Military vs. ZT 0560 ...
Military vs. ZT 0560 ...
Yesterday I got my new ZT 0560 and I wanted to share my thoughs on it vs. my EDC, the Military CF M390.
As you can see, they are both rather "large" knives - that grid is 1/2" per square, by the way, and sorry it is a little dirty, that is my machining workbench:
When closed the Milie is a tad larger overall:
When opened the different is a little bit more noticeable, length-wise, as the Milie has a longer blade:
Not only the ZT is significantly heavier, but it is also thicker pretty much everywhere:
The blade shape/grind tells you all you need to know as to the intent/usage for each knife - the Milie "is" the slicer out of the two - can't argue with the physics here:
The ergonomics on the ZT are fairly good, but this particular area bothers me a little bit. Note how the G10 scale is not cut all of the way to match the liner here - it makes operating the frame lock much harder than it needs to be. Here the Milie shows a huge opening which makes unlocking easier, even with gloves - as a LEFTY, this makes the ZT harder to use compared to the right-hand version of the Milie:
The jimping is very nice in the ZT. The edges are a tiny bit sharp, so I would gently file those down before using it, but along with the 3D shape of the scales, the ZT has outstanding "gripiness" (I know, a made-up word) in the hand - feels very secure in the hand:
So my take:
- Opening: flipper vs. big hole in the blade: Once you put your hand/finger aligned with the flipper "lever", the ZT opens "like magic" - very fast. But the big hole in the Milie is fast as well. Picking one method over the other is more of a personal preference, but not enough for me to pick one over the other. To me it is like a draw - they both open fast enough for me, but in terms of "coolness" the ZT has the "wow" factor (which might be intimidating to non-knife people).
- The Milie is designed to cut first. It is clearly "the" slicer out of the two. The Milie is also significantly lighter in the pocket, and slightly thinner - easier to EDC in plain clothes. But compared to the ZT, it does not look it could/would take as much abuse or "hard use" as the ZT.
- The ZT would be my choice as a firefighter, or any other line of work/usage where the knife might see some abuse - it seems/feels like a tank, and it does weight more as a result of its construction. But it is not as specialized in cutting as the Milie due to is thicker blade/grind - that is an important sacrifice the ZT makes in order to be a "stronger" knife. I would be more "afraid" of damaging/breaking the Milie under hard use - not so with the ZT. In your hand, the ZT oozes confidence - it feels like you can't hurt it (not easily at least). The gripiness of the ZT is definitely better to me than the Milie with the CF scales. I am not saying that the Milie is slippery, but that those 3D textured scales on the ZT "do" work extremely well.
- Ideally, I would love to EDC both - I would then be prepared for anything from normal cutting chores (Milie) to hard use/battling Zombies (ZT).
Which one I plan to carry as EDC most often (and not because this is a Spyderco forum): the Milie. Why? Because for "my" typical needs/uses, I need more of a cutter/slicer than an "indestructible" knife. If I knew before hand that I might need a stronger/heavier duty folder, I would leave home the Milie and take the ZT.
Will
As you can see, they are both rather "large" knives - that grid is 1/2" per square, by the way, and sorry it is a little dirty, that is my machining workbench:
When closed the Milie is a tad larger overall:
When opened the different is a little bit more noticeable, length-wise, as the Milie has a longer blade:
Not only the ZT is significantly heavier, but it is also thicker pretty much everywhere:
The blade shape/grind tells you all you need to know as to the intent/usage for each knife - the Milie "is" the slicer out of the two - can't argue with the physics here:
The ergonomics on the ZT are fairly good, but this particular area bothers me a little bit. Note how the G10 scale is not cut all of the way to match the liner here - it makes operating the frame lock much harder than it needs to be. Here the Milie shows a huge opening which makes unlocking easier, even with gloves - as a LEFTY, this makes the ZT harder to use compared to the right-hand version of the Milie:
The jimping is very nice in the ZT. The edges are a tiny bit sharp, so I would gently file those down before using it, but along with the 3D shape of the scales, the ZT has outstanding "gripiness" (I know, a made-up word) in the hand - feels very secure in the hand:
So my take:
- Opening: flipper vs. big hole in the blade: Once you put your hand/finger aligned with the flipper "lever", the ZT opens "like magic" - very fast. But the big hole in the Milie is fast as well. Picking one method over the other is more of a personal preference, but not enough for me to pick one over the other. To me it is like a draw - they both open fast enough for me, but in terms of "coolness" the ZT has the "wow" factor (which might be intimidating to non-knife people).
- The Milie is designed to cut first. It is clearly "the" slicer out of the two. The Milie is also significantly lighter in the pocket, and slightly thinner - easier to EDC in plain clothes. But compared to the ZT, it does not look it could/would take as much abuse or "hard use" as the ZT.
- The ZT would be my choice as a firefighter, or any other line of work/usage where the knife might see some abuse - it seems/feels like a tank, and it does weight more as a result of its construction. But it is not as specialized in cutting as the Milie due to is thicker blade/grind - that is an important sacrifice the ZT makes in order to be a "stronger" knife. I would be more "afraid" of damaging/breaking the Milie under hard use - not so with the ZT. In your hand, the ZT oozes confidence - it feels like you can't hurt it (not easily at least). The gripiness of the ZT is definitely better to me than the Milie with the CF scales. I am not saying that the Milie is slippery, but that those 3D textured scales on the ZT "do" work extremely well.
- Ideally, I would love to EDC both - I would then be prepared for anything from normal cutting chores (Milie) to hard use/battling Zombies (ZT).
Which one I plan to carry as EDC most often (and not because this is a Spyderco forum): the Milie. Why? Because for "my" typical needs/uses, I need more of a cutter/slicer than an "indestructible" knife. If I knew before hand that I might need a stronger/heavier duty folder, I would leave home the Milie and take the ZT.
Will
Wanted: Superhawk - Found!
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Nice pictorial highlighting both blades. I have the Millie CF M390. Thanks for sharing. Makes appreciating certain things in life more justifiable.
My appreciation for knives have sorta stuck at leaf shaped blades.
My appreciation for knives have sorta stuck at leaf shaped blades.
:spyder: Centofante3 (C66PBK3), ParaMilitary2 (C81GPCMO), Endura4 (C10P), GrassHopper (C138P), Military (C36GPCMO), Perrin PPT (C135GP), Squeak (C154PBK), Dragonfly 2 Salt (C28PYL2), Military M390 CF (C36CFM390P), R (C67GF), ParaMilitary2 CTS-XHP (C81GPOR2), Tuff (C151GTIP), Ladybug & Perrin Street Bowie (FB04PBB)being the newest.
Thanks for the comparison, very interesting to see them side by side.
I had the cash all saved up and ready to go for the 0560 when those 59 M390/CF Militaries came up on KW. I ended up getting the Military - first one I've ever owned, and I love it, even as a LH user. The 0560 is definitely still on my radar and I wouldn't be surprised if I end up owning one at some point in the future, but I've got to upgrade my sharpening equipment first - and now it's got to compete with a LH Military :)
I had the cash all saved up and ready to go for the 0560 when those 59 M390/CF Militaries came up on KW. I ended up getting the Military - first one I've ever owned, and I love it, even as a LH user. The 0560 is definitely still on my radar and I wouldn't be surprised if I end up owning one at some point in the future, but I've got to upgrade my sharpening equipment first - and now it's got to compete with a LH Military :)
I also recently got a ZT 0561. So far, I like the ZT a lot. It was larger than I imagined, but is still manageable in the pocket. Although I did have to move the clip to tip-down to keep the flipper out of the way inside my pocket. I'm not really a fan of flippers, and I even considered having the flipper cut off the 0561, but it stays well enough out of the way tip down. Overall, the M390 Military wins over the 561 in the practical EDC role, and I'm sure there's no cutting task I would encounter that the Millie couldn't handle just as well as the ZT, and probably better. The ZT is a beautiful piece of engineering, and opens smooth as silk. It will get pocket time, but I don't believe it will replace the Military in my EDC setup.
- Brock O Lee
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Cool comparison, thanks...
Am I correct in saying that the GB seems to be a closer comparison to the ZT, in terms of size, weight, blade shape and intended use?
I've recently grown attached to the Millie too, and I catch myself looking for excuses to carry it often!
Am I correct in saying that the GB seems to be a closer comparison to the ZT, in terms of size, weight, blade shape and intended use?
I've recently grown attached to the Millie too, and I catch myself looking for excuses to carry it often!
Hans
Favourite Spydies: Military, PM2, Shaman, UKPK
Others: Victorinox Pioneer, CRK L Sebenza 31, CRK L Inkosi
Favourite Spydies: Military, PM2, Shaman, UKPK
Others: Victorinox Pioneer, CRK L Sebenza 31, CRK L Inkosi
Great Comparison!
I picked up the 0560 a month ago (First non-Spyderco purchase in a long time) and I am blown away by the build quality and F&F. It is the nicest production blade I have ever handled. It is expensive but worth every penny. I recently added the 0561 to my collection as well.
I am looking forward to the upcoming Southard Flipper, it might be a good mix between the ZT and the Military.
-Bobby
I picked up the 0560 a month ago (First non-Spyderco purchase in a long time) and I am blown away by the build quality and F&F. It is the nicest production blade I have ever handled. It is expensive but worth every penny. I recently added the 0561 to my collection as well.
I am looking forward to the upcoming Southard Flipper, it might be a good mix between the ZT and the Military.
-Bobby
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I also recently received the 0561 in elmax. I really love this knife, I never thought I would get a knife which I want to edc more than my M390 para mil!
The summery of differences is very accurate, the ZT is VERY strong, built like a tank!
This is my first flipper and I LOVE it!!! My fingers are raw from playing Witt the knife, flip open close, in pocket, out pocket flip open, repeat. All day!
I'm pretty rough on everything I own, I tend to break things but I don't think I'll be able to break the ZT!
Almost forgot! My ZT was Blunt when I got it! Was a bit disappointing! Don't know if anybody else had this? Maybe I'm just expecting too much?! Any I edge pro'ed it, better now.
The summery of differences is very accurate, the ZT is VERY strong, built like a tank!
This is my first flipper and I LOVE it!!! My fingers are raw from playing Witt the knife, flip open close, in pocket, out pocket flip open, repeat. All day!
I'm pretty rough on everything I own, I tend to break things but I don't think I'll be able to break the ZT!
Almost forgot! My ZT was Blunt when I got it! Was a bit disappointing! Don't know if anybody else had this? Maybe I'm just expecting too much?! Any I edge pro'ed it, better now.
My edc for the last 3 months has been GB right pocket & Millie in the left pocket. But now that I just got a ZT 560 & large sebenza that is the new combo. I would say the ZT feels like a scaled up GB, with a thick blade that does not slice as well. This is my first ZT but I'm in love with it, but as usual no one but spyderco puts a 30 degree or less edge on a knife. The Millie is more comparable to the sebenza then the 560.
Even if you don't like to flip the knife it really makes the grip something special. Looking forward to the southard flipper now.
Even if you don't like to flip the knife it really makes the grip something special. Looking forward to the southard flipper now.
Gayle Bradley
Bob lum tanto sprint
Milie camo
Para2 camo
Manix2 moonglow
Tasman salt
Tenacious (the whole lineup)
Kiwi SS
Knives at all times
Bob lum tanto sprint
Milie camo
Para2 camo
Manix2 moonglow
Tasman salt
Tenacious (the whole lineup)
Kiwi SS
Knives at all times
x2, I love my 560, the flipper with KVT is awesome. They did a great job with the 3D machining and I really like the contour vs. flat scales. My 0551 tip was a just a tiny bit rounded or blunt like your 0561, very minor though and easily fixed. My 560 came absolutely perfect, they really have some high standards on quality.rjowen0984 wrote:I also recently received the 0561 in elmax. I really love this knife, I never thought I would get a knife which I want to edc more than my M390 para mil!
The summery of differences is very accurate, the ZT is VERY strong, built like a tank!
This is my first flipper and I LOVE it!!! My fingers are raw from playing Witt the knife, flip open close, in pocket, out pocket flip open, repeat. All day!
I'm pretty rough on everything I own, I tend to break things but I don't think I'll be able to break the ZT!
Almost forgot! My ZT was Blunt when I got it! Was a bit disappointing! Don't know if anybody else had this? Maybe I'm just expecting too much?! Any I edge pro'ed it, better now.
This thread reminds me how pissed I am for letting the m390 millie slip away, I got the email for the pre order but I had other things going on and decided to pass. I wish I could go back in time on that one.