Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

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tonijedi
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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby tonijedi » Sat Jun 29, 2019 4:15 pm

SpyderEdgeForever wrote:
Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:15 am
Can someone here please explain to me why this lock has opened the blade accidentally for some and not others? Is it an issue of the movement of the individual person and where the folded knife is placed on their person?
I can't really answer that question but I can tell you in my case the PM2 was the only knife to ever open in my pocket. I carried it for some weeks and it opened by itself 3 or 4 times. No other knife ever opened in my pocket, on any situation.
I like the ergonomics on the PM2 but I don't carry it because it's too big for my uses, the tip is too thin and it uses a lot of pocket space. But I understand the beauty of the compression lock, sure it's easy and fun to use.

glutofknives
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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby glutofknives » Sat Jun 29, 2019 5:21 pm

I would definitely prefer the detents to be stronger in spyderco compression locks and liner locks than they are now.

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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby dodgie02 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 5:57 pm

I only own one pm2 out of my 6 that came with a weak as hell detent. I could open it with a flick like you do on 940s. I had to disassemble it and carefully bend the lockbar inwards to increase tension, as it was definitely a no go otherwise. Not a perfect solution, but one nonetheless. Aside from those pm2's I own a sage 5, Para 3, ikuchi as well-and I'm probably leaving some out. All of which came with perfect detents on their compression locks. I didn't return it because it was an imported knifecenter cruwear model and I'll likely exchange it with a liner out of a decommissioned blurple pm2 I've got lying somewhere. Just leaving this for customer feedback.

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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby Edward_Scissorhands » Sun Jan 12, 2020 2:35 pm

I was just thinking about this, and came across this thread. I've had a Sage 5 (liner lock) partially open in my pocket once. I was carrying it loose in a front pocket (not clipped to anything). I was really surprised to have this happen, but luckily, no harm, no foul. The comp locks are way more fun to play around with, but I like that the back locks have that self-closing tendency. If I always carried it clipped with the blade edge toward the pocket seam, I'd feel pretty safe, but I do occasionally like to just toss a knife in my pocket. Seems like a back lock would be a safer choice for this type of carry?

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Wartstein
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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby Wartstein » Sun Jan 12, 2020 2:37 pm

Edward_Scissorhands wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 2:35 pm
I was just thinking about this, and came across this thread. I've had a Sage 5 (liner lock) partially open in my pocket once. I was carrying it loose in a front pocket (not clipped to anything). I was really surprised to have this happen, but luckily, no harm, no foul. The comp locks are way more fun to play around with, but I like that the back locks have that self-closing tendency. If I always carried it clipped with the blade edge toward the pocket seam, I'd feel pretty safe, but I do occasionally like to just toss a knife in my pocket. Seems like a back lock would be a safer choice for this type of carry?
Just courious:

You mean a Sage 1 (which would have the liner lock you mentioned) or actually a Sage 5 (which would feature the comp.lock)?
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Tucson Tom
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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby Tucson Tom » Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:23 pm

This old witch hunt of a thread -- risen from the dead!

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Wartstein
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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby Wartstein » Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:27 pm

Tucson Tom wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:23 pm
This old witch hunt of a thread -- risen from the dead!
Was it really that bad??
Can´t recall, did not look into it once more, just quickly asked the "reviver" ;) of the thread a question concerning Sage 5 /Sage 1...
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Tucson Tom
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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby Tucson Tom » Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:42 pm

Wartstein wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:27 pm

Was it really that bad??
No, it wasn't.

But as long as you are taking note. I was thinking earlier today about some things you have said, or that I think you have said. (Is there something wrong with me if I am thinking about comments made on this forum while making breakfast and washing dishes?)

Anyway, I'll swear you said something about disliking the compression lock and I wondered why. Not that you are required to like it, but I am always interested when people have strong opinions opposite to my own. Especially when they are people whose opinion I respect.

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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby Edward_Scissorhands » Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:51 pm

Wartstein wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 2:37 pm
Edward_Scissorhands wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 2:35 pm
I was just thinking about this, and came across this thread. I've had a Sage 5 (liner lock) partially open in my pocket once. I was carrying it loose in a front pocket (not clipped to anything). I was really surprised to have this happen, but luckily, no harm, no foul. The comp locks are way more fun to play around with, but I like that the back locks have that self-closing tendency. If I always carried it clipped with the blade edge toward the pocket seam, I'd feel pretty safe, but I do occasionally like to just toss a knife in my pocket. Seems like a back lock would be a safer choice for this type of carry?
Just courious:

You mean a Sage 1 (which would have the liner lock you mentioned) or actually a Sage 5 (which would feature the comp.lock)?
Sorry, yeah, I think it's a Sage 1. Liner lock for sure.

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Wartstein
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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby Wartstein » Sun Jan 12, 2020 4:06 pm

Tucson Tom wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:42 pm
Wartstein wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:27 pm

Was it really that bad??
No, it wasn't.

But as long as you are taking note. I was thinking earlier today about some things you have said, or that I think you have said. (Is there something wrong with me if I am thinking about comments made on this forum while making breakfast and washing dishes?)

Anyway, I'll swear you said something about disliking the compression lock and I wondered why. Not that you are required to like it, but I am always interested when people have strong opinions opposite to my own. Especially when they are people whose opinion I respect.

Thanks for your kind words (in your last sentence...:) )

No, I really do NOT dislike the compression lock!!!
I even think it's a very clever, strong and ingenious design (and have stated this several times).

It's just that I personally came to prefer other lock types over it, and yes, I have my own reasons for that.

What made me perhaps sometimes give the impression I actually would dislike the comp. lock, were comments where people compared it to the back lock, saying they hated this lock, it would bei mpossible to operate smoothly, quick and safe and the comp. lock would be vastly superior in any aspect.

That made me defend the backlock, mainly cause I did not want people new to folders (maybe lurkers on this forum) shy away from great designs just cause they feature a backlock and their false believe those would be SOOO awkward to operate.
And by defending and comparing the backlock to the comp. lock, I may have given the impression that I'd dislike the latter, but that was never my intention

It's true though that I'll always take a backlock over a comp lock if I can, but that does not mean a comp. lock would be a total dealbreaker for me! It just so happens that Spyderco has enough great backlock knives for me and so of right now, other than one PM2, I solely own backlock Spydies and am happy as it is... still, the comp.lock Shaman, Caribbean and Sage 5 LW are very intriguing for me and who knows... :rolleyes:

Tom, please let me give you my reasons why I came to prefer other locks over to comp. lock (but again, I still don't dislike the comp lock!!) tomorrow... tbh, I am already lying half asleep in bed (it's past 11 pm where I live) and typing this on my Smartphone... :)
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

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Tucson Tom
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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby Tucson Tom » Sun Jan 12, 2020 4:19 pm

Wartstein wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 4:06 pm
Tom, please let me give you my reasons why I came to prefer other locks over to comp. lock (but again, I still don't dislike the comp lock!!) tomorrow... tbh, I am already lying half asleep in bed (it's past 11 pm where I live) and typing this on my Smartphone... :)
By all means! Get your sleep. I'll look forward to what you have to say tomorrow.

I also sometimes take a look at the forum on my phone when laying in bed just before going to sleep. Sometimes it ends up with me jumping out of bed and posting some comment on my real computer though (I hate typing more than a short phrase on my phone).

I really like the compression lock. And to add some data to this thread (and not veer utterly off topic), I have never had it open accidentally in my pocket or anywhere. And I am a great admirer of the Shaman. In fact I am carrying my M4 Shaman today. But I am not one of these people who thinks there is one best thing. I like all kinds of locks, backlock and comp lock included. I even like both trad climbing and sport climbing.

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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby bdblue » Sun Jan 12, 2020 7:57 pm

Liner lock and compression lock don't have an affect on how easy it is for a knife to open, there is a little detent built into the blade independent of the lock type that keeps it closed. This little detent can wear and make the blade easier to open but I can't tell that any of mine have worn or changed appreciably. The BBL is a different system and won't weaken with time nor can I imagine it allowing a blade to open prematurely. None of my Spyderco knives have ever opened accidentally, they all seem to have sufficient detent. I had an older knife from another brand that did open a few times by accident, it had almost no detent. I had another knife from that brand that had almost no detent but it never opened accidentally. Spyderco knives have pushed all of those other brands out of my collection.

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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby kennethsime » Sun Jan 12, 2020 9:56 pm

There was a time when I was carrying a PM2 tip-down, as I had lost my Torx driver. I have a vague recollection that I reached into my pocket and my wrist grazed a partially-open knife blade. I bought a new Torx driver the next day, and have carried tip-up ever-since.
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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby Bill1170 » Mon Jan 13, 2020 12:30 am

Never happened on either PM2 in 5 years of EDC use. I carry tip up, RFP.

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Wartstein
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Re: Has your compression lock knife opened accidentally?

Postby Wartstein » Tue Jan 14, 2020 1:12 am

Tucson Tom wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:42 pm
Wartstein wrote:
Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:27 pm

Was it really that bad??
No, it wasn't.

But as long as you are taking note. I was thinking earlier today about some things you have said, or that I think you have said. (Is there something wrong with me if I am thinking about comments made on this forum while making breakfast and washing dishes?)

Anyway, I'll swear you said something about disliking the compression lock and I wondered why. Not that you are required to like it, but I am always interested when people have strong opinions opposite to my own. Especially when they are people whose opinion I respect.

Tom, as promised, I´ll reply and give you some of my points on the compression lock (also vs other locks)

But since this lock debates had a tendency to get rather heated in the past and to sometimes culminate in a bit weird "backlock brigade" and the like wordings, let me clearly state beforehand once more:

I do like the compression lock!
I think it is a cool, clever, strong and ingenious design,
For many it is the preferred lock type and I can totally get that.

It´s just that at this point in my personal "knife journey", for my preferences and the way I use knives (and am used to use knives) I came to prefer Spydercos midbacklock, the CBBL and even - though just slightly - a good liner lock (like on the Millie) over the comp.lock.
But still I´d take most Spyderco comp.lock knives over knives of other brands that have a different lock type!

Now finally to why just for me personally the comp.lock, though I in no way DISlike it, is not my first choice:

- Though I never (!) had a comp.lock knife come open in my pocket, I generally still prefer locktypes with a bias to closing (backlock, CBBL) over detent based locks

- The "fingers never in the blade path" when closing the knife is really not a thing for me and just imho should not be for any experienced knife user - especially on knives that feature a choil (it might very well be one for beginners though!).
But let´s say it were "a thing": The way a comp.lock knife is closed with "fingers never in the blade path" is the main method of "pinching" the handle and the lockbar with thumb and index finger and "swing" the blade in the closed position. For me that´s a bit awkward, unnatural (referring to how a knife is normally held) and unsafe in regard to the risk of dropping the knife (especially in cold, wet conditions, with numb fingers and so on) Plus I can really do the same when pressing the lockbar of a backlock with my index finger and "swing" the released blade to close (or with a CBBL od course, not with a liner lock)

- A backlock offers me more and also safer ways of closing the blade one handed.
With a complock I have for one the method described above. If I now I use one of the main "backlock" methods (releasing the locktab / lockbar, and "guiding" the blade to the closed position with the index finger in the opening hole) on a comp.lock, a comp.lock is both more awkward and "unsafe", for the blade is "loose" and "flopping around" when the lock is released, while I can guide the blade of a backlock to the half closed position in which it will remain then , can remove my fingers out of the way and conveniently close the blade by pressing on the spine - the blade will snap into closed position with no finger in the way.

- A linerlock for me feels much more natural when I start to close the knife / release the lock bar, cause I can basically keep my hand in a regular knife grip while doing so. One finger just moves slightly to release the lock, and I have another finger to conveniently guide the blade towards closed.
The same procedure is a bit less natural with a comp.lock, for I have to move one finger to the locktab on the upper side of the handle. Admittedly that´s also the case with a backlock, but as said, a backlock has the advantage of staying securely in a half closed position by itself if I want it to do so.

- Generally I find comp.locks (depending on the specific knife) a bit harder to operate with gloves (mittens) or cold, wet, numb fingers, so in less than ideal conditions. The tab on some models is rather small and recessed and a bit easier to miss than lets say a linerlock- or backlock bar.

- Backlock knives by design always have a closed back, which I prefer comfortwise to open backs a bit (no one would design a comfortable fixed blade handle and deliberately create a gap at the "spine" of the handle,right?)

- I personally like to flick my knives with each finger and "one hand close" using several methods. This - for me - is not really satisfying with a comp.lock, cause it is just to easy and you have to almost "learn no skill" compared to a backlock. But OF COURSE this can be seen as a PLUS for the comp.lock!

- So concerning just MY uses and preferences,the comp.lock is more for smaller, more "urban" / "office" EDC folder, not so much for larger outdoor folders used in snow, mud, rain and the cold. The Shaman and the Caribbean just for me should come with a backlock (if possible constructionwise, which it - at least for the Shaman is NOT. The Shaman blade AND a backlock would not really fit in that handle Sal once said).

- A comp.lock by design seems to require a bit thicker bladestock to really work reliably. At least I think a (thin) knife like the Chap could not be done with a comp.lock

Now to be fair, here are some clear PROS of the comp.lock:

- The most "flickable" and "fun to play" with lock right from the get go (so also for beginners)
- I am covinced: Very strong by design (but tbh, in practical use even a Spyderco liner lock is more than strong enough)
- It certainly HAS the easiest "fingers never in the blade path" closing method if that is a concern
- It allows certain constructions and designs a backlock would not (Shaman...)

/ So much for now... hope not to lengthy and that it does make a bit sense, I am in a hurry (have to go to work), so wrote this rather hasty

Closing remark, once more:

I DO like the comp.lock, I am glad I could (and still can on my PM2) experience it, I get that many love it, think everyone should try it, I just PREFER other lock types even over it these days ;)
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40


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