Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

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10SBUM
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Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

Postby 10SBUM » Sat Aug 06, 2016 5:18 pm

Have been carrying a Byrd Robin 2 for a while now and unfortunately have either lost it or it was stolen :( I really loved everything about it...size, blade length, ease of opening, locking blade, ease of carrying, etc.

I thought about ordering another one but now that I know it's the perfect size and type for my daily needs, I'm thinking about getting something from Spyderco that is (basically) identical but a little better quality.

What Spyderco knife come closest to the Byrd Robin 2 while staying under $70 or so?

Thanks for any and all input!

10SBUM

sabb8pro2
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Re: Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

Postby sabb8pro2 » Sat Aug 06, 2016 7:26 pm

Dragonfly 2

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abbazaba
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Re: Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

Postby abbazaba » Sat Aug 06, 2016 9:22 pm


10SBUM
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Re: Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

Postby 10SBUM » Sun Aug 07, 2016 10:40 am

sabb8pro2 wrote:Dragonfly 2
What's the difference(s) between the Dragonfly 2 and the Dragonfly 1?

Thanks for the help!!!

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sabb8pro2
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Re: Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

Postby sabb8pro2 » Sun Aug 07, 2016 10:59 am

I'm not sure on all of the differences. I think the texture and the clip may have been upgraded. Probably the steel too. The most important difference though may be availability. I think a DF2 would be much easier to find.

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Re: Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

Postby 10SBUM » Sun Aug 07, 2016 11:12 am

Thanks for all the help!

Is the Dragonfly 1/2 worth the extra $35 over the Byrd Robin 2?

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dplafoll
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Re: Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

Postby dplafoll » Sun Aug 07, 2016 12:17 pm

Dragonfly 1 isn't available anymore AFAIK, and the upgrades in hole location and clip are worth it even if it were.
The DF2 is smaller, both in size and a full ounce in weight, with the same cutting edge. You also get the deep-carry wire clip, which I think is more effective, easier to repair if needed, and I prefer deeper carry. You do lose the option of tip-down carry, but on a knife this small there's not a whole lot of difference between tip up and tip down.
I personally prefer the handle ergos on the DF2 but YMMV. I also think VG-10 is an improvement over 8CR13MOV in most applications, and honestly if you can spare the extra cash I'd spring for the ZDP-189 (or HAP-40 or Super Blue, if you can find them) version of the DF2. Ergos are definitely subjective and I'd handle one if you can. For steel, that's fairly subjective too, but I can only think of one thing that 8CR might have over VG10 and that's ease of field sharpening since it's a bit softer.
Patrick LaFollette
Current: Dragonfly 2 ZDP-189, Chaparral 1, Techno 1, Delica 4 HAP-40, Dragonfly 2 HAP-40, Mantra 1, Ladybug Salt Hawkbill, Nirvana CPM, Endura 4 HAP-40, Sage 4, Para Military 2 CPM Cru-Wear, Sage 5, Caly3 HAP40, Sliverax, Lil' Nilakka, Chaparral Raffir Noble, Zulu, Manbug HAP40, Meerkat HAP40, Sage 1/Sage 2/Sage 3 CF, Introvert, Techno 2

10SBUM
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Re: Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

Postby 10SBUM » Sun Aug 07, 2016 12:52 pm

dplafoll wrote: if you can spare the extra cash I'd spring for the ZDP-189 (or HAP-40 or Super Blue, if you can find them) version of the DF2.

The DF2 with the ZDP-189 only comes in a dark green color and is about $20 more...is that correct?

Thanks for the input!

10SBUM

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awa54
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Re: Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

Postby awa54 » Sun Aug 07, 2016 1:29 pm

10SBUM wrote:
dplafoll wrote: if you can spare the extra cash I'd spring for the ZDP-189 (or HAP-40 or Super Blue, if you can find them) version of the DF2.

The DF2 with the ZDP-189 only comes in a dark green color and is about $20 more...is that correct?

Thanks for the input!

10SBUM
Depends on where you shop, but essentially yes.

ZDP-189 is not as good of an "all around" steel as VG-10 IMO, it's *very* hard, takes a great edge and holds it well, but has issues with corrosion and is more prone to chipping out than VG-10. It's also rather harder to sharpen well.

HAP40 is great stuff, fairly easy to sharpen, takes a fabulous fine edge and holds it well, but scaring up a HAP40 sprint at under $100 may be difficult, the Super Blue variant will probably be harder to find and more expensive too, not to mention, SB rusts pretty easily.

If you want an affordable, no worries EDC knife the standard VG-10 version is probably your best bet. It's a great knife any way you look at it!

Plus you can get it in orange, so it'll be harder to lose ;)
-David

still more knives than sharpening stones...

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Re: Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

Postby dplafoll » Mon Aug 08, 2016 6:56 am

awa54 wrote:
10SBUM wrote:
dplafoll wrote: if you can spare the extra cash I'd spring for the ZDP-189 (or HAP-40 or Super Blue, if you can find them) version of the DF2.

The DF2 with the ZDP-189 only comes in a dark green color and is about $20 more...is that correct?

Thanks for the input!

10SBUM
Depends on where you shop, but essentially yes.

ZDP-189 is not as good of an "all around" steel as VG-10 IMO, it's *very* hard, takes a great edge and holds it well, but has issues with corrosion and is more prone to chipping out than VG-10. It's also rather harder to sharpen well.

HAP40 is great stuff, fairly easy to sharpen, takes a fabulous fine edge and holds it well, but scaring up a HAP40 sprint at under $100 may be difficult, the Super Blue variant will probably be harder to find and more expensive too, not to mention, SB rusts pretty easily.

If you want an affordable, no worries EDC knife the standard VG-10 version is probably your best bet. It's a great knife any way you look at it!

Plus you can get it in orange, so it'll be harder to lose ;)
(this is addressed to both of you)
Yeah you won't be going wrong with the VG-10. I'll have to disagree about the corrosion issues; I've had mine for a while now, in Alabama (not a dry part of the country), and have had exactly 0 signs of corrosion, including the two years of ownership when I didn't even have anything on it like Tuf-Glide to protect it. If you live on a coast or something, maybe go with the VG-10 or even a Salt-series just to be safe, but otherwise ZDP isn't that bad about corrosion. I think it's telling that Spyderco started with ZDP in laminated blades like the Super Blue and HAP-40 (which are definitely less corrosion resistant), but switched to full ZDP blades. If there were an extensive corrosion problem, I doubt that would've happened or continued.

I will agree it's hard to sharpen, but it's easy enough to maintain with a Sharpmaker or something comparable, and frankly if you're going to have knives you oughta have something with which to maintain them and the Sharpmaker is a great inexpensive option. Now, if you let ZDP get dull, yeah you're gonna have a bad time without some coarse sharpening stones or rods or whatever. But it shouldn't ever come to that. And I've also never had problems with chipping, but I have heard of that issue. I have heard of VG10 chipping as well, just not as much.

So yeah, Dragonfly in any steel is worth it. I'm carrying one of mine today. Gun-to-head, pick one in the collection as "this is the best in a practical EDC sense", ignoring all other considerations, it would be one of my Dragonfly 2s, probably the HAP-40.

If you're interested in expanding your knives, get something you like, then buy a Sharpmaker(or something similar). The sooner you start learning how to use it, the better you'll be when you end up with multiple knives to maintain, and you'll really want to be able to do that to keep them sharp enough to use properly. It will be an investment that you'll thank yourself for buying, and buying early. I didn't, and I really wish I had done so.
Patrick LaFollette
Current: Dragonfly 2 ZDP-189, Chaparral 1, Techno 1, Delica 4 HAP-40, Dragonfly 2 HAP-40, Mantra 1, Ladybug Salt Hawkbill, Nirvana CPM, Endura 4 HAP-40, Sage 4, Para Military 2 CPM Cru-Wear, Sage 5, Caly3 HAP40, Sliverax, Lil' Nilakka, Chaparral Raffir Noble, Zulu, Manbug HAP40, Meerkat HAP40, Sage 1/Sage 2/Sage 3 CF, Introvert, Techno 2

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awa54
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Re: Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

Postby awa54 » Mon Aug 08, 2016 10:07 am

dplafoll wrote:
awa54 wrote:
10SBUM wrote:
dplafoll wrote: if you can spare the extra cash I'd spring for the ZDP-189 (or HAP-40 or Super Blue, if you can find them) version of the DF2.

The DF2 with the ZDP-189 only comes in a dark green color and is about $20 more...is that correct?

Thanks for the input!

10SBUM
Depends on where you shop, but essentially yes.

ZDP-189 is not as good of an "all around" steel as VG-10 IMO, it's *very* hard, takes a great edge and holds it well, but has issues with corrosion and is more prone to chipping out than VG-10. It's also rather harder to sharpen well.

HAP40 is great stuff, fairly easy to sharpen, takes a fabulous fine edge and holds it well, but scaring up a HAP40 sprint at under $100 may be difficult, the Super Blue variant will probably be harder to find and more expensive too, not to mention, SB rusts pretty easily.

If you want an affordable, no worries EDC knife the standard VG-10 version is probably your best bet. It's a great knife any way you look at it!

Plus you can get it in orange, so it'll be harder to lose ;)
(this is addressed to both of you)
Yeah you won't be going wrong with the VG-10. I'll have to disagree about the corrosion issues; I've had mine for a while now, in Alabama (not a dry part of the country), and have had exactly 0 signs of corrosion, including the two years of ownership when I didn't even have anything on it like Tuf-Glide to protect it. If you live on a coast or something, maybe go with the VG-10 or even a Salt-series just to be safe, but otherwise ZDP isn't that bad about corrosion. I think it's telling that Spyderco started with ZDP in laminated blades like the Super Blue and HAP-40 (which are definitely less corrosion resistant), but switched to full ZDP blades. If there were an extensive corrosion problem, I doubt that would've happened or continued.

I will agree it's hard to sharpen, but it's easy enough to maintain with a Sharpmaker or something comparable, and frankly if you're going to have knives you oughta have something with which to maintain them and the Sharpmaker is a great inexpensive option. Now, if you let ZDP get dull, yeah you're gonna have a bad time without some coarse sharpening stones or rods or whatever. But it shouldn't ever come to that. And I've also never had problems with chipping, but I have heard of that issue. I have heard of VG10 chipping as well, just not as much.

So yeah, Dragonfly in any steel is worth it. I'm carrying one of mine today. Gun-to-head, pick one in the collection as "this is the best in a practical EDC sense", ignoring all other considerations, it would be one of my Dragonfly 2s, probably the HAP-40.

If you're interested in expanding your knives, get something you like, then buy a Sharpmaker(or something similar). The sooner you start learning how to use it, the better you'll be when you end up with multiple knives to maintain, and you'll really want to be able to do that to keep them sharp enough to use properly. It will be an investment that you'll thank yourself for buying, and buying early. I didn't, and I really wish I had done so.
For those who aren't already fairly well versed in sharpening ZDP can be a challenge, the Sharpmaker is a really good way to get good results from a challenging steel... for those with an old Arkansas stone, some Norton bench stones (fine India excepted) or even worse a carbide pull-sharpener ZDP-189 is going to be a complete failure as far as maintaining the edge goes. So in a roundabout way I totally agree; get a Sharpmaker (and Diamond or CBN rods) and you'll do fine with ZDP-189, it's a great steel!

On the subject of corrosion, I live in Vermont, which isn't exactly tropical and I have had surface rust and a couple tiny pits appear on my D'fly blade seemingly without cause, I have also seen pics on the internet (must be true right?) of ZDP blades that rusted substantially after cutting fruit or being in a sweaty pocket... I wouldn't say it's an easy to rust steel, just that it does need a bit more care than VG-10, which you actually have to abuse to get any rust on.

Plus the ZDP D'fly *and* Sharpmaker combo blows the OP's $70 budget out of the water :(

P.S. the HAP40 is my favorite too!
-David

still more knives than sharpening stones...

dplafoll
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Re: Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

Postby dplafoll » Mon Aug 08, 2016 12:42 pm

awa54 wrote:
dplafoll wrote:
awa54 wrote:
10SBUM wrote:
dplafoll wrote: if you can spare the extra cash I'd spring for the ZDP-189 (or HAP-40 or Super Blue, if you can find them) version of the DF2.

The DF2 with the ZDP-189 only comes in a dark green color and is about $20 more...is that correct?

Thanks for the input!

10SBUM
Depends on where you shop, but essentially yes.

ZDP-189 is not as good of an "all around" steel as VG-10 IMO, it's *very* hard, takes a great edge and holds it well, but has issues with corrosion and is more prone to chipping out than VG-10. It's also rather harder to sharpen well.

HAP40 is great stuff, fairly easy to sharpen, takes a fabulous fine edge and holds it well, but scaring up a HAP40 sprint at under $100 may be difficult, the Super Blue variant will probably be harder to find and more expensive too, not to mention, SB rusts pretty easily.

If you want an affordable, no worries EDC knife the standard VG-10 version is probably your best bet. It's a great knife any way you look at it!

Plus you can get it in orange, so it'll be harder to lose ;)
(this is addressed to both of you)
Yeah you won't be going wrong with the VG-10. I'll have to disagree about the corrosion issues; I've had mine for a while now, in Alabama (not a dry part of the country), and have had exactly 0 signs of corrosion, including the two years of ownership when I didn't even have anything on it like Tuf-Glide to protect it. If you live on a coast or something, maybe go with the VG-10 or even a Salt-series just to be safe, but otherwise ZDP isn't that bad about corrosion. I think it's telling that Spyderco started with ZDP in laminated blades like the Super Blue and HAP-40 (which are definitely less corrosion resistant), but switched to full ZDP blades. If there were an extensive corrosion problem, I doubt that would've happened or continued.

I will agree it's hard to sharpen, but it's easy enough to maintain with a Sharpmaker or something comparable, and frankly if you're going to have knives you oughta have something with which to maintain them and the Sharpmaker is a great inexpensive option. Now, if you let ZDP get dull, yeah you're gonna have a bad time without some coarse sharpening stones or rods or whatever. But it shouldn't ever come to that. And I've also never had problems with chipping, but I have heard of that issue. I have heard of VG10 chipping as well, just not as much.

So yeah, Dragonfly in any steel is worth it. I'm carrying one of mine today. Gun-to-head, pick one in the collection as "this is the best in a practical EDC sense", ignoring all other considerations, it would be one of my Dragonfly 2s, probably the HAP-40.

If you're interested in expanding your knives, get something you like, then buy a Sharpmaker(or something similar). The sooner you start learning how to use it, the better you'll be when you end up with multiple knives to maintain, and you'll really want to be able to do that to keep them sharp enough to use properly. It will be an investment that you'll thank yourself for buying, and buying early. I didn't, and I really wish I had done so.
For those who aren't already fairly well versed in sharpening ZDP can be a challenge, the Sharpmaker is a really good way to get good results from a challenging steel... for those with an old Arkansas stone, some Norton bench stones (fine India excepted) or even worse a carbide pull-sharpener ZDP-189 is going to be a complete failure as far as maintaining the edge goes. So in a roundabout way I totally agree; get a Sharpmaker (and Diamond or CBN rods) and you'll do fine with ZDP-189, it's a great steel!

On the subject of corrosion, I live in Vermont, which isn't exactly tropical and I have had surface rust and a couple tiny pits appear on my D'fly blade seemingly without cause, I have also seen pics on the internet (must be true right?) of ZDP blades that rusted substantially after cutting fruit or being in a sweaty pocket... I wouldn't say it's an easy to rust steel, just that it does need a bit more care than VG-10, which you actually have to abuse to get any rust on.

Plus the ZDP D'fly *and* Sharpmaker combo blows the OP's $70 budget out of the water :(

P.S. the HAP40 is my favorite too!
Yeah, by all means if we're going strictly in-budget, get the VG-10. But if possible, get a Sharpmaker. In fact, I'd say grab the VG-10 and save the money left over as a start on a Sharpmaker. It's probably the 2nd most important purchase after your first Spyderco. :p
Patrick LaFollette
Current: Dragonfly 2 ZDP-189, Chaparral 1, Techno 1, Delica 4 HAP-40, Dragonfly 2 HAP-40, Mantra 1, Ladybug Salt Hawkbill, Nirvana CPM, Endura 4 HAP-40, Sage 4, Para Military 2 CPM Cru-Wear, Sage 5, Caly3 HAP40, Sliverax, Lil' Nilakka, Chaparral Raffir Noble, Zulu, Manbug HAP40, Meerkat HAP40, Sage 1/Sage 2/Sage 3 CF, Introvert, Techno 2

10SBUM
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Re: Byrd Robin 2 Upgrade?

Postby 10SBUM » Mon Aug 08, 2016 12:50 pm

awa54 wrote: For those who aren't already fairly well versed in sharpening ZDP can be a challenge, the Sharpmaker is a really good way to get good results from a challenging steel... for those with an old Arkansas stone, some Norton bench stones (fine India excepted) or even worse a carbide pull-sharpener ZDP-189 is going to be a complete failure as far as maintaining the edge goes. So in a roundabout way I totally agree; get a Sharpmaker (and Diamond or CBN rods) and you'll do fine with ZDP-189, it's a great steel!

For sharpening, all I have is a Lansky Diamond Ceramic 4 Rod Turn Box. I would say I'm not really comfortable using it yet but have some older, seldom used, knives I'm going to use to try and hone my skills. Back when I didn't care about my blades I always used those cheap "pull through" sharpeners :rolleyes:

Thanks for everyone's input...leaning towards the Dragonfly 2 FRN VG10 right now!

10SBUM


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