I disagree. If such a steel shows a colored stain, it definitely was hotter than 400°C, definitely messing up any heat treat. I would not tolerate that either.None of the problems are anything that could affect performance. The colors or stains on the blades could be cleaned off with no special materials or techniques. The average house has things you could use including stuff like toothpaste.
The Deacon wrote:To me, if someone is dissatisfied with the condition of a knife they've purchased, returning it to the manufacturer for evaluation is the most reasonable course of action.
yes the blade with the deformed tip and the shady grind/discolouration is just too much i agreemongatu wrote:I'd be pretty upset about the blade, not so much about the cosmetic issues with the G10. The blade looks like it doesn't come to a proper point. Also, the discoloration is not just cosmetic, it is likely an indication that the knife was over heated when grinding and this could mess up the heat treat.
Re Howes, yes their policy of no returns on sprints is clearly stated. Still, it kind of sucks, imo. Fortunately, Spyderco usually stands behind their products and hopefully will make it right for the OP.
Point taken. By the same token, people in your situation should understand that before they buy. It's also one of the reasons Spyderco encourages folks outside the US to buy from dealers in their own countries whenever possible, but I know that's not always realistic. I'm aware that can mean both having a more limited selection of models to choose from and paying almost twice as much for a knife. But if Spyderco were to inspect each and every knife and reject any with even the most minor cosmetic imperfections, everyone would be paying twice as much, or more.vic wrote:i'd love to be able to send some of my knives back to the manufacturer but being in the uk it's just not possible: if i sent a knife back to spyderco it would get stolen by customs on it's return.
people in my situation are limited to dealing with the dealer they purchased the item from, and if that dealer is say, in the u.s., then there's not much we can do because if it's a folding knife, customs will steal it when it comes back
Thank you, exactly right.chuck_roxas45 wrote:
Points to ponder:
* Production knives can not all be perfect. Even Spydercos.
* If the "defect" is something that affects functionality, I'd guess that Spyderco will take care of it.
* If the "defect" is cosmetic, the knife will in all probability, be within specs.
* You either have to live with these points or buy something else which will make you happy.
" WARRANTY INFORMATION:chuck_roxas45 wrote: * If the "defect" is cosmetic, the knife will in all probability, be within specs.
The Deacon wrote:The problem is that Spyderco is building tools, while some folks are buying investment vehicles. Spyderco's motivation for offering Sprints, especially those of the Golden made models, is to give users an opportunity to try something they might otherwise not get to try. Pulling knives due to minor cosmetic imperfections, assuming they were even noticed during assembly and packaging, would deprive one person of sampling that Sprint.
Aside from the discoloration near the tip, all the imperfections mentioned are clearly in that category, and there's not sure way of knowing that it too is anything more than cosmetic.
That said, I know not everyone sees things that way. Same with return policies. I've reached the point where I think dealers should not accept returns unless they shipped the wrong knife. With only rare exceptions, manufacturing defects, significant or not, should not be their problem. To me, if someone is dissatisfied with the condition of a knife they've purchased, returning it to the manufacturer for evaluation is the most reasonable course of action.
i wasn't even thinking about pre-shipment inspection or anything like that, just that it's impossible for some people to send stuff back to spyderco or other manufacturers because of corrupt customs on our end so we have to rely on dealers in the uk who rip us off in the first place (thank you for acknowledging that by the way deacon):The Deacon wrote:Point taken. By the same token, people in your situation should understand that before they buy. It's also one of the reasons Spyderco encourages folks outside the US to buy from dealers in their own countries whenever possible, but I know that's not always realistic. I'm aware that can mean both having a more limited selection of models to choose from and paying almost twice as much for a knife. But if Spyderco were to inspect each and every knife and reject any with even the most minor cosmetic imperfections, everyone would be paying twice as much, or more.
Expecting pre-shipment inspection by the dealer can be unrealistic as well. For one thing, it assumes a level of expertise that may not exist. For another, there's the nagging suspicion that, unless you're the first customer to get one, the knife you receive will only be the least imperfect of what's left. Somehow, I'd prefer to just have everyone deal with the luck of the draw.
Again, I don't expect everyone (or, for that matter, anyone) to agree with me.
With all due respect Roman, Spyderco warrants their knives will be free of defects, that is to say against things which interfere with the proper operation of the knife. Imperfections are not defects unless they have some impact on function.bh49 wrote:With all due respect I disagree with at least one one point.
" WARRANTY INFORMATION:
Spyderco warrants that all of our products are free from defects in material and workmanship. "
dents, stains, scratches on G10 or blade certainly cosmetic, but still defects of workmanship or material, if Spyderco buy G10 per-fabricated with texture.
The only cosmetic defect on my para2 was a shiny spot in the center of the scale, which looked like melted plastic. I sent it to spyderco for evaluation and mentioned that if they cannot fix, I still want the knife. I received back a new knife, so it looks like cs agreed with me.
Very well said.Leatherneck wrote:Lord knows Spyderco is my favorite company and knife and it's all I ever buy anymore but nobody should in any way be made to feel silly or picky for being disappointed in a "special" knife that comes with a "special" price. Yes they are tools, yes they still functional but in the end only the person holding the knife, looking at it everyday matters. This isn't a $12 hammer with some scratches but rather a piece that is meant to be special in both form and function.
Given that, a less than perfect Spyderco knife is gonna happen from time to time just like any other knife manufacturer out there. Most of the time there is a happy ending and if it weren't so there wouldn't be so many of us!
True Roman, but defect is more specific, it means something that makes the item defective, unable to perform its intended function properly.bh49 wrote:Paul,
Imperfection is very broad term. My opinion regarding workmanship based on military standard for workmanship. This standard is widely accepted by many industries, but nobody is is obligated to use it, unless you are making product per customer specification and workmanship per MIL-STD is one of them. Spyderco, like any other producer makes product per their own specification, which is not publicly known, so nobody except Spyderco can determine, if knife within specification or not.
We are as customers have our own expectation, which we feel reasonable and which not always the same as specifications