SM Sharpening Technique: CPM-S30V vs. VG10

[AJF]

I have only recently gotten reacquainted with Spydies, and am having a ball with them. Even dusted off the old Sharpmaker, and am tickled to death with the ease of keeping up my edges.

I only have three Spydies so far this go round: a Sage I, a Caly 3 VG10, and a Delica FFG VG10. They are all great slicers, and the Delica is the best of the three.

I notice, though, a difference in feel to the Sage's CPM-S30V edge. It's hard to put into words, but if, for example, I'm testing sharpness with slicing fine curls off paper, the S30V will often "bounce" off the paper without cutting it, as though it's too slick. When it does cut, though, it slices very fine and well. I have no such issues with either VG10 knife.

Just now, I tried finishing off the Sage with a few strokes on the flat sides of the gray stones, thinking that might give the edge more bite. It seems to, but also doesn't seem as sharp as when I finish with the white flats.

So, can any SM fans please give me any insight or tips on how you sharpen S30V as opposed to VG10?

Thanks,

Andrew

[Ankerson]

VG-10 will bite better than S30V with a polished edge from what I have seen.

I sharpen them both the same though.

[npueppke]

S30V forms a burr easier in my experience. VG10, on the other hand, sharpens up very nicely by alternating sides with each stroke (on S30V I usually do a certain number of strokes on one side and then switch instead of alternating).

[The Mentaculous]

From my expirience, S30v's edge feels finer to the touch...very smooth, perfect for push-cuts but probably not ideal for draw cuts/"biting" into things because of the smoothness. I've found both VG-10 and S30v don't have very "toothy" edges, compared to something like AUS 8

[AJF]

Thanks for the thoughts and tips, gents. I'm always learning here.

Andrew

[Donut]

I saw a thread on another forum that a lot of people like to finish their S30V with a coarser grit than they do VG-10.

In my experience, it does seem like VG-10 will sharpen to a thinner and straighter edge at the molecular level. I wonder if anyone has done research into that kind of thing.

[dj moonbat]

In my experience, it does seem like VG-10 will sharpen to a thinner and straighter edge at the molecular level. I wonder if anyone has done research into that kind of thing.

I'm sure someone has. Anecdotally, VG-10 takes the smoothest edge of any stainless I have encountered. I guess there's something magic about adding a little bit of cobalt.

[dj moonbat]

Just now, I tried finishing off the Sage with a few strokes on the flat sides of the gray stones, thinking that might give the edge more bite. It seems to, but also doesn't seem as sharp as when I finish with the white flats.

People talk about the "tooth" of some steels, and S30v seems known for having some tooth.

I would not recommend finishing a knife on a coarser grit in hopes of encouraging a toothier blade. What you get instead are coarser troughs cut into the steel by the larger abrasive particles. Those troughs are ill-suited for cutting tasks. To the extent that a steel has some tooth to it, the tooth should be coming from very, very small carbide particles, and not from visible scratches in the steel left by coarse abrasives.

[unit]

People talk about the "tooth" of some steels, and S30v seems known for having some tooth.

I would not recommend finishing a knife on a coarser grit in hopes of encouraging a toothier blade. What you get instead are coarser troughs cut into the steel by the larger abrasive particles. Those troughs are ill-suited for cutting tasks. To the extent that a steel has some tooth to it, the tooth should be coming from very, very small carbide particles, and not from visible scratches in the steel left by coarse abrasives.

I agree and would add that often factories will grind a bevel with a coarse abrasive and then put on a micro bevel with a much higher polish. This minimizes time spent putting the edge on and optimizes cutting performance in spite of the coarse "look" of the edge bevel.

Put it under strong magnification and you see the micro bevel is NOT coarse in appearance...and that is why factory edges often look coarse yet perform VERY VERY well.

I have played a trick or two on a few buddies this way...pull out a knife that I put a bevel on with an XC DMT and start whittling hairs...it looks very coarse, but the HIGHLY polished micro bevel (that is not visible unless you have optimal viewing conditions) is responsible for the knife performance.

[The General]

I will be honest boys and girls, I prefer VG10 over S30V.

I have no problem sharpening either steel, none at all. I have sharpened just about every steel there is and only CPM 440V was a pain to get a hair popping edge.

S30V just seems to like to micro chip and loses its hair popping edge too quickly for my liking. S30V will hold a usable edge a good old length of time but once a knife no longer pops hairs, I tend to strop it. VG10 holds a hair popping edge a lot longer in my experience and is not as prone to micro chip.

Hate to say it, but S30V is not all that. Its a good steel but I do honestly prefer VG10.

[AJF]

Thanks, gents. I guess finishing with a couple of strokes on the coarser stones isn't the way to go.

Any suggestions for any different techniques with the S30V?

Thanks,

Andrew

[The General]

S30V does in my experience respond to a polished edge. The more highly you can polish the edge the better it holds it.