Cheap Knives?

[thorin hammer]

Well, I found myself in front of the TV this Saturday morning watching an infomercial. It was the Miracle Blade III knives. My questions are: 1. has anyone on the forum ever owned one of these knives? 2. How can they sell over 12 knives for 40 bucks and have any quality left. 3. If these knives are as good as they say they are why doesn’t everyone have a set? 4. What is the secret behind these knives?



It just bugs me. It is a too good to be offer. Please help me put this dilemma at rest.





Some laws permit, what honor dose not.

[Rex G]

My best guess is that it is much like the junk available at gun shows and flea markets. Fit and finish are important, and that costs money to produce. Good steel costs money. Proper heat treating of that steel requires knowledge and skill, which does not come free. If it's something to hang on a wall, who cares? If I may have to use the knife in an emergency, I want something built to a high standard, that will not break. Just my $0.02.... and BTW, emergency does not usually mean fighting.

[java]

Good words, Rex! Your $.02 is money well invested. I've been burned for less and have adopted the philosophy that if it sounds too good to be real, it probably is! I'm with you on the emergency too. AS an EMT and a former county deputy sherrif, I have and will continue to trust my life to Spyderco.

Thorin,

With the amount of cheap steel coming in from Pakistan, China, et all.... I too am suprised that not everyone owns a set of Miraclegromasterambo-ultraTichromoselium-eversharp steak knives with the extra kitchen/gardening attachment and act now to receive not 5 but 2 for the price of 6 wonder water weasals. Thank heavens for the power to reason and analyze. PT Barnum was right and that's how the unregulated field of infomercials manages to survive. Some stuff is great, some so-so, sometimes the Roncos and Popeels of the world get lucky and become part of Americana due to their novelty. I'm with Rex. Stay leery of the "Too good a deal to pass up!!" Grab a hot breve caramel machiato, park in the easy chair, turn the TV off, relax, and ruminate on the cost to produce a quality knife that retails for $20 - 25 (i.e. A Jester or Ladybug) and amplify that times twelve and compare. Look at some border-line inexpensive knives such as Master, hit the ubiquitous cutlery stores on the web and compare the specs on good vs lower quality cutlery sets, and bask in this new found knowlege. Then you can turn the infomercial back on and smile whilst mubling your new catch phrase - "Caveat emptor!"

Ooops! Did I rant?? Hope I didn't offend and I could be wrong, but you get what you pay for. <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>

"A hole-less knife is a soul-less knife is a whole less knife" Neo-Javanese proverb

Edited by - java on 10/19/2002 11:52:48 PM

[sam the man..]

AWES<img src="spyder.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>ME input Rex G! Cheap stuff aren't necessarily good and good stuff aren't necessarily cheap.. <img src="wink.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>

Sam

have bone implant will travel..

[sc_rebel1957]

I admit to falling for a dept store demo of some wonder knife that never needed sharpening mainly because the store announcced a free veggie knife just for watching.
To be blunt those things are JUNK not worth the time taken to watch the demo.
If you can bend it double and it still not break! it sure aint gonna saw a hammer in half like the ifomercial claims. Ron

[delicrazy]

what made me laugh at those knives was when it said made to the highest standard of german craftsmanship and on the bottom it said country of origin may vary. i was like wtf? that made no sense

[jgw65]

I acquired a set of very similar "infomercial" knives when I married. It was a package deal. They were very cheaply made and tended to rust easily. I dropped one on my tile floor and it shattered into several pieces. Even though they were guaranteed not to ever need sharpening they are becoming quite dull and the steel is so hard they don't sharpen easily.

[midget]

What is the highest standard of German craftsmanship? I wasn't aware that German knives were so reputable. Maybe I'm wrong, let me know if German knives are great. It just seems like Japan is well known for bladecraft more.


My best friend went to China and bought a set of like, 20 knives for something like 2.00. They didn't seem so bad, I mean, they are bad when you expect it to do something it can't. It's a cheap piece of metal, where else do you get cheap metal? Like **** would I mix epoxy or JBweld with a spydie, but i use one of those cheap kitchen knives for all kinds of that crap. Not saying they are great, but dime knives have their place, too.

And who would cut a hammer in half anyway? Thats just unreal. Could you cut a hammer in half with a spydie? A Busse? A strider? THIS is an example of expecting too much out of a dime.

Edited by - midget on 10/20/2002 9:29:44 AM

[midget]

But man, doesn't it kill you when they say "you're knife can only be used for a specific task..."

To me, a knife is supposed to be used more than just cutting. If all I ever needed to do in the world is cut, I'd just have scissors handy.

But YES, I do pry, screw, hammer with my knives. I just know their limits. Not because it's a spyderco, or a BM, or etc., but because it's a thin piece of metal, and thin pieces of metal can only take so much. So if I did break it due to "misuse" which is really regular use to me, I wouldn't try to get it replaced under warranty. It's my fault, for not knowing it's limits.

Think about an SUV or something. It has 4 wheel drive. It's supposed to be able to take grass, marshes, mud, etc. But if you go cruising on the beach and into the ocean, are you going to write Jeep a letter back saying "I lost my jeep, but you said it as all-terrain, so it's warranted." No, ocean driving is not within a jeep's limits.

[jgw65]

On the other end are knives like Cutco, that market to people at their homes. Cutco are actually very good knives and they will replace them for any reason. My mother bought a set in 1955 right after she got married. A few months ago I was preparing some food and noticed that her parer was almost worn down to the handle. She had been using it every day for 45 years or so. I looked up the address for Cutco on the internet and called them. In a few days they had sent a brand new knife, no questions asked. They did ask for the old one back so they could check it out. Cutco's are really quite expensive, but for a lifetime item it probably is a very good buy.

[Tightwad]

The secret behind TV hawked cheap knives is..
"Price Point"

There is a price level at which some folk's
will not go beyond. That level is dependent
on the customers knowledge of the product
or "what they are told".

If you offer a dozen knives at $40 most folks
will risk the money thinking they will get
some good service. What they ignore is that
in the end "Quality will last longer" and
SAVE MONEY. So they spend dabs of money
all the time instead of just once.

Why? Easy. Most folk's are to darn lazy
to take the time to learn about anything
that they buy. Older salesmen know this
and grow richer because of it.

So in the end you really do get what you
pay for !!! Screwed..and often it's your
own fault.

[java]

Tightwad,

Wise words of caution for all to live by! You've proven your namesake again and just as Tightwad does not mean cheapskate, higher cost does not necessarily mean better quality. You definitely need to sift through the BS and learn who has the best bang for the buck.


Midget,

"What is the highest standard of German craftsmanship? I wasn't aware that German knives were so reputable. Maybe I'm wrong, let me know if German knives are great. "

Boker, JA Henckels, Linder, Kissing Crane, and Bulldog Barnd are all fine German cutlery manufacturers that come immediately to mind. You'll find the rest of the world values cutlery from quite a few countries - Sweden, Norway, Italy, Spain, and France as well as Japan (and even the US) to name just a few. Solingen is a world renowned center for cutlery much as Seki City is. Toledo enjoys a centuries old reputation for bladecraft and Damascus steel has its roots in India. We are Japan's largest trading partner and they just seem to get more airplay - even more so from us <img src="spyder.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>lings on a slightly subjective forum like this.


Reputable and high standard blade craftmanship appears to be a widespread infestation here on Terra. We'll need to check with Ratman for reputable centers of Martian bladecraft! <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>

"A hole-less knife is a soul-less knife is a whole less knife" Neo-Javanese proverb

[Sword and Shield]

I do love watching those infomercials! <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0> I especially like how "the knife never needs sharpening". <img src="wink.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0> Last I checked, any blade made of anything but pure diamond will wear, given enough time.

Why do they take the punishment they show (cutting a sledgehammer, marble, etc.)? Simple. Since the knives are serrated, the points of the serrations take all the abuse, while the inner scallops remain sharp. Wear away the points, and it WILL dull.

Never underestimate the impossible.

[mac_heath]

Cutting of a sledge hammer or similar metal object merely requires that the blade be of higher rockwell (hardness) than the hammer (always the case).



there is no ginger

[thorin hammer]

Thanks for all the replies. You helped me put this issue to rest. I was thinking about everything you guys talked about but I just need to hear it.

Some laws permit, what honor dose not.

[travis quaas]

Here's an idea!

Have you ever noticed that usually these "particular" knives are promised with some sort of Lifetime Warranty? Here's the idea. If it costs the company a $1.00 to get the item from the manufacturer and the company is charging the customer $4.00, the company just received a $3.00 profit, right? The company knows that the product is cheap right? Well on the "warranty" certificate that comes with the knife says lifetime. What most people will see is that the company will "just" charge you the freight to replace the model for free. When it only costs the company $1.00 for the freight to "replace" the bad knife. But, it costs the customer $3.00 for that freight to "replace" the bad knife. I hope you're following me here. Doesn't it mean that the company just made another $1.00 profit to replace the "bad" knife? Just wondering. Let me know what you think!!

tq

[Knife Knut]

Maybe they are in cahoots with the shipping companies?

"any blade made of anything but pure diamond will wear, given enough time."
If you include the inevitable chipping, even a solid diamond blade would dull!


Knife Knut on a shoestring budget.

[Sword and Shield]

KKn- Yep, you have a point (pun intended) there. I forgot about chipping and concentrated on wear alone.

TQ- Now ya got it! Economics at its best, tweaking the poor consumer out of another buck without them even realizing it. I wonder how the turnip blood yield is this year. <img src="wink.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>

Never underestimate the impossible.