what is your edc-self defensive spyderco?
Sorry I did not mean to start a philosophy debate. I started carry a 2nd bigger knife while recover from injuries after hearing the story of a father who use a Caly to save his son from a mountain lion. there are no mountain lions in my area but we've had dog attacks. My 70 year old uncle was attacked by a dog in his neighborhood. I don't have children of my own, but I have an 80 year old mom and a 2 and 8 year old nephew. there are times running is not an option and yes there are people that want to do you harm for no good reason. since i'm old and short, I may look like an easy target. And if I'm cornered in a room by a gun crazy, then a knife in a gunfight is better than nothing. so carry a knife as a weapon rather than a tool is new to me even though I've carried a spyderco as a tool for 18 years. thank you for those who shared there opinions and those who shared what they carry.
Exactly. I am glad I don't live somewhere where a knife is my only option for "self defense". I'd rather shoot someone any day. I feel like martial arts are a gimmick for self defense anyway. I would rather invest similar money and time into a quality firearm, ammo and range time practicing at realistic self defense shooting distances. 0-10 feet. I do usually have my Spyderco Military on me anyway though. If for some highly unlikely reason my Glock 26 would not fire and I mentally was unable to render it quickly functional, and throwing the gun at the "bad guy's" head didn't do the job, sure I might grab my Military as a last ditch effort. :)TomAiello wrote:My EDC for self defense isn't made by Spyderco. It's made by Glock. Except on days when I'm dressed lighty or formally--then it's made by Kahr.
I've spent some time studying blade based martial arts, and my major conclusion is that knife fighting is a brutal, nasty, bloody affair that I have no desire to ever participate in for real.
If it was down to it I would rather be stabbed then slashed with a civilian.the wound that would create would be devistating.if it were down to any knife it would be a fixed blade.if not that the civilian left hand szabo right hand ronin on neck.titanium military in my right back pocket.carbon fiber military in left back pocket.also good pair of running shoes.
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enduraguy wrote:Exactly. I am glad I don't live somewhere where a knife is my only option for "self defense". I'd rather shoot someone any day. I feel like martial arts are a gimmick for self defense anyway. I would rather invest similar money and time into a quality firearm, ammo and range time practicing at realistic self defense shooting distances. 0-10 feet. I do usually have my Spyderco Military on me anyway though. If for some highly unlikely reason my Glock 26 would not fire and I mentally was unable to render it quickly functional, and throwing the gun at the "bad guy's" head didn't do the job, sure I might grab my Military as a last ditch effort. :)
What about when you fly? when you are in a courthouse? traveling in NYC, or Europe? Counting only on a tool is a foolish proposition at best. Empty hand skils that you can pull off against a resisting opponent can never be taken away and are always at your disposal. Sometimes you have to fight to access the weapon.
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Exactly. All you people that claim a gun is all you need - do you carry when you put out the trash? How about "just running to the store"? While watching tv? Does your job allow you to carry a gun? Doubt it. Fact is if you don't carry 24/7 you can't rely on just a gun. Never mind living in a location that won't allow you to legally carry. Those that say they will carry, legal or not.....just want until you have to use it and end up in prison. Self defense or not, illegal carry/use will result in prison........ That said, I carry any time I am able, but I ALWAYS have a knife on me.twinboysdad wrote:What about when you fly? when you are in a courthouse? traveling in NYC, or Europe? Counting only on a tool is a foolish proposition at best. Empty hand skils that you can pull off against a resisting opponent can never be taken away and are always at your disposal. Sometimes you have to fight to access the weapon.
Yes, yes, yes and yes.cevtv wrote:Exactly. All you people that claim a gun is all you need - do you carry when you put out the trash? How about "just running to the store"? While watching tv? Does your job allow you to carry a gun?
I'm sitting on my bed with my daughter, typing on the computer while she plays with my iPhone. It's saturday morning so we're starting slowly. I have a handgun on my person. As someone else said earlier, any time I have my pants on I'm carrying a handgun. And sometimes when I don't, actually. I pick up my handgun at the same time I pick up my wallet, keys and knife--when I put my pants on.
Pretty much anywhere it's illegal to carry a gun (courthouses, NYC, some jurisdictions) it's going to be illegal to carry a knife, too. The two primary situations you're likely to encounter are "can carry gun and knife" or "can't carry anything." For this reason, I think that unarmed combat skills are more useful than blade combat skills.
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My less than two cents' worth, since I'm not an expert in this:
1. Shooting people may be no less bloody and traumatic than using a knife. The only difference may be that you are slightly further away, so you do not see the full extent of the harm that you have inflicted on a fellow human being, although if we are talking about self-defense, even that difference might not be that great.
2. If we are talking about the psychological threshold a normal person would have in using a knife vis-a-vis a gun, I would challenge that, since this threshold is entirely subjective and situational. A mother defending her child will have no problem employing an eight inch kitchen knife to deadly and bloody effect. A man who is not prepared psychological to do whatever it takes might find it difficult to pull the trigger of his pistol.
3. Having said that, the greatest hurdle might be 'closing with the enemy'. It is not always easy for someone who is not prepared for such a confrontation, to close that distance required for one to use the knife. It might be psychologically easier to just stand off and shoot.
4. To salve the conscience for the more sensitive, one should probably choose something that does not draw blood, such as OC. It may still allow you to stand-off.
5. Even a pocket stick could produce nasty consequences on a human being. To avoid being stunned by what oneself had wrought, doing some research on likely effects might be useful to steel one on the employment of the weapons.
6. It may be advisable to start off with something more accessible to hand, such as a pen, before transiting to a knife, if you are carrying a folder. Under duress, with someone beating down on you, it is very difficult to draw a folder and deploy the blade. Don't count on it. If you only have the folded knife, draw it and use it closed to create some space before trying to deploy the blade. Drawing the knife from its clip position would be difficult enough as it is, without worrying about opening the blade. If you have the pen, you start with that, and you'll be surprised how much easier it is to draw it compared to a knife.
7. If someone is beating down on you, it may be difficult even to draw a fixed blade knife or a pistol from the usual hip position. Your attacker is probably not that stupid and the moment he sees your elbow comes up and back, he'll probably know you're drawing some weapon, and will do something about it. You may telegraph your intention less if you're drawing a pen from your shirt pocket, or a knife from the front pocket or the 1 o'clock position of the waistband of your trousers.
Having said all of the above, below are the knives that I have that I am reasonably confident of being effective in SD situations:
a. Spyderco Endura
b. Spyderco Yojimbo 2
c. Spyderco Delica Wave
d. Spyderco Matriarch 2
e. Blackhawk Crucible II
f. Blackhawk BeWharned
g. Blackhawk Hornet II
h. Blackhawk Garra II
Of all of the above, my favourite remains the Endura as it has good reach, and yet is very light and flat. Most of the time, I forget that it is even there.
1. Shooting people may be no less bloody and traumatic than using a knife. The only difference may be that you are slightly further away, so you do not see the full extent of the harm that you have inflicted on a fellow human being, although if we are talking about self-defense, even that difference might not be that great.
2. If we are talking about the psychological threshold a normal person would have in using a knife vis-a-vis a gun, I would challenge that, since this threshold is entirely subjective and situational. A mother defending her child will have no problem employing an eight inch kitchen knife to deadly and bloody effect. A man who is not prepared psychological to do whatever it takes might find it difficult to pull the trigger of his pistol.
3. Having said that, the greatest hurdle might be 'closing with the enemy'. It is not always easy for someone who is not prepared for such a confrontation, to close that distance required for one to use the knife. It might be psychologically easier to just stand off and shoot.
4. To salve the conscience for the more sensitive, one should probably choose something that does not draw blood, such as OC. It may still allow you to stand-off.
5. Even a pocket stick could produce nasty consequences on a human being. To avoid being stunned by what oneself had wrought, doing some research on likely effects might be useful to steel one on the employment of the weapons.
6. It may be advisable to start off with something more accessible to hand, such as a pen, before transiting to a knife, if you are carrying a folder. Under duress, with someone beating down on you, it is very difficult to draw a folder and deploy the blade. Don't count on it. If you only have the folded knife, draw it and use it closed to create some space before trying to deploy the blade. Drawing the knife from its clip position would be difficult enough as it is, without worrying about opening the blade. If you have the pen, you start with that, and you'll be surprised how much easier it is to draw it compared to a knife.
7. If someone is beating down on you, it may be difficult even to draw a fixed blade knife or a pistol from the usual hip position. Your attacker is probably not that stupid and the moment he sees your elbow comes up and back, he'll probably know you're drawing some weapon, and will do something about it. You may telegraph your intention less if you're drawing a pen from your shirt pocket, or a knife from the front pocket or the 1 o'clock position of the waistband of your trousers.
Having said all of the above, below are the knives that I have that I am reasonably confident of being effective in SD situations:
a. Spyderco Endura
b. Spyderco Yojimbo 2
c. Spyderco Delica Wave
d. Spyderco Matriarch 2
e. Blackhawk Crucible II
f. Blackhawk BeWharned
g. Blackhawk Hornet II
h. Blackhawk Garra II
Of all of the above, my favourite remains the Endura as it has good reach, and yet is very light and flat. Most of the time, I forget that it is even there.
> 1. Shooting people may be no less bloody and traumatic than using a knife. The only difference may be that you are slightly further away, so you do not see the full extent of the harm that you have inflicted on a fellow human being
I don't really care about the trauma I inflict on an attacker. I'm more worried about the trauma inflicted on me.
I don't really care about the trauma I inflict on an attacker. I'm more worried about the trauma inflicted on me.
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I have lived in inner cities for most of my life, and have never felt the need to own a gun, and only use my knives for utility. Situational awareness and knowing how to avoid trouble have gotten me much further.
If you do not look like you have something someone would want, and you mind your own business, you have very little to worry about. IMHO, if you make it obvious you are carrying a nice pistol, that is the sort of item a criminal might want to steal.
If you do not look like you have something someone would want, and you mind your own business, you have very little to worry about. IMHO, if you make it obvious you are carrying a nice pistol, that is the sort of item a criminal might want to steal.
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- Yoko von der Rasierklinge
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My answer is yes; I do carry when taking out trash, just running to a convenience store, and while at home. Even if my job didn't allow me to carry any weapons, I would still conceal anyway. If anyone found out at work you were carrying, then you weren't carrying concealed.cevtv wrote:Exactly. All you people that claim a gun is all you need - do you carry when you put out the trash? How about "just running to the store"? While watching tv? Does your job allow you to carry a gun? Doubt it. Fact is if you don't carry 24/7 you can't rely on just a gun.
If you read the comments section on this news story from TheTruthAboutGuns, you will see plenty of Americans carry in spite of work regulations prohibiting them to do so.
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2013/0 ... an/235669/
Loyd says:
June 15, 2013 at 13:49
I deliver pizzas for a major national chain. Corporate policy is no weapons ever, and in the event of a robbery to offer no resistance. I have a different personal policy.
NYC2AZ says:
June 15, 2013 at 14:37
I used to work for Pizza Hut as a driver. They also had a strict “no weapons” policy, but they never had any training on what to do if you were robbed. There were some weekend nights I had over $100 – $150 in cash (max). I know for some, a hundred bucks was worth the risk, that’s why I carried anyway.
swampsniper says:
June 15, 2013 at 18:41
I worked in a convenience store for almost 7 years. Company policy didn’t even allow you to carry a pocket knife. I carried my S&W anyway, the local cops on the beat knew it, and so did the winos and gangbangers. If I had been killed on the job the company might have sent flowers. Maybe.
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And like I said, once you use it, you're going to prison. Granted, that may be better than getting killed.....
Yoko von der Rasierklinge wrote:My answer is yes; I do carry when taking out trash, just running to a convenience store, and while at home. Even if my job didn't allow me to carry any weapons, I would still conceal anyway. If anyone found out at work you were carrying, then you weren't carrying concealed.
If you read the comments section on this news story from TheTruthAboutGuns, you will see plenty of Americans carry in spite of work regulations prohibiting them to do so.
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2013/0 ... an/235669/
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The gun argument is all well and good. I carry a gun, often two, but when the only tool you have is a hammer all your problems start to look like nails. I also typically carry a less then lethal option, like OC. I really like the ASP Palm Defender and Key Defender. Tiny little aluminum tubes that go on your keys or in your pocket. They work well and you can always have one on hand (if permitted in your municipality.)
I carry a P'Kal or a waved Endura on my weak side to counter a gun grab. That's all that knife is used for. When your weapon hand is completely occupied keeping the gun in the holster you need options. (And don't tell me about your level 17 retention holster. Been there, done that, took the class, have the broken holsters to prove it.)
Do I want to cut someone? **** no. I think it's one of the most unpleasant bits of combat there is, but when it comes down to it it's eat or be eaten.
I carry a P'Kal or a waved Endura on my weak side to counter a gun grab. That's all that knife is used for. When your weapon hand is completely occupied keeping the gun in the holster you need options. (And don't tell me about your level 17 retention holster. Been there, done that, took the class, have the broken holsters to prove it.)
Do I want to cut someone? **** no. I think it's one of the most unpleasant bits of combat there is, but when it comes down to it it's eat or be eaten.
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If I go someplace that I can't carry a gun, I usually carry my P'kal. My summer carry knife is usually an Ayoob Sprint if I am wearing cargo shorts, whether I have a gun on me or not. In the winter, my carry knives vary a bit more as I am wearing jeans. I cannot legally carry a fixed blade. I also cannot carry a weapon at work, but I do usually have a ZDP Ladybug on hand. Hey, depending on the circumstances, it is better than nothing.
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Which inner cities have you lived in and for how long? Chicago, Detroit, Houston?Fresh Eddie Fresh wrote:I have lived in inner cities for most of my life, and have never felt the need to own a gun, and only use my knives for utility. Situational awareness and knowing how to avoid trouble have gotten me much further.
If you do not look like you have something someone would want, and you mind your own business, you have very little to worry about. IMHO, if you make it obvious you are carrying a nice pistol, that is the sort of item a criminal might want to steal.
I'd like to add that some of us have jobs that takes us to inner cities that unfortunately requires a professionl dress code that, as you say, may make me an high-interest target.
In my opinion, most criminals target their victims based on the perception that they are unarmed and easy to subdue. Is a fancy firearm worth the risk? Regardless of how "nice" my pistol is, makes me wonder how obvious it is to any thug I am carrying to begin with if my pistol is truly concealed.
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Two things. More than one attacker is called 'disparity of force'. It weighs heavily in your favor in using lethal self-defense. Obviously, 3 kindergartners against an athletic adult male would not be a good example, LOL. However, if you are a female (Yoko?), even ONE male larger, or more athletic than you, would even be construed as DoF. An able-bodied attacker, against a disabled victim, same thing. Besides, I don't know of ANY state where your use of a KNIFE would NOT BE considered as lethal-force, same as a gun. Might as well keep your distance, and use the gun.Yoko von der Rasierklinge wrote:, I have the fixed blade as an option for self defense against unarmed assaults (usually by thugs in groups where power is felt in numbers). The firearm comes into play if they too are armed with a knife or gun and intent on harming me or those I love and care about.
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Less-lethal option/s should be mandatory for anyone that can carry a gun. The hammer-nail analogy is one thing. HOwever, not every attack is lethal, nor can be responded to w/lethal force. Despite my size and skills, I really don't care to go 'hands-on' with anyone if I can help it. You can get seriously hurt in the process, be confused for the attacker by someone who didn't see YOU being accosted, and bad people are often petri dishes for disease/s. So, if I can get the miscreant to bugger-off w/OC, or ....more urgently, my TASER..so be it. Also, if you DO have to escalate, or go straight for the jugular, the fact you WERE PREPARED with lesser force tool/s bodes well in your favor in defending your actions.Rwb1500 wrote:The gun argument is all well and good. I carry a gun, often two, but when the only tool you have is a hammer all your problems start to look like nails. I also typically carry a less then lethal option, like OC. I really like the ASP Palm Defender and Key Defender. Tiny little aluminum tubes that go on your keys or in your pocket. They work well and you can always have one on hand (if permitted in your municipality.)
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I relied on the ASP for years as a primary spray, until three agressive dogs closed in on me and my pooch. The spray comes out in a cone, ever-widening, and in a mild breeze, won't even touch the assailant past 6-8'. Luckily, it made the Alpha dog sneeze, and cough, and he and the crew backed-off. Now, I carry a full-on, stream-dispersant from Saber, normally in my off-hand pocket. The ASP still makes a decent back-up, and a great key flail in a fist-fight.
Stretch VG10 FRN, Caly Jr. VG10 FRN.