Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.
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ChrisinHove
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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby ChrisinHove » Mon Mar 27, 2017 12:30 pm

The Deacon wrote:Ok, so ACMA is selling a PM2 with a US MSRP of $210 for 213,70€, which works out to $232.28 (or about 10% over MSRP) at current exchange rates. However, they're also selling a Benchmade 590BK Boost AO, with a US MSRP of $180 for 213,70€, which is obviously an even more inflated price. So, as with HH, it does not seem as if it's just Spyderco knives. Know I'm treading dangerously close to "tickling Polly", but perhaps this is more about payback for our new administration's attitude toward goods produced overseas than anything else.
I hadn't heard that any mutual trade tariffs or anything like it had been implemented. It would certainly be big news if they had. Also the retailers would be pretty quick to point the finger (if it weren't already occupied).

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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby vilePossum » Mon Mar 27, 2017 12:34 pm

Nope, has nothing to do with trump. ACMA prices have been like this for a while.

The thing is that there is just no reason for me to buy locally. Add to that the unfriendly support at ACMA... well, whatever. I would rather deal with customs (who piss me off every time) than pay those super inflated prices. Whenever I am on a trip to the states I will try to grab at least one spyderco.

Sadly there is one alternative... which has also been popping up on European forums more and more... don't buy spyderco (or benchmade). Chinese companies are pressing into the European market with very aggressive pricing and excellent quality. Don't get me wrong. I love spyderco knives, but reate, kizer, we knife etc are really something to consider here in Europe if you don't mind the style or some of the European brands. (I'd say us Europeans are less sensitive about where a product is made as long as price/quality is right.)

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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby The Deacon » Mon Mar 27, 2017 12:50 pm

ChrisinHove wrote:I hadn't heard that any mutual trade tariffs or anything like it had been implemented. It would certainly be big news if they had. Also the retailers would be pretty quick to point the finger (if it weren't already occupied).
Well, it was just a guess. Still, it does seem less like a "Spyderco issue" than a "knives imported from the USA issue" since Benchmade, Case, Emerson, and Ka-Bar prices that I've checked all seem to be higher than MSRP, most by a higher percentage than Spyderco's. At the very least, that would seem to counter the allegations that Spyderco was to blame alluded to by the OP.
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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby Gsg9 » Mon Mar 27, 2017 12:57 pm

Stop complaining guys, after all it's just numbers :D

Heinnie added 75£ to para2, listing them at 200£, added about 100£ to S110V Millie and so on, before price change they were flying off the website, now they are still there and I presume they don't intend to sell them anymore

For me the only advantage for high price EU market is that I could get some sprints that I missed in the States, and even there you have to be fast :D , I've seen a 340EUR Cruwear PM2 being sold from Lamnia, not to mention some 700EUR Medford Pretorian sold as soon as it was shown on the website, so the shops can see that they eventually sell even at those inflated prices

If everybody stops buying them, they either have to stop dealing us knives or reduce the prices, but as long as they have customers on these prices they will keep increasing the prices, nothing personal, just business

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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby sal » Mon Mar 27, 2017 12:59 pm

Hi Tonijedi,

Welcome to our forum.

sal

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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby valenciamanu » Mon Mar 27, 2017 1:48 pm

Here are the recommended retailers prices for Spain.
http://www.esteller.com/nuestras-marcas ... 6-navajas/
http://www.esteller.com/nuestras-marcas/byrd/navajas/
You have to realize that they are in Euros and that the cabio with dollars still leaves more harmed

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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby gmhauy » Mon Mar 27, 2017 3:03 pm

valenciamanu wrote:Here are the recommended retailers prices for Spain.
http://www.esteller.com/nuestras-marcas ... 6-navajas/
http://www.esteller.com/nuestras-marcas/byrd/navajas/
You have to realize that they are in Euros and that the cabio with dollars still leaves more harmed
Outrageous prices.
The Ladybug tattoo is priced at 110.25 Euros / almost $ 120.00 at today's rate of exchange. Two months ago I ordered one for my daughter from the Knife Center for $ 56.97 + about $ 15.00 shipping, by USPS International. It arrived within one week straight at home and I did not pay any taxes. And USPS tracked the package to the end, even when it was transiting within Spain.
Same story with the three other knives I have ordered the past year.
Considering, it will be a long time before any European retailer can see the color of my hard earned money...

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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby tonijedi » Mon Mar 27, 2017 4:43 pm

sal wrote:Hi Tonijedi,

Welcome to our forum.

sal
Thank you Sal, it's an honor!

What I think is getting us Europeans mad (or should I say jealous? :D ) is that what is considered an affordable knife in the US (Delica, Endura, Tenacious...) is sold as a premium here. I personally would never mind to pay more 10 or 20 eur/usd than the US prices for any of these knives but often they cost the double... plus shipping. I'm a huge Delica fan (I own 7) and it's a struggle to get a sprint run (couldn't grab one so far). I wish this could be different, maybe the European market isn't that important when it comes down to numbers (i don't know) but we got feelings too :D :D :D

I'm waiting for the lost cost flights to the US so I can get there and bring a couple of Spydercos... go on vacations and still save some money! Meanwhile of someone comes to Porto, Portugal, let me know and please bring HAP-40 or Superblue Delicas :cool:

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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby valenciamanu » Mon Mar 27, 2017 9:02 pm

gmhauy wrote:
valenciamanu wrote:Here are the recommended retailers prices for Spain.
http://www.esteller.com/nuestras-marcas ... 6-navajas/
http://www.esteller.com/nuestras-marcas/byrd/navajas/
You have to realize that they are in Euros and that the cabio with dollars still leaves more harmed
Outrageous prices.
The Ladybug tattoo is priced at 110.25 Euros / almost $ 120.00 at today's rate of exchange. Two months ago I ordered one for my daughter from the Knife Center for $ 56.97 + about $ 15.00 shipping, by USPS International. It arrived within one week straight at home and I did not pay any taxes. And USPS tracked the package to the end, even when it was transiting within Spain.
Same story with the three other knives I have ordered the past year.
Considering, it will be a long time before any European retailer can see the color of my hard earned money...
The truth is that these prices are a nightmare.
I do not know Spyderco can do something or not.
But the truth is that at this price I will not buy more Spyderco.
And I still like it.And interesting
But no longer for collecting.
I see them as I can see a Sabenza.
Or as an old craft knife made of very exclusive materials.From Carey to Ivory
Now I have refocused my collection on Sak and Spanish classics.
They are not products of oriental factories.
And they are very good value for money

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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby donsea » Tue Mar 28, 2017 6:00 am

Hi Sal,

Thanks for listening. Being a Belgian Spyderco fan, I too worry about the pricing in Europe and I notice that the USA/EU price ratio for high end Spyderco knives differs from other high end manufacturers.

For example: two knives I own and love, the Spyderco Slysz Bowie with a MSRP of 499,95 dollar can be found for 299,97 dollar in the USA. In Belgium, I would buy from the Dutch dealer KATO and pay 421,95 euro. On the other hand, a Chris Reeve Inkosi costs 445 dollar in the USA and 499 euro at KATO. Bottom line: the Slysz Bowie is a real bargain in the USA compared to the Inkosi, but not so in Europe.

I honestly believe that Spyderco sales would increase in Europe if you could somehow manage to keep the selling price in line with the USA selling price.

Best regards, Davy

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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby The Deacon » Tue Mar 28, 2017 7:29 am

donsea wrote:Hi Sal,

Thanks for listening. Being a Belgian Spyderco fan, I too worry about the pricing in Europe and I notice that the USA/EU price ratio for high end Spyderco knives differs from other high end manufacturers.

For example: two knives I own and love, the Spyderco Slysz Bowie with a MSRP of 499,95 dollar can be found for 299,97 dollar in the USA. In Belgium, I would buy from the Dutch dealer KATO and pay 421,95 euro. On the other hand, a Chris Reeve Inkosi costs 445 dollar in the USA and 499 euro at KATO. Bottom line: the Slysz Bowie is a real bargain in the USA compared to the Inkosi, but not so in Europe.

I honestly believe that Spyderco sales would increase in Europe if you could somehow manage to keep the selling price in line with the USA selling price.

Best regards, Davy
That's not really a fair comparison. Chris Reeve knives are rarely ever discounted in the USA, while Spyderco's are almost always discounted here.
All you are really saying is that European dealers choose not to discount knives imported from the USA as deeply as US dealers discount them. That makes Spyderco knives, which are discounted relatively heavily in the USA, appear more expensive in EU than Chris Reeve knives. Looking at it a different way, at today's exchange rates, your Inkosi was inflated by roughly 20% over CRK MSRP, while your Slysz Bowie was acutally about 15% below its MSRP. Sure, KATO is making a larger profit on Spyderco, but Spyderco can't force dealers to discount their products, so the only way they could make things appear better for you would be to drop MSRP to MAP, and not allow discounting. While that would have little or no effect on US dealers who sell primarily on the internet at MAP, it would have an adverse effect on brick and mortar dealers here who sell at MSRP, or close to it.
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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby archangel » Tue Mar 28, 2017 8:15 am

donsea wrote: I honestly believe that Spyderco sales would increase in Europe if you could somehow manage to keep the selling price in line with the USA selling price.
I second that.
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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby The Deacon » Tue Mar 28, 2017 9:49 am

archangel wrote:
donsea wrote: I honestly believe that Spyderco sales would increase in Europe if you could somehow manage to keep the selling price in line with the USA selling price.
I second that.
I'd bet that Spyderco distributors in Europe pay the same price for Spyderco knives as Spyderco distributors in the USA. Shipping to Europe adds to the cost as do all the taxes and all the various fees your governments tack on add to the distributor's costs, there's no way around that. If I'm right about what EU distributors are being charged, then how exactly could what you're asking for be accomplished? Should Spyderco be expected to subsidize their European customers by selling at a loss to European distributors? Somehow force their European distributors to sell to dealers at the same prices US distributors sell to US dealers? Somehow force European dealers to discount by 40%, as many US dealers do?

And again, this is not a situation unique to Spyderco. Most knives made and sold by US companies are discounted heavily in the USA, and sell for well over MSRP in Europe.
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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby qazy » Tue Mar 28, 2017 11:43 am

If this is due to tax and shipping cost, should not Italy made spydercos be cheaper in Europe then?

Im not a tax expert, but should not non USA made knives be taxed at US border when shipped from Japan/Taiwan/etc; or there is an exception for corporations?

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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby aesmith » Tue Mar 28, 2017 11:52 am

I can't see that the recent changes can be due to either taxes or shipping, unless for some reason shipping has got hugely expensive suddenly. I would suspect intermediaries in the supply chain as I can't see why else the products should be much more expensive in UK and Germany, compared to France.
The Deacon wrote:I'd bet that Spyderco distributors in Europe pay the same price for Spyderco knives as Spyderco distributors in the USA.
That's what I was thinking, but I wonder about volume, how much product goes to the UK compared to big US dealers?
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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby aesmith » Tue Mar 28, 2017 12:03 pm

qazy wrote:If this is due to tax and shipping cost, should not Italy made spydercos be cheaper in Europe then?

Im not a tax expert, but should not non USA made knives be taxed at US border when shipped from Japan/Taiwan/etc; or there is an exception for corporations?
I can't think how that works, I can only assume the final product gets treated as from the US (ie outside the EU). Maybe we end up paying for two lots of import duty - Italy to US and US to EU. As a comparison I looked at a model made by Fox Knives in Italy (who I believe make for Spyderco), their Sailing model is advertised in the US at $99.95 and in the UK at £70.95 (around $88).
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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby The General » Tue Mar 28, 2017 12:24 pm

I don't post very often on here these days.

However, the price rises we have seen in Europe are not sustainable.

There has been much finger pointing and suggestions as to the reasons and causes.

One thing stands out above all others though. Spyderco knives just went up in price in Europe so much. That buying them has no longer become justifiable or acceptable for a lot of customers. We've seen price hikes of over 60% on some items.

As a Spyderco fan and collector, this is deeply troubling for me. I really wanted a K390 Urban, Manix 2 lockback and a S110V UKPK. All those purchases have been abandoned now. Which is not great news. I was just starting to get back into the knife scene and collecting. :spyder:

It's not the end of the world, I don't need any of these items. However, from a customer and business point of view, I'd be concerned Sal. Because the customers are not going to absorb these price rises.

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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby demoncase » Tue Mar 28, 2017 12:39 pm

The General wrote:I don't post very often on here these days.

However, the price rises we have seen in Europe are not sustainable.

There has been much finger pointing and suggestions as to the reasons and causes.

One thing stands out above all others though. Spyderco knives just went up in price in Europe so much. That buying them has no longer become justifiable or acceptable for a lot of customers. We've seen overnight price hikes of over 60% on some items.

As a Spyderco fan and collector, this is deeply troubling for me. I really wanted a K390 Urban, Manix 2 lockback and a S110V UKPK. All those purchases have been abandoned now. Which is not great news. I was just starting to get back into the knife scene and collecting. :spyder:

It's not the end of the world, I don't need any of these items. However, from a customer and business point of view, I'd be concerned Sal. Because the customers are not going to absorb these price rises.
I added one word to your post to really make the point- and I heartily concur with it.

To Deacon's point- I have always expected that the normal import charges and exchange rate fluctuations make Spyderco's product in Europe more expensive than the 'over-the-counter' price in the US.....That's not in question here: and those wishing for a direct $ to £/Euro parity are engaging in wishful thinking.

What is in question is we have seen overnight price hikes of 20-75% and can't work out the why of it.....
The exchange rate isn't that different.
Import duties haven't changed
Spydercos MSRPs haven't changed- and UK prices have never been close to being impacted by MAP anyways
....So we're all asking "What gives?"

Doubly especially when certain retailers have quite clearly applied an across-the-board price raise to stuff they already had in stock......Yet other retailers seem to have had no such 'sudden' issue.

Maddening.
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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby ChrisinHove » Tue Mar 28, 2017 1:13 pm

The Deacon wrote:
archangel wrote:
donsea wrote: I honestly believe that Spyderco sales would increase in Europe if you could somehow manage to keep the selling price in line with the USA selling price.
I second that.
I'd bet that Spyderco distributors in Europe pay the same price for Spyderco knives as Spyderco distributors in the USA. Shipping to Europe adds to the cost as do all the taxes and all the various fees your governments tack on add to the distributor's costs, there's no way around that. If I'm right about what EU distributors are being charged, then how exactly could what you're asking for be accomplished? Should Spyderco be expected to subsidize their European customers by selling at a loss to European distributors? Somehow force their European distributors to sell to dealers at the same prices US distributors sell to US dealers? Somehow force European dealers to discount by 40%, as many US dealers do?

And again, this is not a situation unique to Spyderco. Most knives made and sold by US companies are discounted heavily in the USA, and sell for well over MSRP in Europe.
That would explain the higher prices we were already used to, but not the recent very high price inflation unless a) exchange rates, and/or b) taxes had significantly increased. The £GB has tanked by 17% as a consequence of the Brexit buffoonery - but the Euro hasn't, and there isn't any new & punitive tax regime.

So where are the increases coming from? Trust in the supply chain is ebbing away (and who invests their hard earned cash in something they don't trust?)

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Re: Spyderco prices in Europe exploded !

Postby vanka » Tue Mar 28, 2017 3:11 pm

Yep, we pay the full MSRP... in euros. Give or take 10-20. And not only Spyderco, it's the same thing with other US brands. That's why i left the Europe dealers and turned to a third party middle man. There's some companies offering exactly this kind of services - buying from US on your behalf. They charge usually between 20-30% over the us price + 10-20 $ intl. shipping. All the customs services are included. It comes straight to your door. Hassle free. The good part - if your order get lost you get full refund or they fulfill your order again for no charge. You don't have to worry about anything. It's 100% insured. The bad part - it could take anything between 15-30 days for your order to arrive. That's how i got a couple of mules, and some sprint runs. Although it's rather useless for orders below 100$ because you are charged at max amounts. Ordering things over 200-250$ is a game changer. Big time. And it's not only a knives i'm ordering. Sadly enough i do think it is for my country exclusively, but i'm pretty sure same services can be found for a lot of EU countries respectively. Not advertising anything. Just sharing my experience.


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