A little OT, need some advice on torches

[sal]

I believe that Spyderco makes some of the best knives in the world. Naturally, I'm biased, but I start with the steel selection. Most of our USA made knives are now CPM-S30V, most of our Seki made models are VG-10. Our continual testing makes sure we maintain the quality and safety standards that we have established for our knives. This is just my opinion and we can argue the details in another thread.



My question is regarding torches. What flashlight companies out there would you say think and build their products like Spyderco builds their knives? thanx for your opinions.



sal

[J Smith]

Surefire would have to be at the top.Maglight has some very high quality,I think that maglight is getting some bad reviews because everyone is compareing them to surefire.That would be like compareing Spyderco to CRK.Spyderco is very good quaity but can't compare to CRK and shouldn't because CRKs quality cost you 3 to 4 times as much.Surefire is the same amount or more over Maglight.I can't leave out my fav.little light Photons 2 and 3.These can't be beat for the money.

SOOOO!,I see the internet is on the computer now!....Homer Simpson

[tbarahon]

Surefire is the best no doubt, both in quality of their flashlights and in customer service and in research. If you body-search me you will always find one or two spydies and a Surefire 6P in a horizontal kydex holster

I can see }{ in my trousers

[zardoz]

Surefire without a doubt. I wouldn't even consider comparing Maglite as a company, innovation and R&D from them has been non-existant, and although I admit they had a great product, they have been resting on their laurels far too long.

[cmassicotte]

Surefire without a doubt. I have been carrying their E2e as EDC for about two months now and I can't say enough about fit, finish, and quality - and ruggedness. They have no match in that regard. The very best 123 lithium light out there. I also have and use their Centurian C3 HA - same quality, same everything. Streamlight is equal or better with regchargeable lights. Two things to consider about rechargeables: 1) The Surefires use a battery stick that is recharged separately, like any other rechargeable battery - Streamlight has models (perhaps all of theirs, I'm not sure) that regcharge the flashlight in a cradle so you don't have change battery sticks. 2) For the really high light output (as in some of the Streamlights) the pay back is in the size & weight of the light. IMHO Surefire gives you the most bang.... er light... for the buck in the smallest package.
The downside for using Surefire or any other 123 lithium flashlight is the cost of the batteries.
I carry a flashlight for occaisonal use only, so batteries are the best way to go for me. If I had to use a flashlight on a nightly basis I would consider a rechargeable. That said, I would still go with a Surefire rechargeable becasuse of the qualities mentioned above. I believe they do have superior fit and finish to any other maker out their including Streamlight.

And Sal....

Surefire has a customer service department that just might be equal to yours.

Yes, gang, there are actually two companies out there that have the very best customer service possible.

JMHO

Chuck

There is no right way to do a wrong thing

Edited by - cmassicotte on 12/28/2002 10:02:41 AM

[sam the man..]

waay up on the apex ~ you'll find Surefire tactical lights. Progressive and agressive. They make some of the finest tactical illuminators in the world. And like Spyderco, Surefires are also highly copied. If you look at applied usage like diving and the outdoors, there's always brands like Pelican, Underwater Kinetics and streamlight to consider. Besides High Intensity lights, LEDs are also gaining popularity.. And high on the chain, you'll get the ARC-LS, Innova, CMG and so the list goes.. Mag Lites were once very popular, but it is Surefire whose setting the pace right now..

Sam

have scars will travel..

[AllenETreat]

Me being the dissenting voice, I'd say

Photon ( model(s) I,II&III) Why? they

use a form of FRN in their manufacture,

are as bright as any full sized "torch"

and are also VERY compact. ( Much like

the "cricket", eh, Sal? <img src="wink.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>) They also

don't cost as much as a "Surefire".




-AET<img src="wink.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>

[J Smith]

The photons are useally all I ever need.

SOOOO!,I see the internet is on the computer now!....Homer Simpson

[Al]

It sure is Surefire! ~ I'm the proud owner of an E2 Executive.

Chuck ~ Botachtactical.com sell decent priced Toshiba CR123 Battery packs @ $30 for a pack of 20 <a href="http://www.botachtactical.com/toscr123a ... l">here</a>.

In the UK it cost about £6 for 1 of these batteries - that's nearly $10!. So a pack of 20 will cost only £18...I'm living in the wrong country!. I'm waiting for a response to my email to see if they'll ship over the pond...

[Bruceter]

Sal,

I will also put my vote in for Surfire lights. I received an E2 for christmas and all I can say is WOW what a great light for the size.

I have done some browsing at www.candlepowerforums.com and it sounds like they have a very good customer service department.

Bruceter

[vampyrewolf]

SureFire puts out the best light for the money... but they are a bit pricy unless you are a light-a-holic...

Inova's X5MT brings up a close 2nd, after the SF line. Price brings it into the SOG of lights.

My Word, My Honour, is my Life.

[Fozzy]

Another vote for surefire. I own and use several at work and elsewhere.

I have also used streamlight for many years with good success.

I would have to say that Surefire's R&D edges out the competition. Streamlight, Mag Instrument and certainly some of the other, smaller manufacturers, (Photon, Arc, Innova)make some really terrific lights, but if i had to choose only one right now (I will confess to being a little bit of a flashlight nut too.)it would probably be a Surefire. In a weapon light it would definitely be a Surefire.

Just one working stiff's opinion Sal!! :D



Ben

Edited by - Fozzy on 12/28/2002 7:25:27 PM

[Sword and Shield]

For my money, the best out there is a Mag. Give me a 2AA or a 2D and I'm happy. All the light you could need, built like a tank, takes an incredible beating. Sounds a lot like a good <img src="spyder.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0> to me! <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>

Never underestimate the impossible.

[tortoise]

I replied over at BFC, here it is pasted:

ARC Flashlight seems (from the outside at least) most similar to Spyderco. Peter Gransee et al. innovate, strive for constant improvement, support their products, and actively seek and value ELU feedback. When people can refer to the head of a company by his first name and in a positive manner, the way they do Peter, the company must be doing something right. Sound familiar Sal?

I carry an ARC AAA LE every day, so does my wife. I'm almost never without my Military, she prefers her Mouse. I've spoken to Peter and I've chatted with Sal. Very similar gestalts in the companies, very similar weltanschauung in the men.

Surefire makes great stuff. I just got a new one for work. But... there's a little too much snobbery associated with them, a little too much "Our way is the only way," for me to feel as connected as to the two outfits above.


Now, not posted at BFC, but this is "in house" so to speak:

What's up Sal? Are you shopping for a light, or are you thinking some kind of collaboration?


Edited by - tortoise on 12/28/2002 9:02:53 PM

[BladeMaster]

My white Photon 3 and 6D Cell Maglite are the best flashlights I have ever owned.

[vampyrewolf]

Peter is over on CPF all the time(when ever Im over looking) getting feedback from the users.

He is having some interesting problems with Maglight, from what I gather Mag is suing over the design on the ARC AAA being too close to that of the Solitaire.

Mag has been around a long time as they are cheap yet durable. A 2AA light is only about $10USD[I paid $25CAN after taxes]. but they haven't had any new ideas in a long time.

Inova and SF both are a bit more pricy, and have thier following(much like highend <img src="spyder.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>s), but they take a lot of abuse before they even think of giving up. I'm buying an Inova X5MT from a fellow canuck for $60CAN, and the price and batt life are the only reasons I'm not buying a SF E2E-HA.

My Word, My Honour, is my Life.

Edited by - vampyrewolf on 12/28/2002 10:05:18 PM

[KBR]

Surefire, hands down. <img src="wink.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0> They make some serious compact powerhouse flashlights, IMO. I had a E2e-HA, but I traded it off for a Ti Lum and Spydercard. (Well worth the trade, but I'm still kicking myself.)

I carry a white Arc AAA on a keyring with a green Glowring. This compact light, slightly smaller than a Maglite Solitaire, just blows away the little Mag and other lights in the same size category. IMHO, the Arc AAA is the "Lil' Temperance" of flashlights. <img src="wink.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>

Last but not least, the Photons are great little compact lights, too. I carry a red Photon II on my keyring along with my keys and Jester SE, while my wife carries both a red and a white Photon II. She wasn't too keen on carrying the Photon until a situation happened that the lights went out at the local WallyWorld. Needless to say, she doesn't go anywhere without them anymore. <img src="wink.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>

Survive, Adapt, and Overcome...

[cmassicotte]

Al, Thanks for the tip, but I've been there, done that. Thats where i got by E2e and my C3-HA. And a 20 pack of batteries. botachtactical.com has some of best prices and pretty good customer service too!! <img src="spyder.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0> <img src="tongue.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0><img src="spyder.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>

KBR - What a trade you made. And you can still pick up an E2e when you want (or can), whereas the Ti Tanto and even the Spydie Card might be a bit harder to come by now.

Chuck

There is no right way to do a wrong thing

[java]

I'd go along with Surefires as having quality construction and the most innovations but, your use also dictates what you would consider best. I've had Maglites underwater accidently to 30 feet with no ill effects and they also have models UL approved for hazardous/explosive environments. I could also use the 3 and 4 D-Cell models as an effective baton whenever I did security work in the AF and not worry much about breaking them or if they broke, replacing them. Somehow in the daylight, my P6 doesn't seem that bright and I sure wouldn't swing one at a BG trying to breach my post - unless I wanted to irritate him.

Pricepoiint on Maglites make them the VW Beetle of the flashlight world. They're available every where and durable as all get out. Many of Maglites refinements have gone into making them operate more effectively in a host of environments and uses so they may not appear as innovative as Surefire or Streamlight. They ain't hi tech and they suck batteries like nobody's business but, they're solid and don't cost like a Surefire. Maybe they're the Buck's of the flashlight world - and that's not a bad place to be. JMO....

<b><font color="blue">"A hole-less knife is a soul-less knife is a whole less knife" -Javanese proverb </font> </b>

BTW: I thought the Sakai Hotaru was the Spyderco of flashlights! Heh-heh! <img src="wink.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>

Edited by - java on 12/29/2002 12:23:53 AM

[Jurphaas]

Hello Sal. It is the SureFire lights that I prefer. I own and use an older 9P (3x 123) and an E1 Executive on a daily basis at home and for work. To most users the drawback is the cost of the 123 batteries. Remember however that the batteries have a 10 year shelf span and can thus be bought by the box (12) and stored for quitte a while. (1sks has the best price on 123's).
I also consider to buy a new Inova X-5 and a small ARC-AAA light.
Over the years I've had all types of lights and stuck with Maglight for years. They are much like Buck in the fact that they have resisted to evolve, be sensible to trends and develop or incorporate new technology in time. Look around you. You can buy flashlights everywhere most made out of cheap plastic and made for AAA, AA, C,D batteries the bigger the batteries, the heavier the light. Most of these serve the masses and people often believe that the light they have is just fine as long as the batteries are OK. Things get nasty when the lights have not been operated for a long time and batteries begin to leak. I don't believe that costs is the crucial factor to go for one specific flashlight. It is much moer the urge for LIGHT! Strong and enough light to see good or to feel secure. SureFire has this all worked out. (The Wall of Light) Not everybody needs a tacticle light system, but it sure feels good to have one when you think you some more light as the Maglight can provide. I believe however, that in time and with enough resurge a lot can be done with the use of LED's and optical lenses to bundle light or to increase the power of light. This will save on batteries as well.
Sofar, so good, See you aroud!

Clipits work!