AFI Performance Flash Batch

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.

AFI Performance Flash Batch Yes or No?

Yes
129
90%
No
14
10%
 
Total votes: 143

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ZrowsN1s
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby ZrowsN1s » Thu May 31, 2018 12:59 pm

Got 50+ on board so far :D
Carrying 3 knives is perfectly normal :D
-Matt

Some1
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby Some1 » Thu May 31, 2018 1:22 pm

Vivi wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 12:54 pm
xceptnl wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 9:55 am
Evil D wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 8:58 am
Vivi wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 2:25 am
I put thinner edges on every PE knife I buy. It'd be nice not having to once in a while. I could go for thinner stock and FFG on saber ground models I carry as well, both for cutting performance and to trim weight.


There is an ocean of difference between a thinner edge bevel and a thinner blade grind ;)
Precisely. I would venture to bet money that an Opinel with a 25dps will cut far better than a factory Millie with a 17 or even 12 dps edge.
A Millie with a 10DPS edge will outcut Opinels in most materials. I've EDC'd both.
Not in edc tasks. A milli with s30v at 10 dps per side will fail in most uses. Some very minor tasks it will excel. The primary bevel thickness trumps the secondary bevel angle. It's what it is. You can argue all you want. An opinel in whatever steel it uses will outperform a military in pressure cut testing 9 out of 10 times because it is thinner behind the edge by a significant margin and is fairly thinner at the spine, too.

Doesn't mean the opinel is a better knife. Far from it. But your statements, friend, are inaccurate. Maybe you can preface your statements to make them more accurate? Simply saying thicker s30v at 10 dps will out cut an opinel is bs. That's the truth for most people.

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ZrowsN1s
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby ZrowsN1s » Thu May 31, 2018 1:42 pm

Some1 wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 1:22 pm
....But your statements, friend, are inaccurate. Maybe you can preface your statements to make them more accurate? Simply saying thicker s30v at 10 dps will out cut an opinel is bs. That's the truth for most people.
Look I appreciate debate, and you're entitled to your opinion, but you're being more than a little presumptuous, and a tad rude.

If Vivi says in his experience having carried both he finds the 10dps Millie better for his uses, who are you to discount his actual experience?

I think thinner blades are better for some things, but not all things, and I know first hand what a 10dps edge can do.

Again feel free to state your opinion, but please don't come on this thread and start telling people their first hand experiences are inaccurate or bs. Or that they need to preface their statements to better fit your opinion. You can get your opinion across just fine without doing so.
Carrying 3 knives is perfectly normal :D
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Some1
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby Some1 » Thu May 31, 2018 1:48 pm

ZrowsN1s wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 1:42 pm
Some1 wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 1:22 pm
....But your statements, friend, are inaccurate. Maybe you can preface your statements to make them more accurate? Simply saying thicker s30v at 10 dps will out cut an opinel is bs. That's the truth for most people.
Look I appreciate debate, and you're entitled to your opinion, but you're being more than a little presumptuous, and a tad rude.

If Vivi says in his experience having carried both he finds the 10dps Millie better for his uses, who are you to discount his actual experience?

I think thinner blades are better for some things, but not all things, and I know first hand what a 10dps edge can do.

Again feel free to state your opinion, but please don't come on this thread and start telling people their first hand experiences are inaccurate or bs. Or that they need to preface their statements to better fit your opinion. You can get your opinion across just fine without doing so.
10 dps s30v with a .115" spine and .030 behind the edge will not out cut a knife with a tougher and harder blade that's 15 dps, .010 behind the edge, with a .100" spine. It just won't. In edc use, anyway. If you narrow it to solely cutting .5" hemp rope then it may but for everyday people it won't. Disagreeing with someone's opinion and asking them to clarify isn't rude, fyi. Well, it may be to people who can't answer up for their opinions.

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ZrowsN1s
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby ZrowsN1s » Thu May 31, 2018 2:07 pm

Some1 wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 1:48 pm
Disagreeing with someone's opinion and asking them to clarify isn't rude, fyi. Well, it may be to people who can't answer up for their opinions.
You're entitled to your opinion there. Please try not to miss my point, disagree, but don't call other peoples personal experiences and opinions on their edc BS. At least not in my thread anyways, you're welcome to start your own. It was rude (IMO).
Carrying 3 knives is perfectly normal :D
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby AccountDeletedUserRequest » Thu May 31, 2018 3:57 pm

Some1 wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 1:48 pm
10 dps s30v with a .115" spine and .030 behind the edge will not out cut a knife with a tougher and harder blade that's 15 dps, .010 behind the edge, with a .100" spine. It just won't. In edc use, anyway. If you narrow it to solely cutting .5" hemp rope then it may but for everyday people it won't. Disagreeing with someone's opinion and asking them to clarify isn't rude, fyi. Well, it may be to people who can't answer up for their opinions.
I thought we were comparing 10DPS to 25DPS?

I'll post a video of my D2 Military in use if you want to see it. Or I can go baton my ~12dps aqua salt.
Some1 wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 1:22 pm
Vivi wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 12:54 pm
xceptnl wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 9:55 am
Evil D wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 8:58 am




There is an ocean of difference between a thinner edge bevel and a thinner blade grind ;)
Precisely. I would venture to bet money that an Opinel with a 25dps will cut far better than a factory Millie with a 17 or even 12 dps edge.
A Millie with a 10DPS edge will outcut Opinels in most materials. I've EDC'd both.
Not in edc tasks. A milli with s30v at 10 dps per side will fail in most uses.
Maybe with how you use your knives. I EDC'd this D2 Military for 5 years with no edge issues, and I did light chopping with it and never babied it:

Image

If you don't believe me I will post a video of me cutting cardboard, plastic, power cables and chopping branches with it.

For perspective, this CTS204P Military was thinned down consirably compared to the factory edge, yet the bevel isn't even half as wide as that D2 Millie. This one also does fine with EDC stuff and light wood chopping:

Image

Factory edge S30V Military:

Image

D2 Millie:

Image

Cutting cardboard, apples, cucumbers, cheeses etc., night and day difference. It's like comparing a butter knife to a straight razor.


This S30V Para 2 held up to 5 years of EDC before it started having lock issues. The edge never chipped:

Image

Some very minor tasks it will excel. The primary bevel thickness trumps the secondary bevel angle. It's what it is. You can argue all you want. An opinel in whatever steel it uses will outperform a military in pressure cut testing 9 out of 10 times because it is thinner behind the edge by a significant margin and is fairly thinner at the spine, too.

Doesn't mean the opinel is a better knife. Far from it. But your statements, friend, are inaccurate. Maybe you can preface your statements to make them more accurate? Simply saying thicker s30v at 10 dps will out cut an opinel is bs. That's the truth for most people.
An Opinel ground at 25 degrees per side isn't thicker behind the apex than a Military ground at 10 degree per side. Behind the edge bevel it is, sure, but not right behind the apex. The Military will be more acute at the moment of penetration into the media it's cutting compared to the Opinel, not to mention edge holding advantages you can get in steels the Millie is offered in.

Imagine a 10°DPS wedge being hammered into a log VS a 25°DPS wedge, obviously the former will push through with less resistance. The geometry behind the edge bevel only matters with certain materials. It doesn't come into play if you're slicing 550 cord or opening your mail, but it does if you're dicing 20 potatoes.

You don't sound like a person that carries pocket knives ground at 10°per side. Per the pictures I posted, I am. Why should I value your opinion when I have a decade of first hand experience to go by?
Last edited by AccountDeletedUserRequest on Thu May 31, 2018 4:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Evil D
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby Evil D » Thu May 31, 2018 4:13 pm

Vivi I forget about that D2 Military. That thing is BA.
SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
~David

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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby AccountDeletedUserRequest » Thu May 31, 2018 4:17 pm

Evil D wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 4:13 pm
Vivi I forget about that D2 Military. That thing is BA.
It's not even my thinnest :D

Image

That ZDP189 Caly JR did chip a bit carving hardwoods. Does fine with cardboard though. It's fun to use.

Oh, here's another millie. S60V, first one I ever thinned out:

Image

And batoning an Opinel, why not:

Image

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Evil D
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby Evil D » Thu May 31, 2018 4:34 pm

Vivi wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 4:17 pm

And batoning an Opinel, why not:

Image


That's how it's done, unlock the pivot and let it move. I've done this with a Svord Peasant many times with no problems.
SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
~David

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Calicoast
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby Calicoast » Thu May 31, 2018 6:34 pm

Vivi,
wow that edge on that D2 Military is something else!

Really enjoy hearing about real world experiences with edges holding up over time. Especially with fish and bones.

PM2's: choose my M4 and M390 to send in for regrinds because I felt the tougher steel could hold up better for light > medium work. Seeing no chips makes me want to push edge a little more. Debating on sending in my Cruwear as well. They are just so nice with the regrinds.
-C

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xceptnl
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby xceptnl » Thu May 31, 2018 6:51 pm

This thread reminds me I need to build a 2x72 belt grinder this summer.
Image
sal wrote: .... even today, we design a knife from the edge out!
*Landon*

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steelcity16
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby steelcity16 » Thu May 31, 2018 6:58 pm

Someone please sell me on a thinner "slicer"? What types of tasks would this excel at? Are most of you cutting food? Slicing apples or full on dinner prep? Breaking down cardboard boxes into smaller pieces? Whittling hairs? I am a big DIY guy amd use my knives for virtually anything, and a lot of tasks I worry about chipping the edge.

I would however love to have one knife dedicated to breaking down cardboard boxes into smaller pieces to put into my recycle bin. So if this flash batch will make a knife optimized to blast through cardboard of all thicknesses then count me in.
:spyder: CRU-CARTA THEM ALL! :spyder:

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dj moonbat
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby dj moonbat » Thu May 31, 2018 7:04 pm

steelcity16 wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 6:58 pm
Someone please sell me on a thinner "slicer"? What types of tasks would this excel at? Are most of you cutting food? Slicing apples or full on dinner prep? Breaking down cardboard boxes into smaller pieces? Whittling hairs? I am a big DIY guy amd use my knives for virtually anything, and a lot of tasks I worry about chipping the edge.

I would however love to have one knife dedicated to breaking down cardboard boxes into smaller pieces to put into my recycle bin. So if this flash batch will make a knife optimized to blast through cardboard of all thicknesses then count me in.
Get a box cutter.

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Evil D
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby Evil D » Thu May 31, 2018 7:30 pm

:rolleyes:


Image
Image
SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby AccountDeletedUserRequest » Thu May 31, 2018 7:48 pm

those look good.

this thread reminds me, way back in the day when Tom Krein had just started doing regrinds, there was a passaround with a Centofante 4 he had done. Now that knife could cut!

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Evil D
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby Evil D » Thu May 31, 2018 7:54 pm

Vivi wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 7:48 pm
those look good.

this thread reminds me, way back in the day when Tom Krein had just started doing regrinds, there was a passaround with a Centofante 4 he had done. Now that knife could cut!

I can't recommend Big Chris enough. He may not be cheap but if you look at the sharpening notches on those blades, I put them in the original edge and they didn't get any smaller after the regrind. He is precise enough that he got that close to my edge but didn't remove any more steel than just thinning out the sides. A lot of regrinds I've seen required a new edge bevel to be put on afterwards but I don't believe Chris even needed to sharpen mine.
SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
~David

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Calicoast
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby Calicoast » Thu May 31, 2018 8:51 pm

dj moonbat wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 7:04 pm
steelcity16 wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 6:58 pm
Someone please sell me on a thinner "slicer"? What types of tasks would this excel at? Are most of you cutting food? Slicing apples or full on dinner prep? Breaking down cardboard boxes into smaller pieces? Whittling hairs? I am a big DIY guy amd use my knives for virtually anything, and a lot of tasks I worry about chipping the edge.

I would however love to have one knife dedicated to breaking down cardboard boxes into smaller pieces to put into my recycle bin. So if this flash batch will make a knife optimized to blast through cardboard of all thicknesses then count me in.
Get a box cutter.
I usually use my Krein Regrind knives for anything and everything that comes my way during the day. The other day I used my M4 to cut up thin perfect apple slices for the dehydrator. Usually use a benriner, but I guess I was bored.

When I am cutting cardboard, I will usually use a box cutter, but I was helping a friend move the other day and I broke down quite a few boxes, etc with my M4.
Next day, looked it over with a jewelers loupe and could not see any chips, + still slicing paper clean. I gave her a couple swipes on the sharpmaker at 30, and edge was really sharp and right back where I started. I am not the best at sharpening, but I am working on it. Not sure if I should leave it at 30, and then a microbevel at 40 for touchups? Seen that on a few old posts.

I like to go on hikes, fishing, etc. When I get the time to go out, I will bring my four dogs titanium biomass stick stove with me to boil water for cowboy coffee in the morning / lunch / dinner. On non fire band days when I dont use alcohol for fuel, I will usually rely on my knifes for more wood work. Nothing heavy, just feather sticks and light wood batoning. Multi-day trips, I will bring an ESEE or an Axe.

One of my favorite thin home slicers for Turkey, Ham, Tri-Tip, is a Case's XX Ace 223-10 from the 60's/70's. If Case can mass produce these, so can Spyderco. Just put in the disclaimer, and we can handle from there. :)
-C
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dj moonbat
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby dj moonbat » Thu May 31, 2018 9:12 pm

I'm sure you can get a reground knife that will do an absolutely kick-*** job as a dedicated knife for breaking down boxes. But it seems unlikely to do better than a knife that was literally built for that sole purpose. And even if you threw out a box cutter blade every few hours of work, how long would it take you to match the cost of the regrind? Probably longer than the reground knife itself would last.

I mean, if you WANT a really nice knife for breaking down boxes, go for it, I guess. But for a need that specific, an expensive pocketknife is a pretty general tool that has a lot of potential being wasted.

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Evil D
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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby Evil D » Thu May 31, 2018 9:33 pm

dj moonbat wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 9:12 pm
I'm sure you can get a reground knife that will do an absolutely kick-*** job as a dedicated knife for breaking down boxes. But it seems unlikely to do better than a knife that was literally built for that sole purpose. And even if you threw out a box cutter blade every few hours of work, how long would it take you to match the cost of the regrind? Probably longer than the reground knife itself would last.

I mean, if you WANT a really nice knife for breaking down boxes, go for it, I guess. But for a need that specific, an expensive pocketknife is a pretty general tool that has a lot of potential being wasted.


I think if we took this approach with every cutting task we wouldn't be here. You're definitely right but man that's a boring way to live.
SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
~David

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Re: AFI Performance Flash Batch

Postby AccountDeletedUserRequest » Thu May 31, 2018 9:43 pm

Thinner edges cut everything better, assuming you're not cutting something that's too much for the edges to handle. Not just cardboard :)


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