Anyone else not concerned much about blade steel?

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.
User avatar
The Mastiff
Member
Posts: 5313
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 2:53 am
Location: raleigh nc

Postby The Mastiff » Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:55 am

The different steel at the time ( G-2/Gin 1) along with the lightness and easy opening blade were what convinced me to get my first spyderco. Back then everything was 440C, 440A, or "Surgical steel". This was 91-92 and I wasn't satisfied with stainless steels then and was looking for better.

All these years later and the availability of different, and extremely high performance knife steel combinations keep me here in a much different, more mature market with many advanced production knives from several different manufacturers easily available. Spyderco still does it best, and remains at the front of the group.

So, yes. Previously unavailable steels and the expectation of high performing blades will keep me here for the foreseeable future.

Also, if you have been here long enough you just might get the impression that one model was made just for you. :) I know I do. :D

Sooner or later you will get everything you really want in a model. Just be patient.

Joe
"A Mastiff is to a dog what a Lion is to a housecat. He stands alone and all others sink before him. His courage does not exceed temper and generosity, and in attachment he equals the kindest of his race" Cynographia Britannic 1800


"Unless you're the lead dog the view is pretty much gonna stay the same!"

User avatar
kbuzbee
Member
Posts: 4762
Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2006 8:37 am
Location: Mentor, OH

Postby kbuzbee » Mon Feb 25, 2013 10:30 am

Blerv wrote: Thx for the peer pressure Ken!
A pleasure, as always, brother!

Ken
玉鋼

nozh2002
Member
Posts: 315
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2004 7:56 pm

Postby nozh2002 » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:25 am

The Deacon wrote:Yes, and no. I have no interest in performance testing steels and don't have any need for a blade that will skin a dozen elephants without re-sharpening. I'll take a steel like VG-10, S30V, or even AUS-6 over steels that may hold an edge better, but are less stainless or non-stainless. If an attractive enough pattern was offered, I'd take stainless damascus over any monochromatic grey stainless even if the knife cost twice as much and didn't hold an edge quite as well as AUS-6.
In real World there are many steels which hold edge much better being as good in corrosion resistance as AUS6.

Problem here is price. I do care not to pay over real value. If CPM S30V will coast as AUS6 - then it would be OK.
I had nothing against properly positioned and priced product. But when I see "Golden Standard" and other thing
like this about cheap average performing steel priced as premium - it does bother me. Because it is not only case
of overpaying, but this actually damage effort to bring real good steels to the market.

Why someone bother to search for good steel and good heat treatment when it is much easy to publish press release
with "Golden Standard", "as good as CPM S60V in edge holding and as good as A2 in toughness" and create hype...

It is clear that because of this kind of things good steel manufacturers have no proper representation on the market,
while one who keep failing to produce anything good is dominating. Every steel from Carpenter (except this strange
reincarnation of GIN-1 - BD-1?) are top performers, and this is known for years, but knife industry keep wasting effort
on whatever is coming out of Crucible.
Set to be ignored by everybody.

Effectevely I am banned, but this is done the way nobody noticed, which means
Spyderco knows pretty well, that this ban is wrong and tries to hide that.

Made in USSR

http://nozh2002.blogspot.com/2011/07/ed ... sting.html

User avatar
Evil D
Member
Posts: 21644
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 9:48 pm
Location: Northern KY

Postby Evil D » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:39 am

I'm 100% concerned with what steel a knife has, to a certain minimum requirement. I won't bother with anything less than VG10 for EDC knives. I recently bought a knife in 440HC which is really rare for me but the knife was too cool to pass on otherwise. The steel is the knife..you can have the best design and ergonomics possible but if it won't hold an edge then it's useless as a knife for me.
SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
~David

User avatar
kbuzbee
Member
Posts: 4762
Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2006 8:37 am
Location: Mentor, OH

Postby kbuzbee » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:59 am

Evil D wrote:I recently bought a knife in 440HC
Which knife, David? How's the 440HC working out?

Ken
玉鋼

User avatar
bh49
Member
Posts: 11464
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2006 1:37 pm
Location: former Constitution state

Postby bh49 » Mon Feb 25, 2013 12:16 pm

kbuzbee wrote:Which knife, David? How's the 440HC working out?

Ken
I never heard about 440HC. 440A, 440B, 440C and 420 HC. I believe. Buck is using the last one a lot. Many people are are happy due to Paul Boss H/T
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf"

My top choices Natives5, Calys, C83 Persian

User avatar
mikerestivo
Member
Posts: 1090
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2009 11:19 am
Location: Indiana

Postby mikerestivo » Mon Feb 25, 2013 12:32 pm

I'd be lying if I said that the steel didn't matter. I'd also be lying if I said that S30V and VG-10 are more than adequate for my needs. I've put plenty of hard use on my original Manix and the S30V is great.

A great story is about the Superleaf that I gave to my brother, who carries it as his hunting knife: he just gave it back to me, guts and bone still inside, to clean up and resharpen for him. I personally don't think it needs resharpened because it still has a great working edge. He says that he has cleaned and gutted 4 deer, 3 wild boar, 3 coyotes, and an odd assortment of birds (some of which I have never heard of). Remind you that this is "plain Jane" VG-10 that we are talking about here. I can't testify to all of the animals that he has cleaned but I can tell by the odd pieces of whatever that are stuck inside that it was several. He thought he had ruined it at least once because of all of the bone it had been up against. Zero defects thus far.

It's more about fun factor with me and blade steels. I like seeing how the metals stack up against each other in terms of wear after use, as well as sharpening. Someone mentioned the Gray Para2 sprint (CTS-20CP) earlier - I've also been impressed with the edge-holding ability - but likewise, not so much with how slow it is to touch up with re-sharpening.

I won't buy a knife just for the blade steel. It has to be a model that has other factors (i.e. one that it a tried and true model that I know I will like, or one that I'm taking a chance on based upon forum chatter and kudos).

So the bottom line is that I care about super steels, but it's not a life-or-death issue with me. Just fun.

User avatar
xceptnl
Member
Posts: 8384
Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2011 7:48 pm
Location: Tobacco Country, Virginia
Contact:

Postby xceptnl » Mon Feb 25, 2013 1:14 pm

waco kid wrote:I figure any steel produced by Spyderco is going to do anything I ask of a knife pretty well. The only knife I picked because of the steel used was my Ladybug Salt SE.
Sorry waco, I consider myself and amateur steel snob. I do like to try both the lower end and higher end steels, but a knife with an unknown steel gets scrutinized heavily before I trust it to daily carry.
Image
sal wrote: .... even today, we design a knife from the edge out!
*Landon*

User avatar
Holland
Member
Posts: 6954
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 10:37 pm
Location: Alberta

Postby Holland » Mon Feb 25, 2013 1:32 pm

Joshua J. wrote:The best analogy I can think of at the moment (I'm a bit tired) is that steel is kind of like coffee. If you're a connoisseur, there are an infinite number of varieties and mixes that you can use to experience that little bit of metallurgical bliss, and if you just need something to get the job done, pretty much anything will do as long as it's not watered down.

Oh, and then "some people like a coarse grind, some like it fine". That could be taken so many different ways.
Well said!
-Spencer

zhyla
Member
Posts: 1636
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 2:12 pm

Postby zhyla » Mon Feb 25, 2013 1:35 pm

Good steel is so common now, I don't think there's a single Spyderco that has steel I'd scoff at aside from possibly the Chinese 8cr13 stuff (no opinion formed yet). If every model were VG10 I'd be just as happy as I am now. Though if real carbon steels were an option I'd probably buy those up like candy until I realized rusty pocketknives suck :) .
All God's critters have knives.

User avatar
kbuzbee
Member
Posts: 4762
Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2006 8:37 am
Location: Mentor, OH

Postby kbuzbee » Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:14 pm

zhyla wrote:Though if real carbon steels were an option I'd probably buy those up like candy until I realized rusty pocketknives suck :) .
Simply knife hygiene wins the day, my friend. Carbon steels did perfectly fine before people corrupted it with chromium. ;)

Ken
玉鋼

User avatar
Blerv
Member
Posts: 11695
Joined: Mon May 04, 2009 11:24 am

Postby Blerv » Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:27 pm

kbuzbee wrote:Simply knife hygiene wins the day, my friend. Carbon steels did perfectly fine before people corrupted it with chromium. ;)

Ken
Preach it :)
:spyder: Blake :spyder:

User avatar
jon1all
Member
Posts: 207
Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:16 am
Location: Arizona

Postby jon1all » Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:32 pm

I am hardly a steel snob. I have plenty of 8Cr13MoV bladed knives that's function very well. But, if I am going to pay good money ($100+ to me) for a knife then I want the a blade steel commensurate with the price tag. That said, frankly I am very, very well pleased with the performance I get out of S30V. It cuts everything I ask it to and holds an edge faaaar longer than my old AUS6 bladed Kershaw Vapor I EDC'd for years. Yep, I am a real fan of S30V...its introduction seemed to be a pivotal moment in the folding knife industry. And it's still a **** fine steel in my book, even if there are "better" steels now.
Apparently, arachnophobia is not a condition from which I suffer.... :spyder:
------
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them." (oops!)
--Thomas Jefferson
PLEASE VISIT MY BLOG >>>1all's Pub<<<

User avatar
kbuzbee
Member
Posts: 4762
Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2006 8:37 am
Location: Mentor, OH

Postby kbuzbee » Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:54 pm

Blerv wrote:Preach it :)
"The truth reveals to those who but seek it"

Muad'dib - uncredited
玉鋼

nozh2002
Member
Posts: 315
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2004 7:56 pm

Postby nozh2002 » Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:58 pm

mikerestivo wrote:... - but likewise, not so much with how slow it is to touch up with re-sharpening.
Can you tell how are you re-sharpening? I never really experience any difference in sharpness and in time of sharpening with quite a variety of steels I have in my collection.
On my experience cheap steel sometimes take much more time to get rid of ugly burr, then premium steels. But in general it take same time to sharpen CTS204P and AUS6
to be able to whittle hair.
Set to be ignored by everybody.

Effectevely I am banned, but this is done the way nobody noticed, which means
Spyderco knows pretty well, that this ban is wrong and tries to hide that.

Made in USSR

http://nozh2002.blogspot.com/2011/07/ed ... sting.html

gaj999
Member
Posts: 828
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 9:01 pm

Postby gaj999 » Mon Feb 25, 2013 3:17 pm

I'm far less concerned with the steel than I am with the heat treatment. And I won't buy a knife unless the geometry and the ergos work for me. So steel looks to be about fourth on my list. Somewhat important, but not a deal breaker. Well, 420J2 might be a deal breaker. ;)

Gordon

User avatar
jabba359
Member
Posts: 4865
Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2006 11:07 pm
Location: North Hollywood, CA U.S.A. Earth
Contact:

Postby jabba359 » Mon Feb 25, 2013 3:33 pm

The Deacon wrote:Yes, and no. I have no interest in performance testing steels and don't have any need for a blade that will skin a dozen elephants without re-sharpening. I'll take a steel like VG-10, S30V, or even AUS-6 over steels that may hold an edge better, but are less stainless or non-stainless. If an attractive enough pattern was offered, I'd take stainless damascus over any monochromatic grey stainless even if the knife cost twice as much and didn't hold an edge quite as well as AUS-6.
I, on the other hand, am always getting tired of having to resharpen after 5 or 6 elephants. ;)

For me, the steel is secondary to the model. Every single steel that Spyderco offers is sufficient for my needs and would easily get me through a day, week, and at times even a month of cutting tasks. So for me, if it's a model I want, then I will pick it up. I will admit, however, that if a model is offered in various steel options, I tend to go for the best one available. I suppose that I've always been of the mindset that I'd rather pay more for something (within reason) that exceeds my needs than buy a lesser version that I may end up regretting or that may underperform. While I doubt I'd regret any Spyderco steel or that they would underperform, I still like to get the supersteels that far exceed my needs, as the price increase is negligible. I don't need to drive 200 MPH, but I'd still like to get a Ferrari. Too bad the price increase over a Toyota is stratospheric! :( :D
-Kyle

:spyder:
Latest arrivals: DLC M4 Shaman, Opus, Q Ball

http://www.spydiewiki.com

User avatar
dbcad
Member
Posts: 3111
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:59 pm
Location: ga, usa

Postby dbcad » Mon Feb 25, 2013 3:35 pm

Enjoying the different blade steels available is why I stick with Spyderco :) Although my use is generally not very demanding it is very nice to use an edge that doesn't require a bunch of touching up. I'll make adjustments to the edge angle after I my initial reprofile fails at the edge.

Quite enjoyable also to plumb the limits of blade steels at different edge angles, bevels, etc. For me the priorities aren't how a knife looks, rather how it feels in hand and works ;) How it works over time is directly proportional to the type of steel in the blade.
Charlie

" Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not one bit simpler."

[CENTER]"Integrity is being good even if no one is watching"[/CENTER]

DeathBySnooSnoo
Member
Posts: 3660
Joined: Tue Jan 18, 2011 7:30 pm
Location: Toronto Canada

Postby DeathBySnooSnoo » Mon Feb 25, 2013 4:01 pm

I pay attention to steel. But I'm not too picky about it. I have my favorites, but at the same time I am plenty happy with 440C for certain uses. I have a bunch of 8Cr13MoV and Aus8 that I use. However, if a knife is over $100 and has a lower end steel, I am less likely to buy it purely on a value for money basis.
On the hunt for...

User avatar
Evil D
Member
Posts: 21644
Joined: Sat Jun 26, 2010 9:48 pm
Location: Northern KY

Postby Evil D » Mon Feb 25, 2013 4:17 pm

kbuzbee wrote:Which knife, David? How's the 440HC working out?

Ken
bh49 wrote:I never heard about 440HC. 440A, 440B, 440C and 420 HC. I believe. Buck is using the last one a lot. Many people are are happy due to Paul Boss H/T
You are correct...brain fart. It is 420HC.

As for opinions, I don't really have one except that it's definitely a tough steel that seems to take abuse quite well (at least when ground the way this blade is ground). It sharpens up quite easily and takes a very keen edge, but of course doesn't hold it very long as compared to some of the Spydie steels we've been spoiled with.
SHARPEN IT LIKE YOU LOVE IT, USE IT LIKE YOU HATE IT
~David


Return to “Spyderco General Discussion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Ankerson, Beach Cricket, Google [Bot], SLOSpyder and 39 guests