BladeHQ.com Has Gray Para II's

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.
jossta
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#41

Post by jossta »

chuck_roxas45 wrote:That proves my point. You even only think about sharing with non-existent siblings. LOL.

Sulky only child who hasn't learned to share. :p

so here's my game face for you.

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RedRunner
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#42

Post by RedRunner »

That doesn't look pleasant. So where is the bottle of Jack in that picture?
dmon
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#43

Post by dmon »

Michael. Thank you for heads up again! I got it today! This knife itself worth every penny, and comes with priceless joy, all boxed in same package :) That's a awesome deal you pointed us to. Many thanks man!
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JNewell
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#44

Post by JNewell »

chuck_roxas45 wrote:You're right but I believe that it should be Sal and all of the people he consults with, who should make that decision. Not you or any other ELU. If Sal were to tell me to put my money where my mouth is and I have none to put up, I would then accept that decision in the best light.

All I want to do is to make Sal aware that demand exists. As the savvy businessman he is, he will be in a better position to make a decision according to what the market situation is.

For the individuals against a larger number of sprints per run, it's either "my exclusivity is lessened" or "why are you telling Spyderco their business?".

These things really get very involved because you are trying to convince me of something which I don't take your word for. Unless you are involved or privy to Spyderco's decision making process, your wall of text is just your opinion.
Actually, I am really not against having larger runs on sprints, truly. Six hundred, four hundred, 1200, whatever, that's fine. Truth be told, I'd love to see things like the S90V and 204CP knives go full-bore production. But we waste a lot of airtime here venting about sprints, especially after it's essentially too late to do anything about them. One of the things that I think we all are very confident about (?) is that Sal and his crew really listen to their customer base, so I doubt there's any chance they're not aware of the demand out here in ELU-ville. I think they are probably more in touch with us, and more responsive, than any one knifemaker and probably more than any other manufacturing company I can think of.
chuck_roxas45 wrote:Here you go again with the "you're telling people how to run their business thing".

I have repeated ad naseum that I am not telling Spyderco how to run their business. I am just asking. If they refuse, then they refuse but for the moment all I see are guys like you coming up with one reason or another why they can't.

I must have hit close to a nerve with my last post to elicit such a vitriolic reply. ;)

Seriously, you do sound like a child not wanting to share.
Well, LOL back at ya. Seriously, you do sound like a child with an entitlement complex. ;)
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JNewell
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#45

Post by JNewell »

dmon wrote:I am a newbie spyderholic, and maybe missing something very important, but honestly I can't wrap my head around this sprint run business. It seems to be a dedicated major PITA for both Spyderco and us. Sprint models are more complex and expensive to produce and distribute, etc. And they are very hard and expensive to find and buy. So where is the logic? :)
There is no logic - no business that put profits first would do this! :spyder: What you see here is a company run by a family that really, really appreciates pushing the limits of existing products and technology. They go to a lot of trouble and some risk to buy up small lots of exotic or unusual steel, do small runs of existing knives with these steels (which require different heat treat and often more expensive fabrication costs) just for the sheer joy it brings to them and to us. There is no company that does this on this kind of scale and with this kind of consistency. You can find other companies offering exotic steels, but very infrequently and sometimes almost accidentally (for example, as leftover inventory clean-up). Sal describes himself as a "steelhead" and he runs this company from his heart as much as from his head. :) We should all say "Thank you, Sal!" every time one of these gets into the market. :)
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#46

Post by RedRunner »

JNewell wrote: We should all say "Thank you, Sal!" every time one of these gets into the market. :)
Thank you Sal & Spyderco!
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Pinetreebbs
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#47

Post by Pinetreebbs »

chuck_roxas45 wrote:That's good, so you're just the child who doesn't want to share. :p
From your "Who Needs supersteels?" thread:
chuck_roxas45 wrote:...So here I find myself with no great need for monster wear resistance and edge holding....

But I still want more supersteels.

I wonder why that is. :D
No wonder to me, sprint runs deliver steel choices that would not sell as a production knife.
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RedRunner
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#48

Post by RedRunner »

It all comes down to the love of fine, well produced products. We just want them - it's human. And wanting high-end Sypderco knives is just being a really smart human. ;)

I understand when people can't get a knife, they want more to be produced. If I were in that boat, I'd ask for it too. I'd love to have more of the Manix 2 in S90V/CF - my personal favorite knife, of which I only have one and fear some day it will be sharpened down to nothing.

My super general advice is that even though these Sprint runs seem small (600 pieces or so), they are still obtainable with just a little bit of searching. So if you really want one, try a few of the big guys, Spydietalk.com, Knifecenter.com, etc., regularly when they start popping up. And it's best if you can put in a pre-order when they offer it. Even if you are 10th on the list, you still stand a good chance of eventually get the knife.

But I do want to say that I completely understand the desire to own these knives. I think most of us here on this forum share that feeling. We all have allot in common.
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chuck_roxas45
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#49

Post by chuck_roxas45 »

JNewell wrote:Actually,...
Whatever.... :rolleyes:
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StangBang
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#50

Post by StangBang »

Blerv wrote:Yea sometimes when a good sprint comes out I buy them all and then burn 599 of them. Sure that one Para II cost me $90,000 but the Vogue factor is off the chartz!
lmfao!!! :p
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#51

Post by dmon »

JNewell wrote:There is no logic - no business that put profits first would do this! :spyder: What you see here is a company run by a family that really, really appreciates pushing the limits of existing products and technology. They go to a lot of trouble and some risk to buy up small lots of exotic or unusual steel, do small runs of existing knives with these steels (which require different heat treat and often more expensive fabrication costs) just for the sheer joy it brings to them and to us. There is no company that does this on this kind of scale and with this kind of consistency. You can find other companies offering exotic steels, but very infrequently and sometimes almost accidentally (for example, as leftover inventory clean-up). Sal describes himself as a "steelhead" and he runs this company from his heart as much as from his head. :) We should all say "Thank you, Sal!" every time one of these gets into the market. :)
Well, I really don't want you to feel that I or anyone on this forum are not thankful for everything that Sal and everyone @Spyderco are bringing to us. This is not even questionable.
I still don't see any logic in not having any logic. Fact that we don't see it doesn't mean there is no logic. Right?
Come on, lets get down to earth. Sprints seem to guarantee success, as they are based on proven and successful models, and proven well known and sought after steels. Sprints are never overstocked and undersold, even when priced above MSRP. Most are paid for in advance long before being unleashed to the nature, etc, etc, etc... Now, considering all complexities, if you produced 600, why not to do 1000, or 2000?
Sorry, I don't buy this 'complexity and risk' stuff. It smells something else. Just trying to understand what.
And yes, absolutely agree, Thank you Sal !!!
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#52

Post by RedRunner »

dmon wrote:Sprints seem to guarantee success, as they are based on proven and successful models, and proven well known and sought after steels. Sprints are never overstocked and undersold, even when priced above MSRP. Most are paid for in advance long before being unleashed to the nature, etc, etc, etc... Now, considering all complexities, if you produced 600, why not to do 1000, or 2000?
Sorry, I don't buy this 'complexity and risk' stuff. It smells something else. Just trying to understand what.
And yes, absolutely agree, Thank you Sal !!!
1.) There have been several Sprint runs that didn't sell well. It's not a given. Albeit in the current market, it certainly seems like a S90V/CF will always sell, at least at a 600 count.

2.) I've dealt with 4 dealers primarily and none ask me to pre-pay for a knife. I'm not sure which dealer you are referring to that does that. It's not something that is easy to do. Dealers don't know how many knives they wil lreceive and when they will receive them. I'm not sure their merchant card account agreements let them process C.C. payments under those circumstances. May I ask which dealer has charged you in advance for a Sprint run knife, before they had it in stock?

I really don't think there is a big conspiracy here. People are just trying to explain the business behind the scenes. We all want the same thing - more of these great knives, but there is really a limit to the production. Spyderco isn't a Walmart and doesn't have an army of outsourced operations bubble wrapping junk that will fall apart after the first few weeks of use. This high quality product that most of us find we can only buy from Spyderco at these reasonable prices. BTW: If there are any Walmart shareholders out there, I didn't mean to offend you - I used Walmart as theoretical example only.

And at a more basic level, I suspect Spyderco sells a lot more traditional (regular) production knives than they do Sprints. I also suspect their profits on those knives, as whole, are a lot higher. At the marginal level (i.e. per piece), the profit margin between a Sprint and a production knife are probably closer than you think.

The real answer for a lot of these inquiries is much more obvious - boost the price of the Sprint runs. Spyderco could charge $200 a piece for them, produce 600, and sure sales are a little slower, but there is more profit to cover the time in inventory. And the best part is they can continue to produce just as many regular production knives. I bet people would respect the Sprints allot more if they did that. Seriously a S90V/CF Para 2 for less than $150? That is a steel - no pun intended.

I'd be very careful how far you guys push this issue. Economics point to the above change more than it does to producing more Sprints. Sal & Co are great people with a real zest for the industry and his Customers - I think that's why he builds Sprints. But you guys are really looking a gift horse in the mouth. Let's be thankful for what he has given us. And I mean "give" in the very literal sense - referring back to the S90V/CF Para 2 example.
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chuck_roxas45
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#53

Post by chuck_roxas45 »

RedRunner wrote:
The real answer for a lot of these inquiries is much more obvious - boost the price of the Sprint runs. Spyderco could charge $200 a piece for them, produce 600, and sure sales are a little slower, but there is more profit to cover the time in inventory. And the best part is they can continue to produce just as many regular production knives. I bet people would respect the Sprints allot more if they did that. Seriously a S90V/CF Para 2 for less than $150? That is a steel - no pun intended.

I'd be very careful how far you guys push this issue. Economics point to the above change more than it does to producing more Sprints. Sal & Co are great people with a real zest for the industry and his Customers - I think that's why he builds Sprints. But you guys are really looking a gift horse in the mouth. Let's be thankful for what he has given us. And I mean "give" in the very literal sense - referring back to the S90V/CF Para 2 example.

Maybe Spyderco should boost the prices of these sprints. I'd love for Spyderco to make more money from these. $200 or $300 each would be nice.
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#54

Post by RedRunner »

chuck_roxas45 wrote:Maybe Spyderco should boost the prices of these sprints. I'd love for Spyderco to make more money from these. $200 or $300 each would be nice.
It's a reasonable move. Spyderco makes more money & Customers won't get so upset about the limited runs. I think the Sprints are just too cheap and hence everybody wants one, or two or three, etc. Make them more expensive and people will be more discerning on their purchases.

The funny thing is, you can buy a Para 2 in Carpenter Steel, the knife that's been recently driving these discussions, for about $200 on eBay today. So if it does happen, it will be interesting to look back on posts like these and see how good we had it before we started asking for more.
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chuck_roxas45
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#55

Post by chuck_roxas45 »

Well, I bought mine for $200, so it seems that's it's only you who has it so good. ;)

Would you still buy one or two if you had to pay $200 or $300?
RedRunner
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#56

Post by RedRunner »

I would buy 1, not sure about 2. I'm still uncertain about the Carpenter Steel. Seems good, but S90V is a sure thing. I also like the CF. I did pick up an extra Carpenter Steel Para 2, incase I decide I like it and want a second one when I wear this on out. Wish I had done that with my S90VCF Manix 2. I was a beginner bad then... :)
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chuck_roxas45
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#57

Post by chuck_roxas45 »

RedRunner wrote:I would buy 1, not sure about 2. I'm still uncertain about the Carpenter Steel. Seems good, but S90V is a sure thing. I also like the CF. I did pick up an extra Carpenter Steel Para 2, incase I decide I like it and want a second one when I wear this on out. Wish I had done that with my S90VCF Manix 2. I was a beginner bad then... :)
Excellent! So let's start asking Spyderco to double the price of sprints. I hope you're reading this Sal.
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#58

Post by RedRunner »

Start a thread on it and see if you can get support.
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chuck_roxas45
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#59

Post by chuck_roxas45 »

RedRunner wrote:Start a thread on it and see if you can get support.
Are you not gonna support me on a move that will make more money for Spyderco?
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#60

Post by RedRunner »

chuck_roxas45 wrote:Are you not gonna support me on a move that will make more money for Spyderco?
Nope - I'm solidly in the "Status Quo" camp. I'd prefer not to mess with a good thing. I only see that as a more reasonable alternative to the produce more until Spyderco goes broke alternative, at least that's how I see it. So to that end, if we were moving off of Status Quo, I would support you.

But you seem solidly behind it, so I'd suggest you test the waters and see what the forum thinks. All other alternatives have been voiced loudly an often - might as well try yours. :D
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