Para 3 Defect?

[farnorthdan]

Oh great, now I'm going to have to find a gen2 PM3 so my collection will complete. :D

[Evil D]

"For sale ULTRA RARE FIRST GEN PARA 3!!!!!”

I can see it now lol.

[ChaoticMayhem65]

Dear chaoticdefect65 and all:

Thank you very much for your post. Your knife is not defective.

After I read your post this morning, I spoke to our manufacturing manager and chief engineer. They confirmed that the machined "step" was a purposeful in-line change in the design; however, both versions of the Para 3 shown in this thread are correct and both are completely functional and reliable.

The first production of the Para 3 featured the full-width lock ramp that has traditionally been used on all our Compression Locks. Our testing of that lock in the Para 3 confirmed that it is robust, reliable, and provides outstanding lock strength--just like the many thousands of other Compression Locks currently in service.

When extreme lock testing videos became popular on the Internet several years ago, some testers began using an "overstrike" test. In this test, the knife is gripped by the end of the handle and the forward portion of the "slot" side of the handle is struck against a hard surface to try to get the blade to close. While this test doesn't simulate any logical use of a knife as a tool, since it was a concern of some of our customers, we began incorporating it into our testing protocols.

In its original full-width-ramp configuration, the Para 3 performed just as well as our other Compression Lock knives on the overstrike test. When the lock finally failed, it did so because the impact of the strike allowed the liner to slide completely off the ramp. This gave one of our engineers an idea. In the spirit of Constant Quality Improvement (C.Q.I.), he machined a small "safety step" at the low end of the ramp. In overstrike tests, this step is designed to act as a shelf or step to "catch" the liner and act as a failsafe against lock release. Extensive testing of the concept with the Para 3 showed that the idea had merit, so we decided to implement it as a desirable change in the Para 3 design.

Based on the engagement point of the liner and the ramp, the safety step does not affect lock strength or its ease of operation. Again, it is a purposeful C.Q.I. change that we believe is an enhancement to the design. We plan to do additional testing with prototypes of other models to see if it's something that we might consider implementing in other designs, but for now, it's limited to current production of the Para 3. First-run production of the Para 3 with the full-width ramp are perfectly serviceable, first-quality knives and have been very well received by our customers. If you have one, it will serve you well.

As always, if you have any concerns about the performance or operation of an individual Spyderco knife, your best course of action is to send it to our warranty repair department so we can examine it. And, as always, we welcome feedback on your experiences with our knives and your thoughts on our continued efforts to make them better.

Thank you for your continued passion for Spyderco knives.

Stay safe,

Mike

Wow. Thanks for the response. The blade is otherwise very smooth and locks up rock solid. Seems like such an odd thing to do though. Wouldn't this hinder the locking tab from moving freely and possibly cause it not to fully lock up with time? Just seems like a notch or a hump would be a hurdle for it to overcome instead of a smooth tapered transition.

[Bill1170]

Thank you Mr Janich. What a fascinating adaptation! It's sad that companies need to respond to unrealistic "lock tests," but this is very clever.

[Ryno]

I thought the notch looked intentional. That's why I was wondering if there was any blade play or if it locked up tight.

[ChaoticMayhem65]

I thought the notch looked intentional. That's why I was wondering if there was any blade play or if it locked up tight.

Locks up nice and tight and is buttery smooth.

[Ryno]

I thought the notch looked intentional. That's why I was wondering if there was any blade play or if it locked up tight.

Locks up nice and tight and is buttery smooth.

The compression lock is a thing of beauty!

[Spydersense]

Cool, I've got one of the rare first gen Para 3 knives. Look out Blade Forums!

[FDE]

So does the lockbar engage the ramp below or above the small stepped area?

[ChaoticMayhem65]

So does the lockbar engage the ramp below or above the small stepped area?

Kind of hard to see, but i believe above. It just seems like that step could add the potential for the lockbar to hang.

[FDE]

I see potential issues regardless of which side of the notch the lockbar rests when in the fully open position. If above; the notch could cause a false locked open position if opened slowly, where the lockbar catches the edge of the notch rather than sliding fully up the lockbar ramp. IMO this is still the better of the two options.
If below; the notch would prevent the lockbar engaging further up the ramp as lockbar wear occurs, therefore causing blade play.
I cannot to see how this notch would prevent lock failure unless the lockbar is traveling all the way up the ramp and off the blade tang. Perhaps some insight on how exactly compression locks fail when tested? I hope we are not sacrificing wear surface and longevity for "improvements" that have no real world application. Why do we need to be able to baton with the spine side of a folding pocket knife??

[Evil D]

Guys, I mean this as gently as I can and I really don't mean to sound like a prick, but assuming any of us know more about knife manufacturing than Spyderco is pretty silly. Unless you have an engineering degree and experience making knives I think we're doing a lot of assuming and worrying over nothing. At the very least if this doesn't work and there does end up being lock issues in the future I'm sure they'll take care of you with the warranty. Rest assured they did in house testing before launching this on what is sure to be a ridiculously huge seller for Spyderco. I get all the concern but I think a lot of it is really unnecessary.

[Ryno]

I always thought a notch there made sense. Up until now, the lock tab in compression locks has been pushing on a sloped surface. With this improvement, it's flat on flat. The test that was referred to earlier in this thread seems non-real-world, because no body would ever put closing pressure on a knife without deactivating the lock mechanism, but you never know. Perhaps the act of stabbing the knife into something tough puts more closing force on a knife then we realize. Or perhaps someone will open their knife in a hurry and the locking tab doesn't fully engage. I would prefer flat on flat.

[SpyderEdgeForever]

Guys, I mean this as gently as I can and I really don't mean to sound like a prick, but assuming any of us know more about knife manufacturing than Spyderco is pretty silly. Unless you have an engineering degree and experience making knives I think we're doing a lot of assuming and worrying over nothing. At the very least if this doesn't work and there does end up being lock issues in the future I'm sure they'll take care of you with the warranty. Rest assured they did in house testing before launching this on what is sure to be a ridiculously huge seller for Spyderco. I get all the concern but I think a lot of it is really unnecessary.

100 percent perfect analysis, David. Thank you!
It is a comforting thought to know they tested the lock-strength to make sure that even with the increased forces/pressures placed on it, it will still hold up under normal uses.

[NickShabazz]

... In this test, the knife is gripped by the end of the handle and the forward portion of the "slot" side of the handle is struck against a hard surface to try to get the blade to close. While this test doesn't simulate any logical use of a knife as a tool, since it was a concern of some of our customers, we began incorporating it into our testing protocols ...

This right here is one of the reasons I love Spyderco so damned much. "Some people do this absurd thing." "Huh. Weird. Let's change things to make our knife better cope with that absurd thing, because why not."

The fact that Spyderco not only seeks to improve existing designs, but actively seeks out weird sorts of improvements to make, is a big part of the reason the designs feel so polished and "intelligent". Keep it up, guys.

[MacLaren]

... In this test, the knife is gripped by the end of the handle and the forward portion of the "slot" side of the handle is struck against a hard surface to try to get the blade to close. While this test doesn't simulate any logical use of a knife as a tool, since it was a concern of some of our customers, we began incorporating it into our testing protocols ...

This right here is one of the reasons I love Spyderco so damned much. "Some people do this absurd thing." "Huh. Weird. Let's change things to make our knife better cope with that absurd thing, because why not."

The fact that Spyderco not only seeks to improve existing designs, but actively seeks out weird sorts of improvements to make, is a big part of the reason the designs feel so polished and "intelligent". Keep it up, guys.

How ya doin Nik?
You do some nice reviews on the net.
I enjoy watching them

[ChaoticMayhem65]

As long as its not a defect and truly is intentional, then i will not question Spyderco's decision to put it there. I fully trust their engineering. If they put it there intentionally, then there is a reason. But i would rest a little easier if i could actually see some more of these in the wild and know for certain mine did not slip through the crack of quality inspection.

[Evil D]

As long as its not a defect and truly is intentional, then i will not question Spyderco's decision to put it there. I fully trust their engineering. If they put it there intentionally, then there is a reason. But i would rest a little easier if i could actually see some more of these in the wild and know for certain mine did not slip through the crack of quality inspection.

I get what you're saying and I'd feel the same but Michael does speak for Spyderco so that's an official reply. What I would really love to see is this safeguard in action but they don't tend to share lock destruction info.

[ChrisinHove]

I think I'm just surprised that the compression lock could be improved!

[ChaoticMayhem65]

I agree. I love the compression lock. Its got to be one of the strongest and easiest to use locks out there. Probably why the PM2 is so popular.