Shipping of internal parts

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Mushroom
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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby Mushroom » Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:11 pm

The Deacon wrote:
jpm2 wrote:it would be unreasonable to not pay for the service and parts, imo.
Agree, the real question is whether overseas customers will be willing to pay for it, or whether it will just change the whine from "I can't believe I can't get parts" to "I can't believe they want $NN to ship a part that weighs so little and costs so little".
That sounds much too accurate!
buccilli15 wrote:I echo Hugaso's statement; in all my years of collecting and using knives, not once have I needed an internal part. Your current policy seems very fair to me.

The rare exception might be a well-documented "issue" and a foreign customer. From the other thread...I totally understand the customer's frustration. Instances like this could be case-case where Spyderco will send out a spare part considering the circumstances.
+ 2 on that! I still haven't had a need for any parts for my Spydies.

I can understand the reluctance of international customers shipping their knife back for service with shipping costs as outrageous as I've read in other threads. Though, I still agree that the logistics of stocking so many different parts for so many different knives, which are all open to the CQI process, seems a little unreasonable.
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Bloke
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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby Bloke » Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:56 pm

I have zero issues with my Spyders. :)

It is however reassuring to think I could buy available replacement parts direct from Spyderco should the need arise and of course I'd be willing to pay for the service! :cool:
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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby Bill1170 » Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:59 pm

I also have never needed an internal part for any Spyderco knife. The current policy makes sense to me. Living in the USA I have the option to send in a broken knife. It sucks to be far away and to need service, but Spyderco can’t fix the whole world, can they?

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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby Liquid Cobra » Mon Feb 26, 2018 6:04 pm

Living in Canada I don’t want to risk not getting my knife back after shipping it to Golden so I would gladly buy new parts if it was an option and yes, I’d be happy to pay for them.
A couple bullet points though..

- I’ve only ever sent in one knife to golden and i was very happy with the service I received. But that was before the new CBSA rules.

- I’ve never required parts for any of my knives with exception of pocket clips. I’ve broken plenty of them over the years.

- Again, living in Canada I pretty much accept that If my knife gets messed up I’m on my own. It’s sort of like being a second class citizen of the knife world, but that’s not Spyderco’s problem.


I also wanted to say that I appreciate Sal starting this discussion.
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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby Hopweaver » Mon Feb 26, 2018 6:15 pm

This is why I love Spyderco. They have their thumb on the pulse of their customers and deal with them head on. Whether or not there are any policy changes, at least they are listening to the concerns, actively participating in the conversation, and evaluating the best possible solutions. Bravo Sal!

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As for spare parts for my ever growing collection of Spydercos, I don't mind sending the knife in for spa treatment... even at my own expense. It is a small price to pay for the value I feel I get from your knives.

But if you were to offer parts for 'some' of your top sellers in the future I would probably be a parts customer at some point. I like to take my knives apart and get them squeaky clean and lubed for best performance. But I am a tool guy and learned a lot from Dad who was a machinist.
:spyder: Make time for the important things in life, and learn to enjoy the little things more. :spyder:

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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby NickShabazz » Mon Feb 26, 2018 6:40 pm

I'd happily pay for spare parts, or particularly, for a "Parts kit" for a given SKU, containing a set of screws, washers/bearings, etc. Yeah, you'd get stuff you don't need, but for a knife I hope to have for the long game, I could see keeping that around.
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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby ChrisinHove » Mon Feb 26, 2018 6:43 pm

I've never needed any internal part BUT I am an avowed "late adopter". Things I buy tend to be well proven.

If comprehensive parts availability were essential, then moving forward, so would the case for use of standardised components. I don't believe that's needed, however.

What would be reasonable would be the availability of a small inventory of replacement or improved components where there is a known issue. Off the top of my head this would be bearing pivots/washers, early UKPK springs, perhaps lock-back springs. Perhaps also baggies of torx screws, as people seem to lose or strip these quite often. Spyderco must know which will be the most requested.

Personally, I would rather pay for parts than for shipping, warranty repair and a customs seizure gamble (I heard someone had a PITS seized from the post into the U.K. recently!!!). I've also bought clips from the SFO and thought the cost very reasonable.

It's like the Spyderco warranty: most of us will never need it, but it's very existence contributes to the confidence to buy in the first instance.

On a final note, I don't think the "You chose to buy a Spyderco product when you're not located in the USA, so you should accept a lesser service or warranty" is a particularly healthy one, despite it's repetition in one form or another, nor one that stands up to comparison with other good American or international companies.

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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby mattman » Mon Feb 26, 2018 6:59 pm

I think the first thing is to try to start a database for the most requested parts (I assume screws). The varients are going to be numerous, among the common thread sizes. Endura clip screws are longer than Delica clip screws. (Delica clip screws won't reach the threads on an Endura) This is the most basic beginning, on the most common models, and there's already a surprising variant... Then you start trying to track all the CQI variants, to see where interchangeability occurs, and things will spiral exponentially. Screws a lil too long? Fine for most things, but in the "four position clip" world, too long might be ok for tip-up, but tip-down is now got a binding pivot, because your clip screws are too long...

The problem is, Average Joe Knife Tinkerer, that doesn't know how to deal with simple thread-locker, has no comprehension of the complexity of what they're demanding of Spyderco.

I would like to see a program implemented, but I would also expect it to be limited to current, popular models, until such a time that the logistics are in place to expand to more models... Possibly working down through the models in order of descending sales volume.

Begin a feasibility/pilot program with Paras, Millies, and Delicas, and see where things are in a year?

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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby elmeringalo » Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:08 pm

Hello Sal, I think it's a great idea to give the possibility, above all, to customers who do not live in the USA, to be able to obtain any damaged part of our Spyderco, without having to send the complete knife to Golden. Of course I would pay for it. In our case, I think that the cost would always be lower than sending the knife and the risk of losing it will also be eliminated. Likewise, the determination, both of the model and of the variant, should be the responsibility of the client, at least I would accept it that way. I understand the difficulty of maintaining a stock of all the pieces of all your knives, but if the piece exists, it is better that nothing, if it is obviously exhausted will not be available and it is already there. Anyway, I have more than 150 Spydies and by the moment, except for some screw of a pocket knife bought secondhand, I have not needed any interior piece. Thank you for considering the possibility of having our Spyderco in good condition, from Spain
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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby Molle Ninja » Mon Feb 26, 2018 8:59 pm

I say make them available for a premium. Make it worth it to Spyderco to bother with inventorying the parts, and make it slightly painful for the customer to screw (get it?) with her knife.

Think HK pistol parts. Wow, $12 for a spring? Well, okay!

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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby Rollout » Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:06 pm

Most impressive Sal. This is my second thread to comment on. The first was the thread that sparked this one. I am new to Spyderco and knives. My first one just arrived. I am the proud owner of a Sage 5. I admit I was taken aback when I discovered the possibility of not being able to get replacement screws and washers, should I ever need them. I am mechanically inclined, and lots of my enjoyment in a hobby or collecting is centered around that. I applaud your willingness to listen to your loyal customers here and the new guys like myself. I could go on, but I'll just add my two cents to the questions at hand. I understand that it's a significant task to stock everything. I have many years as a parts department manager for General Motors dealers. My suggestion would be to supply screws for the most used knives, like Delica and the Para knives. All parts would be a Utopia and we'd all love it, but thats not a fair request to you. For all other knives, how about a user accessable database that gives screw specs? Washers would be the next thing we would like access to. If we had easy access to that information, sourcing the fasteners would be much easier. It would keep us off your telephones and everyone would be happy. I admit I dont know the business of mass production on knives, but I'd think they all have a blueprint or something similar. The information we seek could be found there maybe. I would absolutely expect to pay for anything and shipping that you supply to us.

Again, thank you for listening. I find your participation in this forum most impressive and in my personal experience, unique. I'm looking forward to rapidly growing my Spyderco collection!!!

Scott

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MichaelScott
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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby MichaelScott » Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:08 pm

For, say, a PM2, how many user replaceable items are there, and how many different ones (variants over the full production life) are there? That might give us a good idea of the numbers and variability due to CQI changes there would be across Spyderco's current range of knives. Being there are other models and variants out there not in production today, that number would be significantly larger. What scope are we discussing?

Edit: I just saw that Rollout posted, “For all other knives, how about a user accessable database that gives screw specs? Washers would be the next thing we would like access to. If we had easy access to that information, sourcing the fasteners would be much easier. It would keep us off your telephones and everyone would be happy.“

This appears to be a feasible and good idea. Comments?
Last edited by MichaelScott on Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby araneae » Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:09 pm

I have only ever needed clips or screws for the many Spydies I own. I have had no problem requiring other internal parts and if I thought my knife had an issue, I would send it in. I understand that for those outside the US, this is less convenient, but life isn't always convenient. I think your crew always does your best to make people happy and that is good enough for me.
So many knives, so few pockets... :)
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The "Spirit" of the design does not come through unless used. -Sal

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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby araneae » Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:17 pm

Rollout wrote:For all other knives, how about a user accessable database that gives screw specs? Washers would be the next thing we would like access to. If we had easy access to that information, sourcing the fasteners would be much easier. It would keep us off your telephones and everyone would be happy. I admit I dont know the business of mass production on knives, but I'd think they all have a blueprint or something similar. The information we seek could be found there maybe. I would absolutely expect to pay for anything and shipping that you supply to us.
Scott
The CQI on models means that from year to year, minor tweaks could mean slightly different hardware on the same model over time, which would greatly complicate any sort of database. You would need to reference model #, and production date code and Spyderco would have to catalog every rolling change made for every model over time. That could be a big task.

And FYI, they will send you screws. I am not sure how anyone wears knife washers out, hasn't happened to me yet.
So many knives, so few pockets... :)
-Nick

Just got: Wharncliffe & Waved D'flies

The "Spirit" of the design does not come through unless used. -Sal

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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby ross8425 » Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:40 pm

I have several Japanese models, but most are Golden knives. The only knives I have taken apart are Manix 2, Para 2, and Para 3. I would only be interested in buying a set of replacement screws and washers for those models as it relates to your question. For example, I kind of like the stainless screws on one of my pm2 knives that has black to match the dlc blade. It would just be something for me to tinker with. But if I used the stainless screws from a different pm2, it wouldn't look right ..

Plus I would not be as concerned about stripping a screw if I had a back up screw kit, bag, whatever haha.

Taking the manix apart was probably not something I would do again, after doing it once. The lock mechanism plastic piece I was really gentle with. I was afraid I was going to break it. I also was paranoid about launching that ball across my office like I did with a 1911 spring.

Thank you for making these informational posts, really cool of you to do so.

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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby Rollout » Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:44 pm

The CQI on models means that from year to year, minor tweaks could mean slightly different hardware on the same model over time, which would greatly complicate any sort of database. You would need to reference model #, and production date code and Spyderco would have to catalog every rolling change made for every model over time. That could be a big task.

And FYI, they will send you screws. I am not sure how anyone wears knife washers out, hasn't happened to me yet.[/quote]

Good points. As I stated, I am unfamiliar with knife production. It just stood to reason from my automotive experience , that even design tweaks woukd still have a blueprint with information on changes. That might not exist in this realm, but just an idea I thought might help.

As far as getting screws, I asked that question directly on another thread and never got a direct answer from anyone. I just formulated the opinion that they wouldn't reading a lot of the posts here. Honestly I don't know how you'd wear out a washer either, but it's the next most likely thing to be lost. Obviously screws are my main concern, and I hope I won't need any of those. Thank you for finally answering a question for me with a concrete statement.

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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby SpyderNut » Mon Feb 26, 2018 11:01 pm

First off, thanks for letting us weigh in on this, Sal. :spyder:

In nearly 17 years of collecting and using Spyderco knives, I’ve only once had to call the SFO for a missing part (namely, a missing handle screw from a FRN Manbug. My father-in-law lost the screw, so we were very willing to pay for a replacement). As I recall, the kind folks sent me two screws at no cost.
Over the years, I personally never found a reason to disassemble any of my Spydercos, therefore I never had a need for replacement parts. However, I realize a lot of folks today, both domestically and internationally, seem to enjoy taking their knives apart and/or modifying their knives. This presents a problem when parts come up missing or broken and they want to have the ability to purchase a part or two to fix an otherwise good knife. I understand that. However, I think that the whole concept of offering internal parts is going to quickly become an “all or nothing” scenario. In other words, Spyderco will ostensibly need to have parts available for every knife, past and present, as well as for all variations of said knife. If Spyderco only provides parts for some models and not others, folks will likely cry injustice and renounce Spyderco as being a less than quality brand.

Having said that, if it is unavoidable and parts must be sold, I agree with making a test run involving parts for only certain models over a period of time and then evaluating the pros/cons of that test run. If the test run works and seems feasible, maybe consider opening things up on a broader scale?
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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby Larry_Mott » Tue Feb 27, 2018 1:33 am

I can't for the life of me see how someone would *need* replacement parts, unless they have FUBAR-ed it themselves.
Again, a knife is not a gun or a LEGO model made to be disassembled "for maintenance" (that's a good one) or for the satisfaction of fidgeting.
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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby Squawk » Tue Feb 27, 2018 2:08 am

Interesting discussion. As an overseas-customer i'm all for new options of course, although i don't think that it would be necessary for Spyderco to provide internal parts. I maintain and take apart my knives myself and fully understand the consequences. I also try to use the right knife for the right job ( that's why we have so many anyway, right? :D ), so until now i never had the need for internal parts. What i do sometimes need are new screws, because over time they tend to wear out ever so slightly and once i even got a probably returned knife with a very worn pivot screw. Glad to say that yet Spyderco always took care of me although they did not necessarily have to (thanx again Charlynn).
However, i think it would be nice to have specs for screws and maybe washers available.
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Re: Shipping of internal parts

Postby Larry_Mott » Tue Feb 27, 2018 2:41 am

Squawk wrote:Interesting discussion. As an overseas-customer i'm all for new options of course, although i don't think that it would be necessary for Spyderco to provide internal parts. I maintain and take apart my knives myself and fully understand the consequences. I also try to use the right knife for the right job ( that's why we have so many anyway, right? :D ), so until now i never had the need for internal parts. What i do sometimes need are new screws, because over time they tend to wear out ever so slightly and once i even got a probably returned knife with a very worn pivot screw. Glad to say that yet Spyderco always took care of me although they did not necessarily have to (thanx again Charlynn).
However, i think it would be nice to have specs for screws and maybe washers available.
No disrespect, but what you described is what i'd call "overzealous, unnecessary maintenance" Now, the knife i have carried the longest and used hardest, hands down is the 1993 Delica Clipit. It served as daily user for more than 12 years. Got dropped in mud puddles, forgotten on a trailer stabbed in a sideboard and made a 930 miles round trip :) etc etc. Granted, it couldn't be disassembled due to the construction, but i wouldn't have done it regardless since it is not necessary! It makes as much sense to me as to loosen an engine from its mounts at regular service and clean the contact surfaces.
Just my opinion, but in my case it holds water.
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