Steel Types

[Morgoroth]

I just got a Cara Cara and I'm wondering how the steel compares to my Paraframe. I know I like my Byrd a lot more, and it functions better so far, but I don't know a lot about different types of steel, and I'm looking to learn more.

[Kweb]

I've been in to knives for about 5 years and still don't know half of it, enter The Deacon.

[araneae]

Assuming you are referring to a Gerber paraframe, the Cara Cara will be vastly superior to whatever Chinese mystery steel Gerber is using. I am certain the Byrd will have a better grade of steel, better grind and superior heat treat.

[Morgoroth]

Thanks! That is what I was thinking :-)

[Blerv]

The treatment exceeds the steel, that's for sure :) . Byrds may be a bit gritty at times or even clunky compared to the Spyderco variant, the product typically far exceeds the price though.

[Morgoroth]

The heat treatment?

[dbcad]

Sharpened a Gerber paraframe for someone at work. Looked up what steel and queried it as I always do. The material does not have a good reputation. I forget the name of the material now because I dismissed it as inconsequential. It was very difficult to achieve a nice fine edge on the Paraframe.

8Cr13MoV does take a nice edge fairly easily and polishes well. This material done by Spyderco is a nice workable steel)

[sal]

Hi Morgoroth,

Welcome to our forum.

The world of steel is vast. Such that it could be a life study. We are fortunate in that many of the afi's that hang out here are quite knowledgable about blade steels and are willing to share.

The simple answer; Think of blade steel as a cake. Mix into the dough (iron) ingredients (sugar, salt), (carbon, chrome). mix it. Cooking is the heat treat and after the steel is heat treated, it is different than before the heat treatment.....dough to cake.

sal

[Blerv]

The heat treatment?

Sorry, I meant the overall treatment. Proper heat treat, grind, etc. Every time I sharpen my Dad's Flight I'm impressed to the quality for $20 or so.

[dbcad]

Excellent analogy from Sal :) .......Hope it'lll help the OP, helped me to simplify some understanding :)

Each steel has it's own range of cooking options resulting in different final properties for the cake.

[Morgoroth]

Nice, I like the analogy.

[SpyderTaco]

The 8cr on Byrds and the value folders gets very sharp and functions well. Yes, it needs sharpened more often than vg-10 or s30v but it works very well for me.
Gerber is known everywhere to use mystery steels. My wife has what I believe is a mini paraframe (she had it before I met her!) and it is a decently built little knife for the money but the blade is useless obviously negating it's usefulness.

[jackknifeh]

All my life I used pocket knives of good reputation and some without reputation at all that I know of. Case and Buck are two that I remember using along with others. I've found the 8Cr13MoM to be a "more better" steel than what I have used in the past. Sharpens easily and stays sharp longer. Not as long as some other blade steels but still it is a very good blade steel option. I had a Gerber once that had 440-A. That thing would get dull if you held it up against the wind. My son liked the looks and feel of it so I gave it to him. A week or so later he informed me the knife wouldn't stay sharp. :) Anyway, Spyderco knives all have good (OR GREAT) blade steels in my limited experience. Also, they try different ones frequently. Not many other companies do that that I'm aware of. I've had two byrds and liked both.

Jack

[Officer Gigglez]

Long story short, any knife that is a legit Byrd or Spyderco, you'll always get top tier quality with an equal price to its materials. In other words; Spyderco/Byrd beats everything. Period.

[Cliff Stamp]

Asking about knives other than Spyderco on Spyderco's forum isn't likely to generate unbiased perspectives given the nature of the posting populace.

However it is fairly silly to think that only Spyderco uses quality steels or knows how to HT a steel for a knife, I severely doubt Sal would even think that let alone make that statement. In particular Buck always had a high reputation for HT, so much so that even custom knife makers used Bos to HT their knives. Buck also does CATRA testing (as does Spyderco) and have a strong commitment to quality. Even Leatherman has used CATRA testing to evaluate steel performance and the effect of sharpening/geometry on edge retention.

I have a Leatherman Crater which is a decent knife for its class, noting that it is very inexpensive. The 420HC steel is decent, not really an issue with that steel as it is a fairly decent choice for a stainless knife steel when you want to err on the side of toughness. Leatherman does leave it on the soft side, they spec it at 55-59 HRC and on the low end of that range it will be a little gummy and difficult to sharpen to a high sharpness but some people prefer very easy to grind steels which also respond well to a butchers steel.

[Morgoroth]

Yeah, I figure I might get some slight bias in the replies, but I also figure this is a good place to look for replies with the most knowledge. :D

[Holland]

not sure if the steel is any better, but the ht will certainty be better i imagine

[Leon]

Does anyone happen to know how the 440c steel (found on the newer Cat and Chicago) compares to the 8Cr13MoV on the budget knives?
In terms of edge retention, corrosion and rust resistance

[Morgoroth]

I think I read on the wiki that the 440c is what Sal thought he would get from China for the Byrd line, but it turned out to be 8Cr13MoV.