Those darn serrations

[DougC-3]

Deep serrations are great for slicing through thick wood stems but do tend to snag more with plastic packaging, etc. At some point I'll try to snag me one of those Jazzed up SE Delicas and give shallow serrations a try

[roger-roger]

. There are a lot of things I love SE for

Could you perhaps tell me some, please?

Like you showed in your vid, it's also way easier to cut at an angle in cardboard. Weird, but true.

I like to cut things you don't normally associate with serrations, like zip ties and wires, things that tend to slip off a PE blade. They're really useful if you do any gardening or cutting small plant stems. Obviously there's rope and such. Probably the most useful task I've found is any time you're cutting something in a pull cut that may slip off a PE blade. Serrations have a grabbing effect similar to a hawkbill. That's why a serrated hawkbill can be a lot of fun.

This, you hit the nail on the head.

I'm not the usual knife user, and the placement of multiple razor utility knives all over the house and garage tends to confirm this. I EDC for potential emergency situations. My two EDC's are a Gen 2 Delica, and Gen 1 Endura, both SE. SE excel at starting an awkward cut.

[Joshua J.]

What is the best way to sharpen the serrations?

Benchstone, a fine rod, and a strop.
The demonstration I saw used a belt sander instead of a stone but I still say that's overkill.

Do all your grinding on the underside of the serrations, then just use the rod to knock the burr off Inside the scallops.
It's almost faster than sharpening a PE blade since you just about never switch sides.
It's also the only way to perfectly maintain the shape of the scallops as they were ground at the factory.

Think of a serrated edge as though it's just a chisel grind, and because a chisel edge uses one of the primary grinds to form the cutting edge, you can grind that without altering the serrations.
You're thinning the blade at the edge to make it sharper rather than making it narrower from edge to spine.

As mentioned you can use the corner of a strop to get inside serrations as well, but again, you can strop the underside flat like any other knife.

The big problem is you're probably going to take off most of the coating on one side if you try doing that with a black blade.

[akaAK]

I have always been a fan of serrations but agree to each his own.

Yard work I don't do without my CE Millie. Trimming branches, cutting cord (trimmer cord) zip ties, opening bags of all kinds, cutting pots off plants. etc

As for sharpening I just run it down the corners of the sharpmaker 5 times draw, 5 times push and then 1 time each on the opposite side. depends on how dull put this never fails me. I prefer the rounded off serrations so this works great for me. if you want to keep the points it may not work as well

I am waiting on my SE Para 2, CE Para 3 and SE Jazz Delica now

[ThePeacent]

................... but the Salt 1, while very sharp, just did not like cardboard. I think the serrations on the Delica wharnie...

It's weird :confused: I have a totally different experince.My serrated Salt1 likes cardboard veeery much :eek:

Marius

all the SE Salts are cardboard-eaters per nature

[elena86]

What is the best way to sharpen the serrations?

Benchstone, a fine rod, and a strop.
The demonstration I saw used a belt sander instead of a stone but I still say that's overkill.

Do all your grinding on the underside of the serrations, then just use the rod to knock the burr off Inside the scallops.
It's almost faster than sharpening a PE blade since you just about never switch sides.
It's also the only way to perfectly maintain the shape of the scallops as they were ground at the factory.

Think of a serrated edge as though it's just a chisel grind, and because a chisel edge uses one of the primary grinds to form the cutting edge, you can grind that without altering the serrations.
You're thinning the blade at the edge to make it sharper rather than making it narrower from edge to spine.

As mentioned you can use the corner of a strop to get inside serrations as well, but again, you can strop the underside flat like any other knife.

The big problem is you're probably going to take off most of the coating on one side if you try doing that with a black blade.

Cool :cool: I have to try this.My method is to sharpen scallop by scallop since I like my serrations as pointy and agressive as possible.May I ask what kind of benchstone ? I supose it's a fine one.I own the fine Spyderco benchstone...

Marius

[Joshua J.]

What is the best way to sharpen the serrations?

Benchstone, a fine rod, and a strop.
The demonstration I saw used a belt sander instead of a stone but I still say that's overkill.

Do all your grinding on the underside of the serrations, then just use the rod to knock the burr off Inside the scallops.
It's almost faster than sharpening a PE blade since you just about never switch sides.
It's also the only way to perfectly maintain the shape of the scallops as they were ground at the factory.

Think of a serrated edge as though it's just a chisel grind, and because a chisel edge uses one of the primary grinds to form the cutting edge, you can grind that without altering the serrations.
You're thinning the blade at the edge to make it sharper rather than making it narrower from edge to spine.

As mentioned you can use the corner of a strop to get inside serrations as well, but again, you can strop the underside flat like any other knife.

The big problem is you're probably going to take off most of the coating on one side if you try doing that with a black blade.

Cool :cool: I have to try this.My method is to sharpen scallop by scallop since I like my serrations as pointy and agressive as possible.May I ask what kind of benchstone ? I supose it's a fine one.I own the fine Spyderco benchstone...

Marius

My favorite benchstone is the 11.5" Aluminum Oxide stone sold be Lee Valley: http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/page.a ... at=1,43072

Of course any stone will work, I just find having something that big makes freehand sharpening easier in general.

I do have and use all the Spyderco benchstones as well, another investment that I have absolutely no regrets about.
Ironically I don't have a Sharpmaker, just one of each rod.

[Mora2013]

I have always been a fan of serrations but agree to each his own.

Yard work I don't do without my CE Millie. Trimming branches, cutting cord (trimmer cord) zip ties, opening bags of all kinds, cutting pots off plants. etc

As for sharpening I just run it down the corners of the sharpmaker 5 times draw, 5 times push and then 1 time each on the opposite side. depends on how dull put this never fails me. I prefer the rounded off serrations so this works great for me. if you want to keep the points it may not work as well

I am waiting on my SE Para 2, CE Para 3 and SE Jazz Delica now

Im not new to sharpening, but I am new to spyderco. I've always thought that rounded off serrations would be just as sharp, and would snag less. May not work as well on tomato or bread (skin with soft insides), but should still excel. Is this your experience with spyderedge?

[akaAK]

You are exactly right about snagging less while remaining just as sharp. I haven't seen any real drop off in performance with slightly rounded tips. The delica and endura seemed to have the more rounded points and shallower scallops from the factory.

When sharp I haven't had an issue with the food mentioned but you already know a Dullish plain edge will struggle more than a dullish serrated. I don't use folders much in the kitchen but recently got an se spyderco kitchen sharp, the one with the corian handles and g10. I touched it up in the same manner but those points stay for a number of sharpenings.

Welcome to the forum by the way. It is an amazing place. I stared here with a little knowledge and a lot of interest. Moved from never sharpening a knife to being reasonable proficient freehanding. Looks like you join us with a good understanding already.

[Evil D]

I've thought about deliberately rounding off the points on a SE knife and sharpening them so that the edge is basically just really wavy. It would lose a bit of the penetration effect that the points have but I also think that only applies in certain situations. Rounded points still benefits from focusing your cutting force onto a much smaller surface area so they would still initiate a cut faster than PE. I think an edge like this would still have the grabby effect that I like with serrations but would also be less prone to snagging, while also being much easier to sharpen.


One situation keeps coming to mind about SE, where I don't think I could have done the job with PE. I was working in a warehouse with these big steel racks where pallets of merchandise are stacked. Between pallet spots we were adding some heavy plastic mesh fencing to keep locations separate. I had to do some trimming on this fencing and I could only do it with one hand because I had to reach far back into the steel rack. I happened to be carrying my SE Stretch that day and the serrations made it possible to hook the mesh and pull and make the cut. There's just no way I could have made those cuts with PE. Of course, this is a pretty unique situation and most people may never find themselves doing something like this but you never know. I actually have fun looking for ways to use one edge or the other. Too many people think of this subject as an absolute this or that choice, and I think they're cheating themselves out of having a little fun.

[DougC-3]

I think the bigger (wider and deeper) and more pointy serrations, like those on the Pacific Salt, D'Allara, and Rescue 3, etc, are great for lopping hedge branches and the like, so I try to preserve them when sharpening, which I really haven't needed to do much, especially with the VG-10 blades. These blades of course tend to snag more in regular around-the-house use, opening tough plastic bags, etc, so lower peaks, whether from the factory or from sharpening, might be better for that.

[ThePeacent]

I've thought about deliberately rounding off the points on a SE knife and sharpening them so that the edge is basically just really wavy. It would lose a bit of the penetration effect that the points have but I also think that only applies in certain situations. Rounded points still benefits from focusing your cutting force onto a much smaller surface area so they would still initiate a cut faster than PE. I think an edge like this would still have the grabby effect that I like with serrations but would also be less prone to snagging, while also being much easier to sharpen.


.

Over time my SE Salts have become very rounded and I haven't found many problems with them that way, they still are very aggressive and cut like a chainsaw with frequent touch ups on the Sharpmaker





they are noticeably less "grabby" for sure, but they are way better than any PE for most of my cutting needs



my sharpening technique is not the best, BTW

[Evil D]

my sharpening technique is not the best, BTW

Mine is a but unorthodox but it's very effective.

https://youtu.be/O3oK8nKkX0A

I've since replaced the tapered diamond rod with a Sharpmaker, but I still lightly buff my serrations and the results are impressive. I keep the diamond rod around in case I need to repair a chipped tooth.

[Donut]

................... but the Salt 1, while very sharp, just did not like cardboard. I think the serrations on the Delica wharnie...

It's weird :confused: I have a totally different experince.My serrated Salt1 likes cardboard veeery much :eek:

Marius

You know, a lot of people in the self defense world don't like serrations because if you have clothing, the serrations tend to pull the clothing instead of cutting it.

[Mora2013]

You are exactly right about snagging less while remaining just as sharp. I haven't seen any real drop off in performance with slightly rounded tips. The delica and endura seemed to have the more rounded points and shallower scallops from the factory.

When sharp I haven't had an issue with the food mentioned but you already know a Dullish plain edge will struggle more than a dullish serrated. I don't use folders much in the kitchen but recently got an se spyderco kitchen sharp, the one with the corian handles and g10. I touched it up in the same manner but those points stay for a number of sharpenings.

Welcome to the forum by the way. It is an amazing place. I stared here with a little knowledge and a lot of interest. Moved from never sharpening a knife to being reasonable proficient freehanding. Looks like you join us with a good understanding already.

Thanks for the welcome. I come from the tool world where I've done a lot of sharpening of things like wood chisels, saw blades, drill bits etc.

I've also been pretty much a traditional style knife guy (thus my username, same as on bladeforums) that has just picked up a few spyderco knives. So I'm here trying to pick up some spyderco knowledge.

The pocketknife is something that's used variably by folks, therefore it seems that everyone's needs and requirements are different. So preferentially sharpening serrations "rounded" vs. "pointy" may serve different uses.

[Jazz]

I say do it on the Sharpmaker until they're rounded off too much, then reprofile with some appropriate shaped diamond rods, etc., then do it all again. What a huge hassle trying to keep their exact shape every sharpening.

[elena86]

................... but the Salt 1, while very sharp, just did not like cardboard. I think the serrations on the Delica wharnie...

It's weird :confused: I have a totally different experince.My serrated Salt1 likes cardboard veeery much :eek:

Marius

You know, a lot of people in the self defense world don't like serrations because if you have clothing, the serrations tend to pull the clothing instead of cutting it.

I don't see the relevance.We are talking cardboard here.Being forced to use a knife in self defense I would never go for the clothing area of the body.I would target the joints, the face or the neck.I hope I will never be pushed so hard.

Marius

[anagarika]

Better pull & rip than slip off clothing in dire situations IMHO.

[Donut]

I don't see the relevance.We are talking cardboard here.

I'm saying that depending on what kind of cardboard it is and how soft the cardboard is, it could want to bunch up and drag instead of cut.

[Jazz]

... I would never go for the clothing area of the body.

Marius

Umm, people do cover themselves in clothes, you know. Especially in winter. Just sayin'...

But anyway, I just went to town sharpening the Salt 1 again. The scallops will shave finger hair. I'll try again with various cutting mediums.

You know, I was watching vids on serrations, and notice they say they cut so well, yet I see when they're cutting something, they have to yank and rip just like me. Maybe I'm spoiled by really sharp plain edges. I don't like the serrations getting hung up and having to be yanked whilst they bounce about on rope, etc.

And another thing... Dave, you got me saying SERRated, instead of serrAted (just watched your vid again). I just noticed while talking to my wife. :p