Tip up or down from the factory, why?

[LDB]

Every one of my knives arrived with the clip set for tip up carry except for my PM2 which came tip down. What determines the direction from the factory for each model? Every one of them came set for right hand carry as well but since that is 90% of the population it makes sense. And I'm a righty. I wanted to be a lefty like my dad but never could learn to be left handed. Anyway, enough sidetracking, I'm curious what determines the tip direction and also to see what each subsequent knife is set to from the factory.

[Evil D]

Fairly sure Sal/Eric decide what they think is best, or at least I recall reading something about Eric preferring tip down on one of his models. I'd be fine if the clip and screws came separate in a bag so people can choose where to mount them, so you don't get that flat spot on your G10.

[Surfingringo]

My guess would be that on the knives with 4 way clip option, they position the clip on the larger models for tip down and the smaller ones for tip up. I would also speculate that the cutoff (between what's designated large/small) would be somewhere in the 3.5" range.

...and in the interest of debunking my own theory I will point out that the pm2 has a 3.44" blade and comes mounted for tip down while the Stretch 2 has a 3.45" blade and comes mounted for tip up. So, what do I know? :rolleyes: :D

[The Deacon]

Models that use liner, RIL, and compression locks, all of which provide relatively weak blade retention when closed are almost always either drilled and tapped for only tip down carry or shipped set up that way.

[Evil D]

My guess would be that on the knives with 4 way clip option, they position the clip on the larger models for tip down and the smaller ones for tip up. I would also speculate that the cutoff (between what's designated large/small) would be somewhere in the 3.5" range.

...and in the interest of debunking my own theory I will point out that the pm2 has a 3.44" blade and comes mounted for tip down while the Stretch 2 has a 3.45" blade and comes mounted for tip up. So, what do I know? :rolleyes: :D

Even their own size logic on the Military is debunked when the Police 4 is shown tip up. At least I think it was..

[bdblue]

There is likely some preference at the factory. I like tip down so I'm happy that the PM2 comes that way. I notice that in most photos the PM3 is tip up so they must feel differently about it. I've never seen a new one so I assume it comes that way from the factory. From my past experience a smaller knife like this works about equally well tip up vs. tip down. I don't know all of the knives that are 4-way drilled but I find it interesting that the Gayle Bradley 1 and the Vallotton come set for tip up. Maybe that is the preference of the 2 collaboration partners. I have one of each and I left mine tip up.

[vivi]

My guess would be that on the knives with 4 way clip option, they position the clip on the larger models for tip down and the smaller ones for tip up. I would also speculate that the cutoff (between what's designated large/small) would be somewhere in the 3.5" range.

...and in the interest of debunking my own theory I will point out that the pm2 has a 3.44" blade and comes mounted for tip down while the Stretch 2 has a 3.45" blade and comes mounted for tip up. So, what do I know? :rolleyes: :D

Police 3, Manix XL, Szabo folder (both runs)...all set tip up from factory.

Models that use liner, RIL, and compression locks, all of which provide relatively weak blade retention when closed are almost always either drilled and tapped for only tip down carry or shipped set up that way.

Yojimbo 1 & 2, Salsa, Tenacious, Catbyrd....all tip up from factory.


No idea what decides it, I don't notice any trends myself.

[bdblue]

Police 3, Manix XL, Szabo folder (both runs)...all set tip up from factory.

Yojimbo 1 & 2, Salsa, Tenacious, Catbyrd....all tip up from factory.

No idea what decides it, I don't notice any trends myself.

Manix 2 and Manix XL are tip up so the clip doesn't interfere with the BBL.
Tenacious comes tip down from the factory.

[vivi]

My tenacious came tip up, same with my c95 manix

[para-para-paramilitary]

I used to rotate the way I carry my knives. I came to the conclusion that tip down just works. You pinch it at the top, pull it out and your thumb is already at the deployment hole vs tip up where you have to rotate your knife and do some adjusting to get to the deployment hole.
Sometimes the clips are way too stiff and you end up holding the knife way down (near the lanyard hole) by the time you get them out of your pocket

[LDB]

Yes, I like tip down but was questioning why knives leave the factory set a certain way, not which way is better when carrying.

[bearfacedkiller]

It is just Sal and Eric's call or in the case of collaborations the collaborators call. When asked why the Para2 comes tip down Sal said that Eric designed the Para2 to be his ideal EDC and he wanted it tip down. Sometimes the design dictates the clip position and sometimes it is just whatever they desire.

Sal has said that he originally prefered tip down on knives but has learned to like tip up. I am having a harder time learning to like tip up myself. If it was up to me every knife would be tip down.

I have tried to analyze why I prefer tip down. I find it easier to draw and deploy for sure. I also think that it has to do with carrying a Buck110 for most of my childhood in a belt sheath tip down. I have been carrying tip down since before I was carrying clipped knives.

[Evil D]

I only really have two problems with tip down.

1) I feel the clip more in my grip when using it. To be honest though this is an issue with any clip but I seem to dislike it more when the clip is at the pivot end.

2) It puts the spine of the blade facing outward in my pocket, and though I don't carry anything else in my knife pocket I have a habit of walking around with my hands in my pocket so the spine jumping is always scratching up my hand going into my pocket.

Otherwise I could probably live with tip down on every knife just fine. I find it interesting how some people have had knives come open in either orientation, because it seems impossible for tip up to open if you're carrying it clipped to the outside of your pocket, while personally the only knife to ever come open in my pocket was a Para 2 carried tip down (well, a Ladybug on my keys but that's a different issue). I've never had an issue with a Military opening and I've been carrying them for a good while now. My work involves crawling around on the ground and my clips get scratched up just from the pavement so there are lots of opportunities for them to open. If you're carrying tip up with the spine anywhere other than against the seam of your pocket I think you're asking for trouble.

[vivi]

Otherwise I could probably live with tip down on every knife just fine. I find it interesting how some people have had knives come open in either orientation, it seems impossible for tip up to open if you're carrying it clipped to the outside of your pocket, while personally the only knife to ever come open in my pocket was a Para 2 carried tip down (well, a Ladybug on my keys but that's a different issue). I've never had an issue with a Military opening and I've been carrying them for a good while now. My work involves crawling around on the ground and my clips get scratched up just from the pavement so there are lots of opportunities for them to open. If you're carrying tip up with the spine anywhere other than against the seam of your pocket I think you're asking for trouble.

I always carry my primary EDC knife tip up IWB. Never had any lockback open on accident which is why they're my favorite lock type.

I've had tip up and tip down knives come open. Para 2 twice, once clipped to my rear pocket with the spine not up against the seam of my pocket, once in the cell phone pocket of carhartts where it was against the seam.

Had a Millie come open as well, and a Kershaw. The latter was RFP against the seam, the Millie was IWB. I've since sworn off detent based locks for knives going in my pocket. Lockbacks have a flawless record for me so I see no reason to go with a lock where this will be a concern.

I'm basically a little kid in an adult sized body. I run, I climb rocks, I jump off of stuff that's pretty high because it looks fun. I skateboard. I mountain bike. During all of this I usually have a Pacific Salt clipped IWB, never anything other than the lockback spring keeping it closed. I think lock type matters more than clip position.

One other issue I had with tip up on certain models like the Military is when I draw the knife the jimping catches on the lip of my pocket sometimes.

I find tip up much easier to draw. On any knife Police 3 or smaller I draw it in the same exact grip I use to open it, no shifting or rotating needed. On larger knives like a Tatnka or Szabo folder I have to shift my grip some, but no more than on tip up knives which are impossible to draw in my opening grip.

[jmh58]

I very rarely change clip position.. I use them the way they came 99% of the time.. I have removed them on a few though!! John

[LDB]

But the question/topic isn't personal choice, it's what determines how they are shipped from the factory and why?

[bdblue]

My tenacious came tip up, same with my c95 manix

Possibly your Tenacious wasn't totally new. Check the photos on the Spyderco website- they all show tip down. The 4 that I bought new all came tip down.

[Surfingringo]

My tenacious came tip up, same with my c95 manix

Possibly your Tenacious wasn't totally new. Check the photos on the Spyderco website- they all show tip down. The 4 that I bought new all came tip down.

My first pm2 came (from KW i believe?) with the clip mounted for tip up. Possible someone changed it and returned it but it's certainly possible that one escapes the factory like that on rare occasions. Human beings in the factory are screwing those clips on. Somebody is bound to be daydreaming once in a blue moon.

[Joris Mo]

It always seemed to me that the PM2 is tip down because the PM had been tip down without the option for tip up.
Maybe most blades should come from the factory with a tip up clip since that seems to be most popular. It would be a shame for even less people learning to appreciate tip down carry because they might never try it.. (I tend to prefer tip down)

[Slumblor]

The pm2 ships tip down, but I remember them saying when the para 3 came out that the majority of the pm2s they saw come in for service had been swapped to tip up, so they decided to set the para 3 to up at the factory.