So what's your favorite steel?

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.
ramasipsc
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#101

Post by ramasipsc »

I am very impressed with CPM 10V. It cuts cuts and cuts. Also very important thing is knife geometry and thickness behind the edge than steel itself, but when these factors meets each other it's the best combination. Love that knife!
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Mic1
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#102

Post by Mic1 »

$167.97 for a Maxamet folding knife $500 list prize from Zero tolerance and they no longer make it. Different handle materials and such but really $167 for a super premium steel knife. Or how about M4 Gayle Bradley advocate $227 which even according to Mr. Bradley himself said spyderco did it as good as he could have less the high polish blade and contouring of the handle scales. I own several custom knives from Mr. Bradley and trust me when I say I paid 2 times that for my tac 1s . They don't cut corners they make knives of different materials and with different labor forces so they can have offerings for all budgets and tastes. Anyone can afford a Spyderco an average Jo can now if he wants have a Gayle Bradley or Phil Wilson with great steels, heat treat, materials, lock types, customer service etc. etc.

I cant think of one other knife company who offers so much to its customers. All the classics that they keep going on top of collaboration knives, premium steels, sprint runs, constant upgrades to classic designs, trying new steels when no other company does. Seriously what other production company has knives in 10v and s110 below is a list of steels they have used or are using. Their is no company that I know of who has offered so many steels in so many designs. Even most custom makers maybe use 1/3 of this list in their career.



1095
5160
52100
154CM
20CV
420J2
420 Modified
425 Modified
440A
440B
440C
440XH
8Cr13MoV
9Cr18Mo
A-2
ATS-34
ATS-55
AUS-6
AUS-8
AUS-10
BG-42
Cobalt Special
CPM® 3V
CPM 4V
CPM 9V
CPM 10V
CPM 15V
CPM 20CV
CPM M4
CPM S30V
CPM S35VN
CPM S60V(440V)
CPM S90V(420V)
CPM S110V
CPM® Cru-Wear®
Cru-Wear®
CTS® B52
CTS B70P
CTS B75P
CTS BD1
CTS BD1N
CTS BD30P
CTS 204P
CTS XHP
CTS 20CP
CTS 40CP
D-2
Elmax
GIN-1
H-1
HAP40
Super Blue Steel
K390
LC 200 N
Maxamet®
M-2
M390
MBS-26
MRS-30
N690Co
O-1
PMC27
PSF27
RWL34
Sandvik 12C27
Sandvik 12C27 Mod.
SUS 410
Vascowear
VG-10
W-1
W-2
X-15TN
ZDP-189

I put our friend Zero on the ignore list. Reading his post's is like dissecting a squirrel turd they are full of nuts.
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zeroed4x
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#103

Post by zeroed4x »

Mic1 wrote:
I put our friend Zero on the ignore list. Reading his post's is like dissecting a squirrel turd they are full of nuts.
Eat a big bag obnoxious fan boy.
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attila
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#104

Post by attila »

I appreciate that you gentlemen aren't using explicit language in our family-friendly forums, but it would be great if this argument (not quite family-friendly) were to be over or taken elsewhere. There is no reason to get rude and offensive the way you two have been.

If you have further name-calling to do, please take it to a one-on-one place.

Thanks for your understanding.
Have: old S30V Native, HAP40 Endura, ZDP DF2, S110V Manix LW, Cru-wear Para 3, SE H1 DF2, S90V Native 5, K390 Urban, SE Pac Salt, P.I.T.S., XHP Manix LW, SB Caly 3, B70P, PMA11, K03, Kapara, REX 45 Military, 154CM Manix LW, Swick, AEB-L Urban, KC Cruwear Manix, M390 PM2, Mantra 2, CruCarta Shaman, M390 Manix, K390 Police 4, S90V Manix LW, Rex 45 Manix LW, 20CV Manix, Rex 45 Lil’Native, Shaman, C208GP, Cruwear Manix, Cruwear Manix, M4 Chief, Z-max!!!

Want: SPY27, K490, Swick 5
.
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zeroed4x
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#105

Post by zeroed4x »

Surfingringo wrote:
zeroed4x wrote:
Bodog wrote:
zeroed4x wrote:
Bodog wrote:I wonder what steel Sal likes the most.
The cheapest stuff he can get his hands on. You'd all settle for tool steel as long as Sal make it for you.
I'm sure he probably gets steel for a price that makes sense to him and his company. A lot (most) of the steels Spyderco uses are definitely not cheap. I don't agree with some steels used in some platforms but that doesn't mean that Sal buys junk. I don't know if you were joking or not.
Well yes, its a business. You have to cut corners, make exceptions and get everything as cheap as you can to make a profit these days. Yes the only joke was regarding the guys who worship the tool steel. I'll admit, I like tool steel, I don't love it but I like it.
Hi Zeroed, I have to admit that you lost me with this one. Since you are talking specifically about steel, I would ask if you implying that Spyderco uses poor quality steel in their knives or that they purchase their steel for the lowest price possible? If the former then could you tell me which production company is consistently using "better" steels? If the latter, then could you tell me what you find odd about a production company procuring the best price possible for their raw materials? And what about that formula makes "these days" different from 10, 100 or 1000 years ago? Or maybe I just completely missed the point of your post.
Surfingringo, I hope everything is good with you. I'll elaborate on my comment. Nope, I'm not disrespecting Spyderco in any way. They have to buy NOT the cheapest steel but the best steel for the job at the cheapest prices. This is absolutely going to affect what steel is chosen when making a production run. Its healthy business, it's the way things are done. The comment about "as long as Sal makes it for you" is true. I'm included, I have cheap Spydercos with cheap steel and I have expensive one also. If Spyderco puts their name on it, you, me and everyone will buy it. That's about as accurate as it gets. I still roll my eyes at many of the fan boys out there that love their tool steel blades. I don't believe anyone other than a fan boy would get so excited about tool steel when there are so many viable cost effective stainless steels available. I'm guilty of owning them. Yep. The fan boys will blindly defend it it and quickly add you to their ignore list as if anyone really cares lol. They can like what they like but don't ever say anything to the contrary if that is what you believe. I've always been completely open, truthful, blunt and I especially don't give a **** if someone dislikes or disagrees with my comments or opinions. Surfingringo, I'm sure you've seen your share of these people, they want everyone to love everything that Spyderco produces, not only is that unrealistic it undoubtedly more than proves my point.
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#106

Post by Surfingringo »

Hey Zeroed, thank you for the polite reply and elaboration. I'm bored so I'm going to wax philosophical for a bit. Let me say in advance that none of this is meant to be a direct response to you. This just got me thinking so I wanted to fire out some general thoughts and beliefs.

First of all, let me address the idea about being open, blunt, truthful and plainspoken. IMHO, these are all character traits that I respect and seek to practice. I have to remind myself though that often when I am practicing these ideals it is in relation to opinions that I hold. I hold my opinions for a reason and the reason usually seems sound to me, otherwise I would hold different opinions. But the older I get, the more I find that my opinions need critical examination. That's why I like when folks will POLITELY challenge my ideas and opinions (and those of others) and ask me to provide sound reason and argument in their defense. If I am unable to provide such defense then I usually need to spend some time thinking about the beliefs I hold. And even if I am convinced that my reasoning is sound, I ALWAYS want to listen to other points of view. Honestly, I believe that is one of the biggest problems we have in the world today. We have become very divided and we tend to only associate with people who we agree with and who will tell us we are right. Eventually we become convinced that anyone holding different opinions is at best stupid and at worst a terrible person. When someone says something that sounds ridiculous to me I try to dismiss that initial thought and ask myself why they think that. If I can't make sense of it, I ask them to provide some reasoning for there position. If they are unable then I figure they are FOS but sometimes they will give very sound reasoning to support their position and I will realize "wow, I'm FOS". That's called learning...it's harder than some would have us believe. I have been on here a few years and I know how to use the block feature. If I run across someone that I can't learn anything from I might use it but I haven't found that person yet.
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#107

Post by Surfingringo »

Regarding Spyderco "Fanboyism" and tool steels, I have a slightly different perspective. I suppose I'm a bit of a fanboy but I base that on my experience. I have hung around here awhile and seen how the owners and employees of the company conduct themselves and I like it. I have been fortunate enough to meet many of them in person and I have developed a certain level of trust in them as human beings. So yes, when some internet drama comes up, I tend to assume that the Spyderco crew is on the up and up because that is what my experience has led me to expect. However, I try not to let that respect cause me to blindly defend them against anybody who has an issue. I don't even think that would be good for Spyderco as a company. I do, though, maintain the belief that they will continue to conduct themselves in a way that earns my respect.

As far as steel offerings go, I'll say that I rather like some of the tool steels. It doesn't really matter to me that Spyderco makes them. I have ordered several custom knives made of tool steel because they have certain qualities that I like. An example of one I like is M4. That steel has wear resistance that is comparable to s90v but is easier to sharpen and easier to bring to a high level or sharpness. It also takes (given my sharpening protocol which is 30 w/40 deg. microbevel) a more aggressive or "toothy" finish than some of the high vanadium stainless steels. It also exhibits higher toughness, but honestly I don't have any issues with stainless steels chipping on me. I don't like having to give up the corrosion resistance but those aspects of sharpening are important to me so a steel like m4 is desirable to me in certain situations and I can tell you with complete honesty that that desirability has nothing to do with Sal Glesser or Spyderco. If Spyderco is using m4 then so much the better but I'll own the steel either way because I like it.
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#108

Post by zeroed4x »

Bodog wrote: If he's talking about cutting corners on some other things, well, yeah, I guess. If no corners were cut all of these knives would cost $500 and up. At some point you have to accept cheaper materials and fit and finish. As long as the end price is in line with what the market will bear I don't see how that's different than any other business. Sure. There are sometimes engineering snafus but that happens with any kind of product.
Thank you Bodog, you do understand, it is just the way all things are manufactured, to make profit.
The point is no mater what steel it is, what the price is, you, me and everyone is going to buy it if it has the Spyderco name on it.
If Sal decided to only use cheaper tool steels from here on out, every one of you including myself would still buy them. Is that too real for some of you ? :-)
Bodog wrote: I think I get what the guy is saying but I don't see why he's saying it with any kind of animosity. Isn't it the same guy who railed against flat grinds vs hollow because he wanted aesthetics over function for his collectable knives? I could be mis-remembering.
Bodog, I'll sum it up for you my friend. There is certainly no animosity, just matter of fact, blunt to the truth.
Yes that me, the guy who will always speak without a filter, without care if anyone has a difference of opinion and absolutely not caring if anyone disagrees with me, it is their right just as I will always fully execute my own. I don't absolutely rail against FFG, I do want to see more, I own them too. I just DO NOT want to see "everything" perverted to FFG. Everyone has their favorites, well mine is not FFG. Anyone don't like that comment. Too bad, I don't care lol.
Anyone want to discuss the topic of blade geometry like an adult, I'm o.k. with it, don't like it... want to act like a snowflake, please add me to your ignore list now. I'm not here to fight with anyone about their opinion and damned sure not about my own.

As far as your comment regarding me supposedly stating " aesthetics over function " nope, it never happened. Its all good brother. I can understand how you might have seen some other twisted/vilified posts regarding my personal preferences or opinions on the matter from one or two other forum members. I assure you that statement was not from me. And just so we are clear, I use everything I collect. Every piece unless I have doubles.

I will just state that I want to see more saber and hollow grinds. If all I wanted to do was food prep, I'd only use a FFG chiefs knife. My world has a lot more to cut, carve, stab and slice other than perfect paper thin tomatoes. I know that statement will ruffle some fan boys out there, don't anyone bother to get their spydie hole puckered over it. We now return to our scheduled program.....
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#109

Post by vivi »

What things do you cut that you find saber grounds offer superior performance to full flat grinds?
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#110

Post by Surfingringo »

Vivi wrote:What things do you cut that you find saber grounds offer superior performance to full flat grinds?
I was wondering the same thing. I can see the advantages of hollow grinds but from a cutting standpoint the saber grind is....meh. I guess if you are looking for overall blade strength?
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#111

Post by zeroed4x »

Surfingringo wrote:Regarding Spyderco "Fanboyism" and tool steels, I have a slightly different perspective. I suppose I'm a bit of a fanboy but I base that on my experience. I have hung around here awhile and seen how the owners and employees of the company conduct themselves and I like it. I have been fortunate enough to meet many of them in person and I have developed a certain level of trust in them as human beings. So yes, when some internet drama comes up, I tend to assume that the Spyderco crew is on the up and up because that is what my experience has led me to expect. However, I try not to let that respect cause me to blindly defend them against anybody who has an issue. I don't even think that would be good for Spyderco as a company. I do, though, maintain the belief that they will continue to conduct themselves in a way that earns my respect.

As far as steel offerings go, I'll say that I rather like some of the tool steels. It doesn't really matter to me that Spyderco makes them. I have ordered several custom knives made of tool steel because they have certain qualities that I like. An example of one I like is M4. That steel has wear resistance that is comparable to s90v but is easier to sharpen and easier to bring to a high level or sharpness. It also takes (given my sharpening protocol which is 30 w/40 deg. microbevel) a more aggressive or "toothy" finish than some of the high vanadium stainless steels. It also exhibits higher toughness, but honestly I don't have any issues with stainless steels chipping on me. I don't like having to give up the corrosion resistance but those aspects of sharpening are important to me so a steel like m4 is desirable to me in certain situations and I can tell you with complete honesty that that desirability has nothing to do with Sal Glesser or Spyderco. If Spyderco is using m4 then so much the better but I'll own the steel either way because I like it.
I can relate to all that you've stated. I do like many of the tool steels also. I own many customs that are 01, 02, D2, M4 etc etc.... these are great knives and some of my favorites. All of the tool steels are for the most part easy to sharpen. I have made it a habit of not letting any of my harder stainless blades lose their edge as I touch them up often and strop them to keep from having to sharpen so much. With the tool steels, they will usually go a bit further but I don't mind sharpening them. I actually like sharpening. When it comes to a pocket knife, something that is in a sweaty pants pocket, I much prefer a stainless with having the security or peace of mind that if I forget to lube it, I'm not going to have to polish the patina off of it, a rust stain or a pit. Unforgiving tool steel forces you to discipline yourself to the maintenance duties that it absolutely demands. If I could get a Gayle Bradley II in a highly rust resistant stainless, I would personally enjoy the knife even more. I'll admit that Spyderco is the entire reason I started collecting knives on the level that I do. I collect other knife brands but Spyderco is always my 1st choice when looking for something new. In my case the Spyderco name has me enamored. I know that even if its a cheaper Spyderco, its going to most likely be better than many other brands at the same or slightly higher price. I still EDC my value folders, I enjoy them for what they are.
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#112

Post by BDNX »

I actually really like CTS-BD1 personally. N690Co, H1, S35vn, and XHP are a few others I really like...
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#113

Post by zeroed4x »

Vivi wrote:What things do you cut that you find saber grounds offer superior performance to full flat grinds?
Flats cut well but I can slice or cut with a saber, scandi or hollow just as well. All other grinds look better than a flat.
The look of a hollow grind is universally appealing. Someone had mentioned blade strength. Yes, Hollow and Sabers have a lot less flex if your going to hard use them.
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#114

Post by vivi »

So is your preference based on appearances?
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#115

Post by Surfingringo »

zeroed4x wrote: Flats cut well but I can slice or cut with a saber, scandi or hollow just as well. All other grinds look better than a flat.
The look of a hollow grind is universally appealing. Someone had mentioned blade strength. Yes, Hollow and Sabers have a lot less flex if your going to hard use them.
zeroed4x wrote:
As far as your comment regarding me supposedly stating " aesthetics over function " nope, it never happened.
It sounds like it's happening now. ;) Hey, I'll agree with you on one thing, a hollow grind adds some very beautiful lines to a blade and I would be happy to see a few more offered in the Spyderco lineup. The hollow grind can also make for a really thin high performance edge.
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#116

Post by zeroed4x »

Vivi wrote:So is your preference based on appearances?
No, my preference is based upon performance first and appearance secondly.
I've used hollow ground knives with many different geometries for most of my life, long before FFG was ever on the level of production for anything other than kitchen cutlery or slip joint pocket knives.
I know how to use and finesse any hollow ground blade to perform just as well as a FFG. There are no normal cutting tasks that can not be preformed with either one.
For some people, flat is the go to simply because less skill or effort may be required for certain tasks or maybe they have have only used ffg, they are used to it, comfortable with it so that is what they prefer. Good for them, go with what you know.
I've been involved with bush craft in one form or another my entire life, fishing, hunting etc. etc. and you know what, we survived all these years, we got the jobs done and didn't use FFG. Vivi, if you're attempting to tell me that FFG out performs other blades, I'll listen to what you present.
I used to get poo pooed by the bush crafters for not always using a scandi blade. Truth is, I can use a scandi but I can use a hollow grind much more proficiently because it is simply a preference. Anything a FFG can do a hollow grind can do.... the hollow grind just looks better do it.
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#117

Post by Bodog »

zeroed4x wrote:
Vivi wrote:What things do you cut that you find saber grounds offer superior performance to full flat grinds?
Flats cut well but I can slice or cut with a saber, scandi or hollow just as well. All other grinds look better than a flat.
The look of a hollow grind is universally appealing
Not to me. At all. I'm completely opposite. Hollow grinds, especially hollow grinds deep enough to add some kind of aesthetic difference, only serve to wedge or bind the knife in any kind of real work. But that's my personal experience and won't begrudge anyone for having different experiences. I'd rather have a knife that works than one that doesn't but looks good.
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#118

Post by zeroed4x »

Surfingringo wrote:
zeroed4x wrote: Flats cut well but I can slice or cut with a saber, scandi or hollow just as well. All other grinds look better than a flat.
The look of a hollow grind is universally appealing. Someone had mentioned blade strength. Yes, Hollow and Sabers have a lot less flex if your going to hard use them.
zeroed4x wrote:
As far as your comment regarding me supposedly stating " aesthetics over function " nope, it never happened.
It sounds like it's happening now. ;) Hey, I'll agree with you on one thing, a hollow grind adds some very beautiful lines to a blade and I would be happy to see a few more offered in the Spyderco lineup. The hollow grind can also make for a really thin high performance edge.
Yes, someone else who also appreciates classic lines, aesthetics and performance. How did that happen :-)
Yes Spyderco needs to get back to their roots once again and offer some more hollow grinds. There.... that should PO the FFG fan club lol
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#119

Post by zeroed4x »

Bodog wrote:
zeroed4x wrote:
Vivi wrote:What things do you cut that you find saber grounds offer superior performance to full flat grinds?
Flats cut well but I can slice or cut with a saber, scandi or hollow just as well. All other grinds look better than a flat.
The look of a hollow grind is universally appealing
Not to me. At all. I'm completely opposite. Hollow grinds, especially hollow grinds deep enough to add some kind of aesthetic difference, only serve to wedge or bind the knife in any kind of real work. But that's my personal experience and won't begrudge anyone for having different experiences. I'd rather have a knife that works than one that doesn't but looks good.
Sounds like you need to sharpen them if they are not getting the job done, nudge nudge :-) I guess we all get used to using what we cut our teeth on. I don't have any real problem with flats, for me they simply are not as eye appealing as hollow grinds. I can use either and get the job done with equal effort. When it comes to where the rubber meets the road, we all want to get it done, some of us what a little style while we are doing it.
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Re: So what's your favorite steel?

#120

Post by Bodog »

zeroed4x wrote:
Bodog wrote:
zeroed4x wrote:
Vivi wrote:What things do you cut that you find saber grounds offer superior performance to full flat grinds?
Flats cut well but I can slice or cut with a saber, scandi or hollow just as well. All other grinds look better than a flat.
The look of a hollow grind is universally appealing
Not to me. At all. I'm completely opposite. Hollow grinds, especially hollow grinds deep enough to add some kind of aesthetic difference, only serve to wedge or bind the knife in any kind of real work. But that's my personal experience and won't begrudge anyone for having different experiences. I'd rather have a knife that works than one that doesn't but looks good.
Sounds like you need to sharpen them if they are not getting the job done, nudge nudge :-) I guess we all get used to using what we cut our teeth on. I don't have any real problem with flats, for me they simply are not as eye appealing as hollow grinds. I can use either and get the job done with equal effort. When it comes to where the rubber meets the road, we all want to get it done, some of us what a little style while we are doing it.
For me what pleases my eye is what appears to be functionally correct for me. Generally. After the function has been met then the pure aesthetics can come into play. Hollow grinds wedge and bind far too much for me to really find useful for anything that may need to make deep cuts, which is pretty much any knife I carry. A straight razor would be better with a hollow grind and has been found to be so through many years of trial and error.

So to look at some kind of EDC with a hollow grind detracts from the looks for me because I can see obviously that it will perform at a lesser level than something else.

I'd find a broad sword with a deep hollow grind to be visually unappealing as well as a straight razor with a saber grind because I know their performance would be less than it should be. But that's based on what I know to be true for myself. Maybe you could find a good use for a saber ground straight razor? Or maybe you could find a saber ground straight razor to work better than a hollow ground razor? That's up to you and I won't hold anything against you for it. But I'd hope you wouldn't try to do something immature like hold my preference against me.
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