I will now EDC only SE for 6 months.

[Chum]

Not a spyderco, but, the victorinox folders like I believe, the sentinel, have serrations from the tip but leave about 3/4ths of an inch of plain edge toward the base of the knife. They look like decent quality but have a left handed linerlock for some reason or another.(?) Very strange if you ask me. Maybe everyone in Switzerland is left handed?

You know an interesting point about Victorinox is that their serrations aren't bad at all >> now don't get me wrong because they are not as good as the ones the Great Spyder Factory produces but for the price they give a really good bang for your dollar.

I've always said that Victorinox multi-tools are truly the best out there in my opinion. I want that newest one of theirs really bad. Victorinox does not have quite the top notch quality that Spyderco does but I still respect them and they do give you a great product for a very modest price tag.

But you're right their serrations aren't bad at all. However I don't think that EVIL will allow any serrated blade other than Spyderco for his challenge and I don't blame him a bit, The more I think about it I would really like to see a collaboration between Spyderco and Victorinox>> maybe in the multi-tool arena>> or a sharpening device.

My 2 cents... As much as I like Spyderco, I don't think they do as good a job with their serrations as Victorinox. Victorinox gives you smooth, rolling, serrations. They don't saw material the way Spyderco serrations (and pretty much all other serrations) do, at least it doesn't feel like they do. Victorinox serrations just feel much better.

This is why I was hoping Spyderco might start using their "Two-Step SpyderEdge" on some of their folders. It looks like it would be a smoother cutting serration pattern.

Also, for the reasons mentioned in this thread, I totally agree that the serrations in the front and PE in the back are the way to go. You want to use the heel for carving wood, and PE works better for that.

I usually cut up carboard on a flat surface. Serrrations at the front of the blade, where the belly is, give you a lot more cutting longevity... like a serrated steak knife on a ceramic plate.

I would love to see Spyderco do something similar to what Victorinox does with their serrations.

[JD Spydo]

Not a spyderco, but, the victorinox folders like I believe, the sentinel, have serrations from the tip but leave about 3/4ths of an inch of plain edge toward the base of the knife. They look like decent quality but have a left handed linerlock for some reason or another.(?) Very strange if you ask me. Maybe everyone in Switzerland is left handed?

You know an interesting point about Victorinox is that their serrations aren't bad at all >> now don't get me wrong because they are not as good as the ones the Great Spyder Factory produces but for the price they give a really good bang for your dollar.

I've always said that Victorinox multi-tools are truly the best out there in my opinion. I want that newest one of theirs really bad. Victorinox does not have quite the top notch quality that Spyderco does but I still respect them and they do give you a great product for a very modest price tag.

But you're right their serrations aren't bad at all. However I don't think that EVIL will allow any serrated blade other than Spyderco for his challenge and I don't blame him a bit, The more I think about it I would really like to see a collaboration between Spyderco and Victorinox>> maybe in the multi-tool arena>> or a sharpening device.

My 2 cents... As much as I like Spyderco, I don't think they do as good a job with their serrations as Victorinox. Victorinox gives you smooth, rolling, serrations. They don't saw material the way Spyderco serrations (and pretty much all other serrations) do, at least it doesn't feel like they do. Victorinox serrations just feel much better.

This is why I was hoping Spyderco might start using their "Two-Step SpyderEdge" on some of their folders. It looks like it would be a smoother cutting serration pattern.

Holy Spyderedge!! Batman!! :D This thread is starting to worry me a little. It's starting to take on the same characteristics that my old Hawkbill thread did back in the mid to late 2000s :eek: Yes It just won't die no matter how many lethal injections you give it :rolleyes:

CHUM I"m about 80% with you on that idea you present but I'm not sure how you're going to go about designing a "Two Stage Serration Pattern" :confused: Now I do agree with you that Victorinox's rolling serration pattern is great for some applications and it's funny that it would come up at this time because I just used the serrated blade on my Victorinox Swiss Tool ~ Multi-tool the other day to cut the end off of a garden hose to put a new end on it>> and let me tell you it was like using a laser it worked well. But do understand I've worked with a lot of serrated blades in the past 10 years or so and there are some materials so touch and fibrous that only the Spyderedge I find is about 95% reliable in most situations.

And for this two stage serration idea I'm not totally sure what advantages you really think that will have? Because usually when I want the use of a lesser agressive serration like the ones on my older AUS-8 Catcherman well I just simply go to that particular blade and I find that works most all of the time. Not to mention the sharpening hassle it's going to create But what the heck I've got an open mind I'll hear you out.

Oh by the way how many aboard this ship are still using a Spyderedged blade exclusively this far into the challenge? And be honest :D

[D-Roc]

Wow...Lots of posts in this thread. I think its a great idea as my sig and avatar probably attest to. And thanks for the reminder of the 701 stones, JD Spydo, because I actually forgot that I owned them, and that they were sitting in a drawer somewhere in my house along with my diamond stones for my 204- which are (At least easily, and maybe not even then, at that), are the only things that might be able to do an effective job on my my Endura ZDP-189 SE. I'm not sure how sharpening that thing would go.
I probably sound like a turd being months late on a reply, but I'm behind you and I still LOVE SE.

[beatlman87]

I have always wondered why, as a right handed person, the serrations seem to be ground on the wrong side of the blade. If you slice away from yourself the serrations don't lay flat on the cutting surface

[Evil D]

Not a spyderco, but, the victorinox folders like I believe, the sentinel, have serrations from the tip but leave about 3/4ths of an inch of plain edge toward the base of the knife. They look like decent quality but have a left handed linerlock for some reason or another.(?) Very strange if you ask me. Maybe everyone in Switzerland is left handed?

You know an interesting point about Victorinox is that their serrations aren't bad at all >> now don't get me wrong because they are not as good as the ones the Great Spyder Factory produces but for the price they give a really good bang for your dollar.

I've always said that Victorinox multi-tools are truly the best out there in my opinion. I want that newest one of theirs really bad. Victorinox does not have quite the top notch quality that Spyderco does but I still respect them and they do give you a great product for a very modest price tag.

But you're right their serrations aren't bad at all. However I don't think that EVIL will allow any serrated blade other than Spyderco for his challenge and I don't blame him a bit, The more I think about it I would really like to see a collaboration between Spyderco and Victorinox>> maybe in the multi-tool arena>> or a sharpening device.

My 2 cents... As much as I like Spyderco, I don't think they do as good a job with their serrations as Victorinox. Victorinox gives you smooth, rolling, serrations. They don't saw material the way Spyderco serrations (and pretty much all other serrations) do, at least it doesn't feel like they do. Victorinox serrations just feel much better.

This is why I was hoping Spyderco might start using their "Two-Step SpyderEdge" on some of their folders. It looks like it would be a smoother cutting serration pattern.

Also, for the reasons mentioned in this thread, I totally agree that the serrations in the front and PE in the back are the way to go. You want to use the heel for carving wood, and PE works better for that.

I usually cut up carboard on a flat surface. Serrrations at the front of the blade, where the belly is, give you a lot more cutting longevity... like a serrated steak knife on a ceramic plate.

I would love to see Spyderco do something similar to what Victorinox does with their serrations.

It isn't until you try to cut something like a seat belt that you see the beauty in Spyderco's serration pattern. I'm sure Vic serrations will cut a seat belt too, but not nearly as aggressively. It all comes down to use and what you're cutting.

[Evil D]

I have always wondered why, as a right handed person, the serrations seem to be ground on the wrong side of the blade. If you slice away from yourself the serrations don't lay flat on the cutting surface

According to Sal, they cut them with the intention of having the blade walk away from the opposite hand that's holding the material being cut. It's a safety precaution.

[Evil D]

As for myself, I'm still carrying my Dfly and loving it. As a side effect to this test, I'm finding that I haven't sharpened a knife in months except for my ZT0303 and that was just to get it done and ready for when I do start using it. I don't know if I would say edge retention is that much better or if I just don't obsess over the edge and thumb it as much as I do a PE blade... Could be both. When I do sharpen the serrations I just go over them with NY Dremel and they're ready to rock again. If I'm learning anything it's that contrary to all the complaints about difficulty in sharpening, they're actually lower maintenance than my PE knives by a large margin. The only thing I've cut that so far that gave me a stark difference compared to PE was an old tshirt I cut up for rags. I will confess that I did some back to back comparison cuts with my Manix to get an immediate feel for how they differ, and in this one test the PE blade cut much more cleanly. However, I didn't experience any snagging or difficulty in cutting with the SE blade (which was my Military BTW). I'll also point out that this only happened when I rolled or bunched up the fabric...if I only cut a single layer, there was no difference at all, and in fact I'd say the SE may have been better since it tends to lock the fabric into one serration and cut without allowing the fabric to slip off the blade.

[JD Spydo]

EVIL you're so right on about most of Spyderco's serrated models going through extremely tough and very fibrous materials like a laser beam in Spyderedge. And again on the Victorinox serrated blades>> they are truly better than many other knife company's serration patterns for sure. But like EVIL says they are just not agressive enough to take on emergency type jobs that many first responders are faced with in extremely crucial and demanding situations.

I think we'll see a day in the future that a Spyderco model like the ASSIST will be standard equipment for many first responders. I don't see any other company's serrated blades even being a close second to Spyderco's Spyderedge with what is currently offered in today's market.

I bet also that many first responders won't have any trouble accepting your SE Challenge EVIL C'mon people at least commit to having one full Spyderedged blade as a companion blade to your main EDC>> any of us could do that with no problem and give the Spyderedged blade a try first on your jobs just to see how it might surprise you. Two ideal companion blades in full SE would be the older SE Native and Harpy.

[Surfingringo]

As for myself, I'm still carrying my Dfly and loving it. As a side effect to this test, I'm finding that I haven't sharpened a knife in months except for my ZT0303 and that was just to get it done and ready for when I do start using it. I don't know if I would say edge retention is that much better or if I just don't obsess over the edge and thumb it as much as I do a PE blade... Could be both. When I do sharpen the serrations I just go over them with NY Dremel and they're ready to rock again. If I'm learning anything it's that contrary to all the complaints about difficulty in sharpening, they're actually lower maintenance than my PE knives by a large margin. The only thing I've cut that so far that gave me a stark difference compared to PE was an old tshirt I cut up for rags. I will confess that I did some back to back comparison cuts with my Manix to get an immediate feel for how they differ, and in this one test the PE blade cut much more cleanly. However, I didn't experience any snagging or difficulty in cutting with the SE blade (which was my Military BTW). I'll also point out that this only happened when I rolled or bunched up the fabric...if I only cut a single layer, there was no difference at all, and in fact I'd say the SE may have been better since it tends to lock the fabric into one serration and cut without allowing the fabric to slip off the blade.

This. ^ At least in my case.

[Chum]

...I'm not sure how you're going to go about designing a "Two Stage Serration Pattern" :confused:

I'm not, Spyderco has already designed it...

A thread I started about it.... http://www.spyderco.com/forumII/viewtop ... 58#p999558

And for this two stage serration idea I'm not totally sure what advantages you really think that will have?

I just prefer a "rolling" serration pattern because they are less likely to snag but they still protect the sharpened scallops.

And again on the Victorinox serrated blades>> they are truly better than many other knife company's serration patterns for sure. But like EVIL says they are just not agressive enough to take on emergency type jobs that many first responders are faced with in extremely crucial and demanding situations.

In both videos they cut seat belts with the less aggressive serrations. Honestly any hair shaving sharp plain edge with cut a seat belt easily. A serrated edge will make it that much easier.


*** Apologies on the links. I haven't posted here very much and I don't have the codes down yet. On most forums you can just post the link address to a Youtube video and surround it with which is what the code connected to this forum suggests. For some reason it isn't working for me.

btw... I'm not suggesting that for some things the Spyderco serrations don't work better than the Victorinox serrations, only that I prefer the Victorinox serrations because they are more smooth and they don't tend to snag as often. This is why I was excited to see the Spyderco "Two Stage Serration Pattern." I intend to pick up one of those knives.

[Evil D]

I'm sure PE will cut just fine, but they do also have a tendency to slip and require more than once cut attempt, especially if you're in an emergency and are maybe upside down/in a crash/etc. Of course, this isn't really much of an argument for EDC purposes, just an observation.

My point of this thread was really just to stir up interest and hopefully show people that if a diehard PE guy like myself could learn to love SE, then maybe they'd give it a try too. I think people are too quick to dismiss serrations because they just don't want to sharpen them, but my other thread about how I sharpen them also ties into this. I'm also just doing some long term testing for myself, in both use and for sharpening purposes.

In the end, I'll no doubt be carrying this Dfly with me regardless of what other knife I have on me, if not a larger option. I'm still looking into having a knife serrated...I'm really thinking about buying one of the BD1 Manix 2 LW's and have that cut with serrations, then my EDC will be two versions of the Manix 2 LW.

[jackknifeh]

I'm sure PE will cut just fine, but they do also have a tendency to slip and require more than once cut attempt, especially if you're in an emergency and are maybe upside down/in a crash/etc. Of course, this isn't really much of an argument for EDC purposes, just an observation.

My point of this thread was really just to stir up interest and hopefully show people that if a diehard PE guy like myself could learn to love SE, then maybe they'd give it a try too. I think people are too quick to dismiss serrations because they just don't want to sharpen them, but my other thread about how I sharpen them also ties into this. I'm also just doing some long term testing for myself, in both use and for sharpening purposes.

In the end, I'll no doubt be carrying this Dfly with me regardless of what other knife I have on me, if not a larger option. I'm still looking into having a knife serrated...I'm really thinking about buying one of the BD1 Manix 2 LW's and have that cut with serrations, then my EDC will be two versions of the Manix 2 LW.

I think it's good to force myself to use a serrated edge for a while at least. How else will I know if I like them or not for my needs. Then after using one I'll know when I'd rather use a SE or a PE. Since I normally have more than one knife anyway I can always just make sure I have a serrated edge along with the other knives. Of course this brings the Dyad into the picture. For anyone with a need or desire for both it's an obvious EDC option.

Good thread.

Jack

[JD Spydo]

I'm sure PE will cut just fine, but they do also have a tendency to slip and require more than once cut attempt, especially if you're in an emergency and are maybe upside down/in a crash/etc. Of course, this isn't really much of an argument for EDC purposes, just an observation.

My point of this thread was really just to stir up interest and hopefully show people that if a diehard PE guy like myself could learn to love SE, then maybe they'd give it a try too. I think people are too quick to dismiss serrations because they just don't want to sharpen them, but my other thread about how I sharpen them also ties into this. I'm also just doing some long term testing for myself, in both use and for sharpening purposes.

Well EVIL I think you hit the nail directly on the head>> I truly believe your "spot on" in regards to the fact that many people have developed a phobia of Spyderedged blades in fear of them eventually needing to be sharpened. And it's a fear that just totally devoid of any substance because Spyderco themselves have supplied many good sharpening tools that will do a sufficient job on serrations. I taught myself how to use the 701 Profiles a few years back on Spyderedges as well as many other company's serration patterns>> and I'm confident we'll see the 701 Profiles return at some point because of the lackluster interest in the Goldenstone.

[Bill1170]

I'd buy the 701 profiles in a heartbeat if I knew they were available again. Missed that boat.

[jackknifeh]

I'd buy the 701 profiles in a heartbeat if I knew they were available again. Missed that boat.

The 701 profile stones are great for serrated edges. I think the smaller corners fit inside the smaller serrations on spyderedge knives. If anyone has one or both fine and medium stones and a serrated Spyderco can you confirm that? But if they aren't available the DMT diamond serrated sharpeners are a good option. They are the long, skinny, cone shaped sharpeners that many companies make. They come in coarse, fine and extra-fine grit. In addition to them I have the blade clamp that goes with the DMT aligner system and the rod for serrated sharpeners. The sharpener itself unscrews from the handle and screws onto the rod for the aligner. Then you can control the angle you put on the knife. It takes a bit of adjusting but I've been able to match the angle on the Spyderco's I have. Just to make sure I used the DMT tools on one large and one small serration on my Dyad a couple of days ago. But to sharpen them I don't try to match the angle EXACTLY. I use an angle a TINY bit higher than what is already on the knife. It works great. Since the angle is controlled for you all you have to do is move the sharpener back and forth while spinning it a little. Just make sure the part of the sharpener is the right spot depending on the diameter of the serration. I have all three grits but you don't really need them. Actually you only need one grit, fine or extra-fine to maintain an already sharp knife. Of course if the edge needs a lot of work you might want the coarser grit.

Then there are the smaller fine grit ceramic Spyderco stones. I think they are 5" long. I have the triangle one and have almost bought the one with a small corner and a larger rounded end. Here is the link for this one. Model 400F1SP slip stone.
http://www.spyderco.com/catalog/details.php?product=91

There are three others. 400F1S, 400F1T and 400f1R (Square, Triangle, Round). I've used the triangle one a couple of times to create a sharpening notch. You can get the whole set in a leather pouch for around $42 or thereabouts.

[Holland]

Awesome to see you sticking to it David! Would love to see some user pics of your se dfly salt!

[Evil D]

Awesome to see you sticking to it David! Would love to see some user pics of your se dfly salt!

I'll get some up soon. It doesn't take much to make H1 look like it's been used for years, and the yellow does get dirty quick. I'm doing my best to resist dying the yellow....thinking about going khaki with it.

[Holland]

That would be nice. Red would be pretty cool as well I bet

[JD Spydo]

I'd buy the 701 profiles in a heartbeat if I knew they were available again. Missed that boat.

You yourself, Jack, EVIL and others on this thread just need to continue to be a "squeaky wheel" demanding oil Because I firmly believe that if enough people want the Spyderco 701 Profiles to return the company won't ignore us forever I'm certain of it. But this go around they need to have extra grits available.

As I said on an earlier post that the fear or aprehension of sharpening serrated edges is just flat out baseless and without valid reason other than just plain old laziness :rolleyes:

And it's not that demanding or complicated it just takes a little common horse sense and anyone could apply themselves and learn to use them. People are just flat out cheating themselves by not trying out a Spyderedged blade. There are so many cutting jobs that can be made easy with the Spyderedge. Until I got my first Spyder which was a full Spyderedged, stainless handled, GIN-1 Mariner model>> and it showed me the good side of high quality serrated cutlery.

If most people knew just how good serrated edges are on certain cutting jobs they would get them immediately. And there are no valid excuses period.

[Evil D]

I'm fairly sure at this point if I could get the 701s I'd buy a set. I'm not gonna go out of my way scouring the internet for a set, but if Spyderco put them back out there, especially if they gave us more than 2 grits, I'd jump all over them. I think I'd probably still use my Dremel, but they're surely a step above the tapered diamond rod I'm using now (which to be fair, does an excellent job as it is).

I still haven't given up on figuring out how to use ceramic rods on my Edge Pro. Maybe if I got some 701s I could figure something out with those.

JD how long are they?