Policy on replacing stripped screw heads?

[The Deacon]

2. Discourage users from maintaining and modding their knives = stop replacing parts that are broken during disassembly

Dont in any way, shape or form mistake my criticism of the policy for anything other than what it is. I'm not slamming Spyderco, I'm not bagging on their products and I'm not calling anyone names

I just dont understand how the thought process involved lead to a "We're going to make it hard to disassemble the knives, which voids the warranty, but if they ask we'll replace the parts they broke while doing it."

And how, pray tell, is Spyderco to know what the user was doing when the screw was damaged? For example, did they damage the pivot screw while trying loosen it a bit to make the knife more "flickable" or while attempting to disassemble it?

[araneae]

Between this and the other related thread, I'm now completely confused.

The warranty and Sal's comments are pretty clear on Spyderco's opinion of disassembly. You guys have gone so far as to use Red Loctite to, from all outward appearances, make it that much more difficult to tear down the product.

Circling back to the original question in this thread, the customer admitted he disassembled the knife and you're still going out of your way to explain how to get free parts.

I think we're all appreciative of your customer service, but this doesnt make any sense. You're putting out a product that is designed to be difficult to take apart, then giving away product at no charge when we break it trying to take it apart?

For those who *don't* disassemble their knives the red loctite is a benefit, since screws that are secured with that product are unlikely to ever come loose on their own.

I absolutely agree. My issue is dichotomy in policy:

1. Encourage users to maintain and mod their knives = stop using red loctite
2. Discourage users from maintaining and modding their knives = stop replacing parts that are broken during disassembly

Dont in any way, shape or form mistake my criticism of the policy for anything other than what it is. I'm not slamming Spyderco, I'm not bagging on their products and I'm not calling anyone names

I just dont understand how the thought process involved lead to a "We're going to make it hard to disassemble the knives, which voids the warranty, but if they ask we'll replace the parts they broke while doing it."

Yes, it makes much more sense to be confused by a courtesy extended to customers, such as sending out free screws.

Just 2 weeks ago, a coworker dropped her Delica in the parking lot, it was run over by a car before it was recovered and the clip tore out. I got the knife back in shape, minus some new character marks, and called CS who promptly sent me free screws and a tiny blue loctite sample. I got the knife back together and thought; the fact that they sent screws was so hypocritical of them in light of their warranty policy. Riiight. Welcome to the ignore list.

[Taypo]

2. Discourage users from maintaining and modding their knives = stop replacing parts that are broken during disassembly

Dont in any way, shape or form mistake my criticism of the policy for anything other than what it is. I'm not slamming Spyderco, I'm not bagging on their products and I'm not calling anyone names

I just dont understand how the thought process involved lead to a "We're going to make it hard to disassemble the knives, which voids the warranty, but if they ask we'll replace the parts they broke while doing it."

And how, pray tell, is Spyderco to know what the user was doing when the screw was damaged? For example, did they damage the pivot screw while trying loosen it a bit to make the knife more "flickable" or while attempting to disassemble it?

Good question - I suppose that depends on Spyderco's definition of "alteration", which is also a warranty killer according to the website.

[Taypo]

Between this and the other related thread, I'm now completely confused.

The warranty and Sal's comments are pretty clear on Spyderco's opinion of disassembly. You guys have gone so far as to use Red Loctite to, from all outward appearances, make it that much more difficult to tear down the product.

Circling back to the original question in this thread, the customer admitted he disassembled the knife and you're still going out of your way to explain how to get free parts.

I think we're all appreciative of your customer service, but this doesnt make any sense. You're putting out a product that is designed to be difficult to take apart, then giving away product at no charge when we break it trying to take it apart?

For those who *don't* disassemble their knives the red loctite is a benefit, since screws that are secured with that product are unlikely to ever come loose on their own.

I absolutely agree. My issue is dichotomy in policy:

1. Encourage users to maintain and mod their knives = stop using red loctite
2. Discourage users from maintaining and modding their knives = stop replacing parts that are broken during disassembly

Dont in any way, shape or form mistake my criticism of the policy for anything other than what it is. I'm not slamming Spyderco, I'm not bagging on their products and I'm not calling anyone names

I just dont understand how the thought process involved lead to a "We're going to make it hard to disassemble the knives, which voids the warranty, but if they ask we'll replace the parts they broke while doing it."

Yes, it makes much more sense to be confused by a courtesy extended to customers, such as sending out free screws.

Just 2 weeks ago, a coworker dropped her Delica in the parking lot, it was run over by a car before it was recovered and the clip tore out. I got the knife back in shape, minus some new character marks, and called CS who promptly sent me free screws and a tiny blue loctite sample. I got the knife back together and thought; the fact that they sent screws was so hypocritical of them in light of their warranty policy. Riiight. Welcome to the ignore list.

Darn, we were having such a productive conversation and all. We could have had a fruitful one about why they sent you BLUE loctite, I bet

[The Deacon]

And how, pray tell, is Spyderco to know what the user was doing when the screw was damaged? For example, did they damage the pivot screw while trying loosen it a bit to make the knife more "flickable" or while attempting to disassemble it?

Good question - I suppose that depends on Spyderco's definition of "alteration", which is also a warranty killer according to the website.

[awa54]

I absolutely agree. My issue is dichotomy in policy:

1. Encourage users to maintain and mod their knives = stop using red loctite
2. Discourage users from maintaining and modding their knives = stop replacing parts that are broken during disassembly

Dont in any way, shape or form mistake my criticism of the policy for anything other than what it is. I'm not slamming Spyderco, I'm not bagging on their products and I'm not calling anyone names

I just dont understand how the thought process involved lead to a "We're going to make it hard to disassemble the knives, which voids the warranty, but if they ask we'll replace the parts they broke while doing it."

I agree, it leaves those skilled enough to work on their own knives with another challenge to getting it right... If screws were available the same way clips are that would be a different thing.

BTW, I'm also a fan of warranty/parts sales policies that are consistent and easily understood, I also wouldn't stretch the truth to get free parts... The problem is this limbo of *possibly* getting screws (maybe even free of charge), but maybe not... If Spyderco doesn't want to be in the screw business, then a great resource would be for them to provide the specs for all the fasteners used on current and recent knives, with a link to vendors who can provide them.


The flip-side of the red loctite dilema is the un-treated frame/scale screws on the Native 5 Lightweight, I understand that strong thread lock on a molded in nut is a recipe for spinning one loose from the surrounding plastic, but my first N5LW lost screws in my pocket due to the lack of thread locker.


On the subject of clip screws: a pocket clip on a knife with multiple attachment points is obviously intended to be user serviceable, so these screws are not part of this discussion, unless it's to wonder why a screw intended to be removable would be installed with semi-permanent thread lock.

[Taypo]

And how, pray tell, is Spyderco to know what the user was doing when the screw was damaged? For example, did they damage the pivot screw while trying loosen it a bit to make the knife more "flickable" or while attempting to disassemble it?

Good question - I suppose that depends on Spyderco's definition of "alteration", which is also a warranty killer according to the website.

OK, I'll bite. What do you find ridiculous?

[The Deacon]

OK, I'll bite. What do you find ridiculous?

Your entire line of reasoning.

[Taypo]

OK, I'll bite. What do you find ridiculous?

Your entire line of reasoning.

:) Good talk.

[EDC Honeybee]

While this thread has pretty much gone off the rails, I figured I would update with the result. Customer service shipped a single screw free of charge after receiving an email describing the situation. I phrased it as "purchase" a screw, but it was sent without asking for payment.

I understand spyderco isn't in the business of selling parts for logistical and counterfeit reasons, but I would be willing to pay for the parts since its my action that caused the problem, knowing the risk. I would not be willing to lie to get a new part. If I tell the situation to spyderco and they won't replace the part, thats fine.

Anyways, take-away is that spyderco customer service has been top-notch every time I have dealt with them regardless of the average written warranty. I think this is spyderco under-promising, over-delivering. Still a little unhappy with red loc-tite, but happy overall with the purchase and the customer support.

[Taypo]

I'm glad they took care of it!

[freebird610]

I for one am really glad that Spyderco does send out replacement screws as I have asked for them on several occasions. I have no idea why some would seem to be upset by that. They are basically contradicting what their warranty says and helping their customers out anyway. Sounds like a pretty awesome company to me. Sure I wish the warranty would allow for disassembly but I can understand why it does not. In the end if you are nice they seem to be more then happy to help us out with things that in many cases basically contradict what their warranty says. To me instead of getting upset we should be pretty darn happy that Spyderco helps us out even though according to their warranty they are off the hook. I for one am glad they don't overpromise and underdeliver. Bottom line is they do things for us that they don't have to and that makes me pretty darn happy to own Spyderco, not mad for sure. But to each his own.

[The Deacon]

I for one am really glad that Spyderco does send out replacement screws as I have asked for them on several occasions. I have no idea why some would seem to be upset by that. They are basically contradicting what their warranty says and helping their customers out anyway. Sounds like a pretty awesome company to me. Sure I wish the warranty would allow for disassembly but I can understand why it does not. In the end if you are nice they seem to be more then happy to help us out with things that in many cases basically contradict what their warranty says. To me instead of getting upset we should be pretty darn happy that Spyderco helps us out even though according to their warranty they are off the hook. I for one am glad they don't overpromise and underdeliver. Bottom line is they do things for us that they don't have to and that makes me pretty darn happy to own Spyderco, not mad for sure. But to each his own.

For clarity, the warranty only means that Spyderco is not obligated to repair or replace a knife you damaged, or to supply you with parts you have lost or damaged. They obviously choose to go above and beyond what their warranty requires them to do, if and when they feel the circumstances warrant it and have done so for many years. Why anyone would take exception to, or be unable to comprehend that, is beyond me.

[Ippon]

I for one am really glad that Spyderco does send out replacement screws as I have asked for them on several occasions. I have no idea why some would seem to be upset by that. They are basically contradicting what their warranty says and helping their customers out anyway. Sounds like a pretty awesome company to me. Sure I wish the warranty would allow for disassembly but I can understand why it does not. In the end if you are nice they seem to be more then happy to help us out with things that in many cases basically contradict what their warranty says. To me instead of getting upset we should be pretty darn happy that Spyderco helps us out even though according to their warranty they are off the hook. I for one am glad they don't overpromise and underdeliver. Bottom line is they do things for us that they don't have to and that makes me pretty darn happy to own Spyderco, not mad for sure. But to each his own.

For clarity, the warranty only means that Spyderco is not obligated to repair or replace a knife you damaged, or to supply you with parts you have lost or damaged. They obviously choose to go above and beyond what their warranty requires them to do, if and when they feel the circumstances warrant it and have done so for many years. Why anyone would take exception to, or be unable to comprehend that, is beyond me.

This. I don't see a problem with them sending out screws. A strict warranty gives them the ability, case being that someone destroyed their knife by being stupid, to refuse to fix it for free and loose money. But a strict warranty doesn't take away their ability to send out screws. I'm struggling to see the problem.

I'm also incredibly curious about really how could I get some "backup" replacement screws. One of my PM2s is sitting on the shelf, missing 3 of the 4 body screws. Obviously from disassembly. I would LOVE some new screws for it. Is it worth a shot? Email, "so hey.... I need 3 replacement screws?"