Knife for a military deployment

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.

What would you take to "the desert"?

Endura Wave CE
3
3%
Endura ZDP CE
3
3%
Military CE
48
56%
Other
32
37%
 
Total votes: 86

gac
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Postby gac » Sat Sep 05, 2009 9:58 am

Dr. Snubnose wrote:I would take a simple FRN Delica CE or CE Native...Doc :D
A Native? You mean he should bring the greatest knife ever made? That is a fine suggestion.

I, too, would think a large H1 folder would be handy. You'll already have lots of crap to carry around so keep it simple.

usmc1371
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Postby usmc1371 » Sat Sep 05, 2009 10:02 am

I carried a tanto point axis lock BM ce on every day during two deployments in Iraq and IMHO it was outstanding, no rust issues with the ATS-34 steel. When it got dull I would pack my BM auto stryker but ALL the autos I saw in Iraq got dirty and didn't work worth a dam so it was a back up only.

If I were going for a third trip, besides my beloved BM I would not leave with out an SE rescue and a PE millie or zdp PE endura. I have a SE zdp endura but I think it would be a pain if I ever had to sharpen it. Camies have nice deep pockets and lots of them so you won't mind a good sized folder. A rescue would be great to have cliped on your body armor in case you need to cut some one out of their armor or bdu's in a hurry and they don't weigh anything. As far as a fixed blade the marines were nice enough to issue me a Giant bayonet that got used for all sorts of vile things no sane person would do with a knife they owned. Due to the weight of said giant bayonet it only got carried when I thought I would need it, when its stupid hot out the last thing you want is a heavy piece of gear that you never use, I would rather have another 30rd mag than a bayonet any day. If you need a weapon you need a gun and some friends with guns.
Your sharpmaker will make you lots of friends, I had a lansky and it was the only decent sharpner in my platoon so it got used all the time. Not trying to bash but I saw more broken crkt products than I can count.

Sgt. Haak
USMC combat engineer, Al Taquddam Iraq feb-oct 2005/2006

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vito72
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Postby vito72 » Sat Sep 05, 2009 12:09 pm

Water Bug wrote:Being active duty military and having been on humanitarian relief efforts and field training exercises, if I had to go with Spyderco folders only, I'd go with...

Primary Folder: A Spyderco Military PE, preferably in the high grade stainless steels (CPM S30V or BF 42), or a full-size, original Spyderco Manix PE (CPM S30V). The Spyderco Manix 2 PE (either 154CM or CPM S90V) would suffice if you can't get a full-size Manix. I, personally, wouldn't go with anything smaller than a Spyderco Para-Military PE in CPM S30V as my main folder. These :spyder: s offer you practical lengths for a large folder as well as durability and reliability. I've carried the Military, Manix, and Para-Military in very hot, humid conditions in the LRP of my BDUs where the blades would become heavily beaded in sweat and the G-10 handles soaked. I'd simply wipe down the blades occasionally and allow the knives to air out in the open when I went to bed. So far, no rust issues.

Secondary Folders: The Spyderco Delica 4 FRN (or any of the Delica models), VG-10, in both PE and SE. This gives you a smaller PE blade to work with as well as a SE blade should you need it. The Delica's size and FRN handles makes it very practical in carry and expense to EDC in both PE and SE. Your BDUs, ABUs, ACUs, etc., has plenty of pockets for storing something the size of a Delica. Again, occasionally wipe the sweat from the blade and let it air out when possible.

I advocate more for PE in real world contingency situations due to the ease of sharpening no matter what your method of putting on an edge. I also push for a knife dedicated to one thing, hence the recommendation for the Delica in both PE and SE. The Delica SE should take care of your serrated blade needs. If you have to go with a CE edge configuration, fine... I feel you'd be better served keeping it simple and having one PE blade and one SE blade.

Again, my above recommendations work for me when I've had to go out into "the field." Ultimately, consider having a primary folder (preferably PE for ease of sharpening and of a good quality stainless steel) and two secondary folders (one PE and one SE, small, easy to carry, and of a quality stainless steel). CPM D2 would be a good choice, but you may potentially run into rust issues. If rust is not a concern for you, go for it.

Hope this helps. Take care over there!
i agree 100%....
Probably could be enough one military S30V and one other smaller serrated like delica or native or something other in H1.
Military its best folder i have...

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type00rev
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Postby type00rev » Sat Sep 05, 2009 12:54 pm

Scottie3000 wrote:I'm preparing myself for a deployment "over there". Help me decide which knife to take with me. I'm taking a Cold Steel Recon Tanto Fixed blade as my big fixed blade. I'm leaning towards a combo edge folder because while I plan to take my sharpmaker, I don't anticipate having a lot of free time to spend sharpening. What would you (or did you for all you other military folks) take with you?
Frankly......and no offense intended:

Throw away, or sell that overpriced CS Recon Tanto piece of crap and buy yourself a Busse SJTAC (6") or BATAC (5") for your deployment. You can do much, much better than CS. Personally, I would not stake my life on anything Cold Steel, PERIOD. I'm not bashing CS, just speaking from experience (12+ years USMC). Pair up the Busse with the Spyderco Military C36GPSBK (combo edge/blk blade), and your set. I don't know what branch you're in or your MOS......but if you have a man killin' MOS......you should be carrying a Busse into combat. If you need it in a hurry.....call them, Military orders get expedited. The SJTAC & BATAC aren't current production, but Busse may have a few at the shop reserved for Military orders. If not, they are readily available on the BladeForums.com Marketplace.
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The Mastiff
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Postby The Mastiff » Sat Sep 05, 2009 1:46 pm

I suggest an endura 4, Plain edge, or a police 3, both in VG10. Remember not to pry or other stuff. If I may suggest, a different fixed blade for you too. I'd go with a Ranger RD9/7 whatever size you like in 5160 steel. Just remember it will rust though, but it's a couple of orders of magnitude stronger and IMO better than an AUS 8A CS RT.
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brj
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Postby brj » Sat Sep 05, 2009 3:34 pm

as much as I love my millies, I have to echo everybody else that have suggested the Pacific Salt - SE yellow handle
you may also want to have a look at the Temperance II... ;)

Blades
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Postby Blades » Sat Sep 05, 2009 6:09 pm

I voted for the Endura, but I would say buy 2. One plain edge, one full serrated.
--Jason--
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edge-e
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Postby edge-e » Sat Sep 05, 2009 7:27 pm

three blades,military PE black digi-camo,and Police 3 SE.Fixed blade black coated 1095 or better for toughness folders cover everything else.

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D1omedes
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Postby D1omedes » Sat Sep 05, 2009 7:49 pm

I agree with the Pacific Salt choice. Moisture is going to be a big issue for anything that's in your pocket and the lack of liners make the Salt very easy to clean. I also hear that H1 has a work-hardening edge so it should have a longer-lasting edge the more you use it.

Be safe over there.

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v8r
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Postby v8r » Sat Sep 05, 2009 8:03 pm

What I first thought when I read your post was He needs a Manix 2, but then I thought "what if it gets sand in the lock".I don't know how well a Caged Ball lock would do in sandy conditions.It might get sand in the Plunger and cause the knife to not lock open.

Maybe a Pacific Salt with the black blade.Non reflective(don't know if that is important to you or not).It would be hard to find in the dark if you dropped it.I don't really think it would matter what steel the blade is.I think it would be easier to wipe down your knife than field strip your duty weapon.Do you guys clean your weapons every night when you come back in(I have never been in the Military so I don't know)?I would just wipe whatever you get down with a Silicone gun cloth every night.

Thanks for your service to our country.I wish I would have done the same when I was younger. :(
V8R



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MCM
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Postby MCM » Sat Sep 05, 2009 8:15 pm

Just curious, whats being issued these days?
:spyder: :eek: :spyder: :eek: :spyder: :eek: :spyder:
More S90v & CF please.......

usmc1371
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Postby usmc1371 » Sat Sep 05, 2009 9:50 pm

I don't know about army/air force/navy, the USMC is handing out big scary multi purpose bayonets that should cover the role of Big Fixed blade just fine. here is a link sorry I don't know how to post pics.

http://www.jtknives.com/ontario6504.htm

usmc1371
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Postby usmc1371 » Sat Sep 05, 2009 9:59 pm

I never had any rust issues with my knives, ATS-34, 154 cm, 1095 hc and I am sure I did plenty of sweating. I wiped the blades down with a silicone gun cloth every couple weeks or when ever they needed a blade touch up and hit them with compresed air once and a while. The AXIS lock worked 100% no matter how dirty it got, the Auto Stryker worked... some times, if it was clean and I said please.

Like I said befor if I needed a large fixed blade my Free/issued bayonet filled the bill and as a combat engineer I had the chance to cut lots of things normal folks would use tin snips/shears or wire cutters on.

clovisc
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Postby clovisc » Sun Sep 06, 2009 12:24 am

Pacific Salt in SE.

or a PE Military.

These were the knives I ended up using the most in Zambia, while in the Peace Corps.

Good luck.
:spyder: :spyder: :spyder:

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Scottie3000
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Postby Scottie3000 » Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:51 am

type00rev wrote:Frankly......and no offense intended:

Throw away, or sell that overpriced CS Recon Tanto piece of crap and buy yourself a Busse SJTAC (6") or BATAC (5") for your deployment. You can do much, much better than CS. Personally, I would not stake my life on anything Cold Steel, PERIOD. I'm not bashing CS, just speaking from experience (12+ years USMC). Pair up the Busse with the Spyderco Military C36GPSBK (combo edge/blk blade), and your set. I don't know what branch you're in or your MOS......but if you have a man killin' MOS......you should be carrying a Busse into combat. If you need it in a hurry.....call them, Military orders get expedited. The SJTAC & BATAC aren't current production, but Busse may have a few at the shop reserved for Military orders. If not, they are readily available on the BladeForums.com Marketplace.
I chose the CS fixed blade for three reasons.

#1 Its cheap enough to consider disposable. I'm pretty sure a Busse will run me well over $100. The last deployment I went on I used a Cold steel Gunsite large folder. It worked well and the only problem it had was a loosening of the pinned pivot. IMO, Spyderco beats CS hands down for quality. I have become a collector and daily user of Spyderco and I doubt I'll ever own a CS folder again, but the CS didn't have any issues back then.

#2 Its a tanto point that will keep the tip when doing other than cutting knife tasks.

#3 Its SS so I wont have to worry about corrosion as much.

I don't anticipate having to use a knife for self defense. That's what M4s, M9s, and M249s are for. If i can get ahold of a bayonet or a K-Bar for free, I'll use that instead. In my experience fixed blades are ABUSED every time they are needed.

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Scottie3000
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Postby Scottie3000 » Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:53 am

MCM wrote:Just curious, whats being issued these days?
As far as folders, Benchmade Autos are the norm. Again, they have served me well and I've never had a problem with the knife in general or too much of an issue with the auto locking mechanism. Occasionally the supply people are cheap and try to push Gerber Gators in CE on all of us.

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Clawhammer
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Postby Clawhammer » Sun Sep 06, 2009 7:27 am

Regarding combat knives in modern combat zones I believe the US Marines used to have a similar saying regarding pistols:

"Only there to fight your way back to your rifle, which you shouldn't have dropped in the first place!"

My vote goes for the Pacific Salt !

grunt0331
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Postby grunt0331 » Sun Sep 06, 2009 8:55 am

get a Chinook. that way, if that CS accidentally falls into the shitter, you'll have a nice sturdy folder as a backup.

kidding. i think you should take a plain edge knife. combos and serrated edges are too difficult to maintain. if you need serrations, use the serrated blade on your multitool. if you do not yet own a nice multitool, then step 1 is: buy a multitool.

rust shouldn't be a problem, because the same cleaning kit you use for your rifle/MG/pistol can be used to clean your knife... and weapons maintenance should be taking place at least once a day.

i am unsure of your MOS. i was in the infantry in the Marine Corps. we were very limited to the amount of gear we could take, so my sharpening stones stayed behind. i carried a small, flat river stone in my buttpack while in kuwait and Saudi Arabia, that i used to sharpen my knives. i also carried a machete and learned from an officer in the Jordanian Special Forces how to sharpen my folder (SOG) on the back of the machete (no bullshit).

it would be really hard for me to recommend a knife because we are all different shapes and sizes, and we use our knives differently.
but, of the knives that you are choosing from, the Military is my favorite- in plain edge. it was designed for the field: easy to clean, easy to sharpen, lightweight, extremely durable, etc.

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Scottie3000
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Postby Scottie3000 » Sun Sep 06, 2009 11:38 am

grunt0331 wrote:
kidding. i think you should take a plain edge knife. combos and serrated edges are too difficult to maintain. if you need serrations, use the serrated blade on your multitool. if you do not yet own a nice multitool, then step 1 is: buy a multitool.
This is an excellent point I've overlooked. I think I am sold on plain edge. Thank you all for your input and above all, thank you for your support!

Toast
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Postby Toast » Sun Sep 06, 2009 2:49 pm

I would start by buying a Citadel, might as well take advantage of one of the few perks that exist for being in the military (maybe not to actually bring but they are very cool and I really would like one). For a fixed blade I would take a look at the Ontario Gen II line. They are of 5160 steel, as recommended above, but are relatively speaking very light. The SP43 next to me has a double guard, 8" full flat grind, a crappy but functional sheath, is under $60 and weighs 10oz. There are a number of sizes so if 8" is too long there are other options.

Another idea for a fixed blade might be the The Aqua Salts, in H1, they are lighter still at only 4.2oz. This is lighter than many folders but with greater reach and more capable if you should, God forbid, ever have to use a knife as your weapon. They can be had in serrated or plain edge.

For folders I guess I would not bring a ZDP-189 blade. Although great for edge retention they are a bit hard to sharpen and have reported been somewhat aggressive rusters. Whatever you bring for a folder I would suggest also bringing a, or a few, Ladybug Salts. At 0.6oz they could come in really handy and will not be much of a burden.


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