Para 2 as EDDC

[Bloke]

Darn Dao ... coming soon!

[mb1]

These videos won't answer anything we are debating here, but I enjoy them.

Doug Marcaida "Unrealistic Filipino Martial Arts Training" https://youtu.be/M3I_dlku2PA

Elite Gun VS. Elite Knife, Doug Marcaida vs. Instructor Zero uncut footage https://youtu.be/2fjMpn7JCJ0

Funker puts out some good no BS videos. Have you seen the ones with Fred Mastro ? The live blade defense is the craziest thing I've seen on camera. :eek: That one seemed to genuinely raise Marcaida's eyebrows. The other guy I enjoy on there is Ryan Hoover.

[chuck_roxas45]

Just for the pleasure of beign a contrarian,i must say a knife is the worse SD tool ever.Firt,the attack will start with you having your knife in the pocket,and by the time you will have it in your hand,open,it will be all over.

What other weapon that you carry will be in your hand when the fight starts? Well, a cane of course, if you can get away with carrying one. Let's say you opt for a weapon of opportunity like a brick. Can you be sure you are conveniently near one all of the time?

Second,if you will use a knife as a deterent and you will brandish it to your attacker in those days,you will be on camera menacing a guy with a knife;you will mutate from victim into agressor.Besides,acording to an old saying from the blade culture,a blade should be felt,not seen.

If there's a camera wouldn't it also show that you are the attacked party?

A jacket,a pen,or a rolled up magazine are way better tools to defend yourself.

How are those better defensive weapons when they inflict much less damage. If some people doubt a razor sharp knife's ability to stop an attack, good luck with a rolled up magazine or a pen.

Third,if your life style requires to carry a knife to defend your life-the only case when you should consider using a knife on another human beign-maybe you should change your life style.

It's not that easy for some people. It may not be a matter of lifestyle but a matter of where you live.

The knife was the most convenient concealed self defense weapon for centuries until guns were invented. Even then a knife can be better than a gun in some situations.

[tonijedi]

Just for the pleasure of beign a contrarian,i must say a knife is the worse SD tool ever.Firt,the attack will start with you having your knife in the pocket,and by the time you will have it in your hand,open,it will be all over.Second,if you will use a knife as a deterent and you will brandish it to your attacker in those days,you will be on camera menacing a guy with a knife;you will mutate from victim into agressor.Besides,acording to an old saying from the blade culture,a blade should be felt,not seen.A jacket,a pen,or a rolled up magazine are way better tools to defend yourself.Third,if your life style requires to carry a knife to defend your life-the only case when you should consider using a knife on another human beign-maybe you should change your life style.

Thank you.
I'll had that pulling out a knife on an unarmed assailant is bluffing and if the bad guy goes the "all in route" you may have just provoked an attack that wasn't going to happen on the first place.

[chuck_roxas45]

I'll had that pulling out a knife on an unarmed assailant is bluffing and if the bad guy goes the "all in route" you may have just provoked an attack that wasn't going to happen on the first place.

That's really a reach. If an unarmed assailant will attack you when you have a weapon, he was going to attack you anyway when you still had no weapon.

Do you guys really think that an unarmed guy is harder to fight than a guy with a sharp knife?

Besides as has been mentioned by the OP, it IS a LAST RESORT. You wouldn't try to bluff a guy who is just talking trash. You try to DETER the attacker from continuing the attack and if he persists(assuming of course, that you can't evade the attack) in attacking, then you do what you can and what you have to do if your life(or loved ones lives) are in danger.

[tonijedi]

I'll had that pulling out a knife on an unarmed assailant is bluffing and if the bad guy goes the "all in route" you may have just provoked an attack that wasn't going to happen on the first place.

That's really a reach. If an unarmed assailant will attack you when you have a weapon, he was going to attack you anyway when you still had no weapon.

Do you guys really think that an unarmed guy is harder to fight than a guy with a sharp knife?

No, but a guy that's just harassing you to feed his ego or a thief that just wants your iPhone may step up their game because YOU FORCED them.
Violence is not black and white, it comes in many shades. You can "win" on some of those shades but not on all of them. Part of the game is picking those shades. Don't escalate something that doesn't need to be escalated.
If you have some terrorist shooting at you with an ak47 Use a knife, use a bazooka. If you pull out a knife on someone you are forcing trouble, not avoiding it.

[bearfacedkiller]

I thought this thread was about the suitability of the Para2 vs the Military for SD? It has turned into a lot of arguing about other stuff.

Of course we would all rather have a Marine Raider Bowie than a Para2 in a fight. That wasn't the question.

A rolled up magazine? Thanks for helping me start my day with a chuckle...

Vivi, you have big paws! You make that Para2 look tiny!

[chuck_roxas45]

No, but a guy that's just harassing you to feed his ego or a thief that just wants your iPhone may step up their game because YOU FORCED them.
Violence is not black and white, it comes in many shades. You can "win" on some of those shades but not on all of them. Part of the game is picking those shades. Don't escalate something that doesn't need to be escalated.
If you have some terrorist shooting at you with an ak47 Use a knife, use a bazooka. If you pull out a knife on someone you are forcing trouble, not avoiding it.

Well, we're not talking about a guy that's just harassing you or just wants something you have. If you escalate on any of those situations, you are just plain dumb.

When it's last resort, it's life or limb we are talking about.

What you are doing is changing the conditions that the OP is talking about.

If you pull out a knife on someone you are forcing trouble, not avoiding it.

Have you experienced this?

[tonijedi]

I thought this thread was about the suitability of the Para2 vs the Military for SD? It has turned into a lot of arguing about other stuff.

Of course we would all rather have a Marine Raider Bowie than a Para2 in a fight. That wasn't the question.

A rolled up magazine? Thanks for helping me start my day with a chuckle...

Vivi, you have big paws! You make that Para2 look tiny!

The arguing about the other stuff is defining the problem, so we can reach an answer to the main question. I think that's important.
The problem is defining self defense and taking it apart from street fighting and knife fighting.
I'm questioning the mindset of carrying a knife for self defense. Not the actual use of a knife on some very specific situations. I'm not even getting into technical details of violence evolving knives.

[tonijedi]

No, but a guy that's just harassing you to feed his ego or a thief that just wants your iPhone may step up their game because YOU FORCED them.
Violence is not black and white, it comes in many shades. You can "win" on some of those shades but not on all of them. Part of the game is picking those shades. Don't escalate something that doesn't need to be escalated.
If you have some terrorist shooting at you with an ak47 Use a knife, use a bazooka. If you pull out a knife on someone you are forcing trouble, not avoiding it.

Well, we're not talking about a guy that's just harassing you or just wants something you have. If you escalate on any of those situations, you are just plain dumb.

When it's last resort, it's life or limb we are talking about.

What you are doing is changing the conditions that the OP is talking about.

No I'm not. OP talked about the deterrent factor of drawing a knife.

[chuck_roxas45]

No I'm not. OP talked about the deterrent factor of drawing a knife.

Yes, but only in a particular situation. Not in the conditions that you were mentioning.

Obviously, last resort is when an attack can no longer be avoided.

What will you do if you are attacked?

[bearfacedkiller]

My point is that in the big picture the Para2 and the Military are more similar than they are different and that this conversation has long since over complicated the decision between two very similar knives.

Nobody asked if a knife should or should not be used for self defense. Again, that wasn't the question.

I regret even participating in this thread now. :confused:

[chuck_roxas45]

...

I regret even participating in this thread now. :confused:

Right, me too. Elvis has left the building.

[Bloke]

What will you do if you are attacked?

I'd probably call h8speech.

[chuck_roxas45]

What will you do if you are attacked?

I'd probably call h8speech.

LMAO! Just gotta post this last. You made my evening Bloke. :D

[Bloke]

What will you do if you are attacked?

I'd probably call h8speech.

LMAO! Just gotta post this last. You made my evening Bloke. :D

:cool:

[bearfacedkiller]

I plan to pick up a Spyderco Paramilitary 2 to use as my everyday defensive carry knife. I have a Military now and love it but now want the 4-way capability of the Para 2 clip.

First, I've read about the "drag" of the DLC coating when slicing but I think that applies more to food prep. Is it a practical consideration for EDDC? I doubt it so I suppose it comes down to aesthetic and corrosion resistance. My Military is satin and I love it but I do like the Black DLC on the Para 2.

I'm debating the digi camo vs. the black handle but as this EDDC will double for when I'm wearing my suits for business, the black handles will disappear better in my pocket.

Lastly, what is a comparable and perhaps better consideration for EDDC in this category? Although I'm pretty confident the Para 2 fits the bill, I'm open to suggestions.

If you want a four way clip and easy carry in slacks then maybe you should consider the Endura. It is in between the Para2 and Military in size.

Bloke, as usual, your comic relief is much appreciated. :D

[mb1]

Self defense can be an interesting topic. But there are too many variables to get a definitive "answer" in an internet debate. It depends on you, the other guy, the circumstances, and God forbid...the jury.

Heels will be dug in, jaws set, and we shall march onward to page 12...or further...

[fivesense]

Just for the pleasure of beign a contrarian,i must say a knife is the worse SD tool ever.Firt,the attack will start with you having your knife in the pocket,and by the time you will have it in your hand,open,it will be all over.Second,if you will use a knife as a deterent and you will brandish it to your attacker in those days,you will be on camera menacing a guy with a knife;you will mutate from victim into agressor.Besides,acording to an old saying from the blade culture,a blade should be felt,not seen.A jacket,a pen,or a rolled up magazine are way better tools to defend yourself.Third,if your life style requires to carry a knife to defend your life-the only case when you should consider using a knife on another human beign-maybe you should change your life style.

From the peaceful European perspective...

[ZrowsN1s]

These videos won't answer anything we are debating here, but I enjoy them.

Doug Marcaida "Unrealistic Filipino Martial Arts Training" https://youtu.be/M3I_dlku2PA

Elite Gun VS. Elite Knife, Doug Marcaida vs. Instructor Zero uncut footage https://youtu.be/2fjMpn7JCJ0

Funker puts out some good no BS videos. Have you seen the ones with Fred Mastro ? The live blade defense is the craziest thing I've seen on camera. :eek: That one seemed to genuinely raise Marcaida's eyebrows. The other guy I enjoy on there is Ryan Hoover.

I have not, I'll check them out. Thanks :D

...
I don't know, compared to some of the thread melt downs I've seen lately, this went OK :rolleyes: I think I did actually answer OP's original question, but just in case, yes a PM2 is just as capable as a Military. We've remained fairly civil, don't know that we've reached any consensus on self defense in general, but I like a good debate. I have a feeling that self defense is a lot like sharpening a knife, a technique and set of tools that work well for one person, might yield disastrous results in someone else's hands. If you find something that works for you, keep doing it.

I would pick a 3.2 inch Karambit over a 10 inch bayonet for superior weapon retention, control, speed, concealment, and versatility of motion (with the ring and hooked blade, Karambits can be impact and grappling tools as well as cutting tools). The only thing the bayonet has in the plus column is, it's big, has a reach advantage, and you are more likely to hit a vital when stabbing.

Just for fun here's a pic of a few of the knives I have lying around that I'd pass over for my Karambit, Yojimbo 2, or PM2. I bought most of these in the 90's, my taste in knives was.. different then :D