby shunsui » Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:36 pm

Some knives are better suited to killing animals, other knives are better at carving them up afterwards.

I keep a big knife by the front door, but I lend out my Endura as a steak knife sometimes.

Ric
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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby Ric » Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:30 pm

Sal, your theory works for Spyderco.
But some other brands do not have the quality and the skills.
Not all designers are that good.

Similar with IT. Often in computer programs you have to say "that cannot have made the bypass through the brain." or "If you have used your product 5 minutes you know that's not good."

Bad screws, sharp edges at the liner lock, not enough space to disengage the liner lock, thumbstuds that makes sharpening impossible.

Not everybody is perfect or close.

But you are right, newbies should give everything a try to grow and widen their horizon.

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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby 500Nitro » Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:44 pm

shunsui wrote:
Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:36 pm
Some knives are better suited to killing animals, other knives are better at carving them up afterwards.

I keep a big knife by the front door, but I lend out my Endura as a steak knife sometimes.
The only knife I know that's good for killing animals is a Pig Sticker (or bayonet but they can be heavy).

And even then people cock it up!
3 x Endura 1 SE, 1 x Endura ? CE and a Black Pacific Salt. Want Aqua Salt, Fish Hunter and a Pacific Salt Yellow.

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Tucson Tom
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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby Tucson Tom » Thu Nov 22, 2018 3:09 pm

I first saw this thread and figured that it was an announcement of a new nitrogen steel knife appropriate for use in salt water. But I decided to read it anyway.

I'm glad I did. As always, what Sal has to say has a lot to say about life and attitudes beyond the world of knives. When people are young, they think they know everything. Then again, when they get old, they think they know everything. I am battling the latter end of the curve.

I recently bought (and grumbled about) a Para 3 -- but I am keeping it and am open to seeing my attitude towards it change and develop. When I first heard about 52100 steel and read about it, I thought, "why would anyone be enthusiastic about a non-stainless steel?" But I now treasure my 52100 blades. My first impressions have been wrong more often than right and it absolutely takes some "road time" to find out how you and a given knife are going to get on. I pay attention though when something I have been passing up gets a lot of attention on the forum.

I'm not the kind of guy that buys things and then passes them on in short order. I have given a few knives away, but that is entirely different.

I may get out my Gayle Bradley folder (GB1), just to carry a knife today that I originally thought I would never enjoy.

I scratch my head over the idea of looking for "the one knife". I have so many knives that I enjoy for different reasons, never mind that are appropriate for different uses (and moods). The idea of the best steel or "best" knife design seems odd to me.

So, thanks to Sal for this thread.

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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby Mattysc42 » Fri Nov 23, 2018 4:01 pm

I always buy knives with function as my first priority. But, given the choice between two similarly functional knives, I'll always pick the one that looks better to me. Manix 2 over Paramilitary 2, Manix XL over Military, etc.
BRING ON THE MANIX XL SPRINTS AND EXCLUSIVES! And 10v or K390ify the Golden lineup, please.

Top 5 folders I’ve owned: Serrated Caribbean Leaf, Shaman, Manix XL, ZDP-189/CF Caly 3.5, Native LW.
Top 5 steels I’ve owned: LC200N, K390, CPM S90V, M390, CPM REX45.
Top 3 steels I want more of: M390 class, A11 class (including K390), CPM REX45.

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Evil D
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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby Evil D » Fri Nov 23, 2018 4:13 pm

Gotta be careful not to get sucked into the hype machine. If you watch all the review videos about a knife they'll fill your head with opinions before you've even held a knife and then if it doesn't meet your inflated expectations you'll get buyer's remorse since everyone else sees it as being so perfect.

As it stands two of my favorite models (Military and Manix 2) were models that I didn't like at all the first time I bought them and I immediately sold them off. It wasn't until I bought them again and started using and carrying them that things started to click. I have really particular tastes so on one hand I do feel like handling a knife is enough to tell me all I need to know (sometimes even just from pics) but I also know I've been proven wrong so I try really hard to keep an open mind and if I'm interested in buying a knife I pretty much commit myself to keeping it and start using it because I learn more from use in the long run.
SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
~David

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sal
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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby sal » Fri Nov 23, 2018 4:51 pm

One can experience "the knife", which is a physical manifestation of the concept or design. But the design ( concept, pure form ) can be thought of separately.

sal

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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby Doeswhateveraspidercan » Fri Nov 23, 2018 5:33 pm

sal wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 4:51 pm
One can experience "the knife", which is a physical manifestation of the concept or design. But the design ( concept, pure form ) can be thought of separately.

sal
Bowing before the Master🙏🏻

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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby knivesandbooks » Fri Nov 23, 2018 8:01 pm

sal wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 4:51 pm
One can experience "the knife", which is a physical manifestation of the concept or design. But the design ( concept, pure form ) can be thought of separately.

sal
Throwing out some Platonic thinking.
I've thought multiple times you should write a book, Sal.
I own an assisted knife and am embarrassed to admit I enjoy it.

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sal
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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby sal » Fri Nov 23, 2018 8:09 pm

Plato ( Socrates ) was one of my earlier mentors.

sal

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Archimedes
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Re: New? Immerse!

Postby Archimedes » Fri Nov 23, 2018 8:13 pm

I have sold hundreds of knives that looked cool....


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