Blade-play in Para 2s

alexiusmeinong · #1

How many of you have had blade-play issues with your Para 2s? Is the bushing pivot system in that knife uniquely susceptible to blade-play? If so, would using a more traditional pivot system like that of the Military make the knife less susceptible?

golddot370 · #2

I've been edc'ing my para 2 for maybe 1 1/2 years and its the only knife I've never had any type of blade play or had to adjust the pivot. I did have a scale screw fall out but one call to warrenty and repair and I had a new one with in a week.

Zenith · #3

Blade play in the Para2 is not an issue IMO. Due to the design of the compression lock it won't affect the safety.

Through the years blade play has become defined as 'any movement when pulling and pushing the blade' I mean some people will tug and pull on a blade and say there is bladeplay. IMO that is not bladeplay, but actually caused by the user flexing the parts of a knife. I have seen this done to even the 'strongest' lock on the market by another maker.

If you take the knife, shake it and the blade is moving then yes, there is significant bladeplay and can be a safety issue. But tugging and pulling with all your strength and expecting no movement in a folder is pushing it IMO.

MachSchnell · #4

Zenith wrote:Blade play in the Para2 is not an issue IMO. Due to the design of the compression lock it won't affect the safety.

Through the years blade play has become defined as 'any movement when pulling and pushing the blade' I mean some people will tug and pull on a blade and say there is bladeplay. IMO that is not bladeplay, but actually caused by the user flexing the parts of a knife. I have seen this done to even the 'strongest' lock on the market by another maker.

If you take the knife, shake it and the blade is moving then yes, there is significant bladeplay and can be a safety issue. But tugging and pulling with all your strength and expecting no movement in a folder is pushing it IMO.

Nailed it! But I've sold a few used knives that have had mentioned "play" if enough torque is forced upon the blade; these were only really on lock-backs and it was duly noted as it is one of the common inherent qualities of folding (lock back) knives. I noted it to protect my self as a seller, but I feel it deters many buyers from biting (or they shoot extremely low ball offers.) Any non-fixed blade knife will have "blade play," but it is in the manner of which that play is felt. Some may just flex (hard to tell) and some might move and have a "click-click" that can be felt/heard. Expecting a fixed blade performance from a locking folding is a little too overly obsessively optimistic. Sure, out of the box knives can retain high enough tolerances to make play undetectable without the aid of measuring devices, but after use those tolerances loosen to the point where play can be easily detected unaided; and just 'cause movement can be felt does not mean that the lock is going to fail, or it's a weak design.

chuck_roxas45 · #5

alexiusmeinong wrote:How many of you have had blade-play issues with your Para 2s? Is the bushing pivot system in that knife uniquely susceptible to blade-play? If so, would using a more traditional pivot system like that of the Military make the knife less susceptible?

Been saying that for a while...

Zenith wrote:Blade play in the Para2 is not an issue IMO. Due to the design of the compression lock it won't affect the safety.

Through the years blade play has become defined as 'any movement when pulling and pushing the blade' I mean some people will tug and pull on a blade and say there is bladeplay. IMO that is not bladeplay, but actually caused by the user flexing the parts of a knife. I have seen this done to even the 'strongest' lock on the market by another maker.

If you take the knife, shake it and the blade is moving then yes, there is significant bladeplay and can be a safety issue. But tugging and pulling with all your strength and expecting no movement in a folder is pushing it IMO.

I don't think safety is the issue...We 'uns just don't like bladeplay...

jtoler_9 · #6

I agree to an extent that blade play is subjective. But there have been times where I have gone back to the pivot screw on several para 2 to tighten up a bit of side to side wiggle. It has never been enough to bother me or prompt a trip to Spyderco for repair yet. But I can easily see how some could interpret that as "Para 2s have blade play". Perception is reality.

Zenith · #7

chuck_roxas45 wrote:Been saying that for a while...

I don't think safety is the issue...We 'uns just don't like bladeplay...

This is where I believe personal preference comes in. I agree no one likes it, but I can live with it as long as it is not unsafe for me and my uses. I test and inspect my locks frequantl.

And, though the traditional pivot design can minimise the side to side, how many will complain about smoothness?

Many want an ultra smooth action out the box. They are not willing to work through that bit of grittyness and let the knife smooth out with use. The P2 I have as it is now after almost a year of EDC is so smooth it borders on what I consider to be sloppy and others will feel it is ultra smooth.

It is difficult as a manufacturer to satisfy everyone and everyones perceptions about what is or is not. Regardless, the P2 is a fine knife.

mikerestivo · #8

I agree with what Chuck said about folks just not liking blade play. I don't even look for it on mine, while I have a buddy that checks for it on every unfamiliar knife he is handed. I only notice blade play if it's really pronounced, like on some of the ultra-budget knives that sell for $5 at the flea market.

I don't check any of my Spyderco's for play, and I'm not sure if any of them have it. I don't notice any during my normal use. That being said, if any of mine do have play, it must be really slight.

Slash · #9

alexiusmeinong wrote:How many of you have had blade-play issues with your Para 2s? Is the bushing pivot system in that knife uniquely susceptible to blade-play? If so, would using a more traditional pivot system like that of the Military make the knife less susceptible?

None of my crk knives with pivot bushings have any play. So, not to sure you can say that's the specific reason for the para 2 to occur play.

I would say it's just the hardware that's used.

Evil D · #10

I blamed the bushing until i bought my Yojimbo 2. It has no play at all after a solid month of EDC, which is about the point my other Para 2's developed some side to side play. It could just be a difference between models though. I don't know if changing the pivot style is the answer, my old Paramilitary had two settings...lose with play or too tight to let the blade drop by gravity...there was no middle ground. At least with the bushing i can tune it out to where there's just a hint of side to side play and the blade still swings freely.

oneunder · #11

Zenith wrote:Blade play in the Para2 is not an issue IMO. Due to the design of the compression lock it won't affect the safety.

Through the years blade play has become defined as 'any movement when pulling and pushing the blade' I mean some people will tug and pull on a blade and say there is bladeplay. IMO that is not bladeplay, but actually caused by the user flexing the parts of a knife. I have seen this done to even the 'strongest' lock on the market by another maker.

If you take the knife, shake it and the blade is moving then yes, there is significant bladeplay and can be a safety issue. But tugging and pulling with all your strength and expecting no movement in a folder is pushing it IMO.

And yet the blade of my PM2 shows a very slight lateral move that my Sage or Delicas don't. I got used to it and it doesn't bug me anymore because the lock feels stronger than any other system I know and this knife is such a great workhorse. I now look at it as the PM2 having an "industrial" tough feeling, the Sage being more like a precision tool. I guess it matches well with their respective intended use. Still, and it's rather mere curiosity than a request for improvement, I am wondering if larger diameter bushings wouldn't remove the "problem" without impairing the smoothness.

phillipsted · #12

Several of my Paras have a very small amount of "wiggle" when the blade is in the process of opening. Once the blade locks open, they have little or no motion. My main carry Para2 is the 20CP model with custom scales - and I've tuned it for a very smooth opening and closing. This one does have a little play, but it doesn't make the knife feel less than sturdy and I don't even notice it during day-to-day usage.

TedP

IG-88 · #13

I've been carring mine 1,5 year and it developped some side to side bladeplay but was fixed by slightly adjusting the pivot. For now all is fine.

michaelm466 · #14

I have 5 Sprints and none of them have blade play

Evil D · #15

michaelm466 wrote:I have 5 Sprints and none of them have blade play

My 20CP didn't have any out of the box but within a month of use it developed more than any compression lock knife i own, and the pivot screws are bottomed out.

J32A2 · #16

Rock solid after 2 years!

jossta · #17

chuck_roxas45 wrote:I don't think safety is the issue...We 'uns just don't like bladeplay...

Yeap. I've had a bunch of Paras, but this is why I don't have them anymore. I have 2 Yojimbo 2s and they seem fine, but I just got them so I'll have to see how they hold up to some use.

KardinalSyn · #18

Welcome to the forum Alex. I kinda like the way that you got straight to the question on the Para 2. I only have two of em. No issues whatsoever. They are just excellent knives.

angusW · #19

I don't think we really have a clear definition of what blade play is. It is going to be different for different people. I have 6 Para 2's and the only one I would say has blade play is the first one I got which is the regular satin blade, black G-10 model. It's the only one that is stiff to open and when I loosen the pivot to make opening and closing easier then there is what I would consider blade play. I have the Blue and Orange one in front of me and if I hold either one by the handle only and shake it there is no blade play. If I firmly hold the handle of either one and push the blade side to side in a forceful way then there is a slight movement but I would not consider it blade play. I also have my left hand Military in front of me and it exhibits the same characteristics as the above Para 2's and again I would say there is no blade play. I'm sure someone else could inspect the same three knives and come to the conclusion that there is, at least in their eyes, blade play.

Also, welcome to the forum alexiusmeinong.