Musings about Dragonfly models...

[Jeff/1911]

Folks,



I am wondering why with the stainless steel version of the Dragonfly appears to deviate from the “usual” steel type selection that I have observed with Spyderco knives. What I am referring to is that the S/S model uses ATS-55 steel and the FRN model AUS-8. I am aware that AUS-8 is generally thought of as a lesser steel than ATS-55 (or is it?). I have just been reading the thread started by VampyreWolf containing thoughts on this question so I realize that AUS-8 is certainly a good steel…However, it seems that usually the S/S Spydies get AUS-6 vs ATS-55 for the lightweight Zytel ones, and so on. As an example, the Endura or Delica lines are this way as you know.



So why assign a “better” steel to the s/s Knives here and not elsewhere? Are not the Zytel knives conceived/designed as hearty “hard use” knives w/ the S/S versions more a fine use, possibly occasional use piece w/ the “gentleman’s folder” appearance?



Your thoughts, esteemed Spydie brethren? Jeff/1911.

[Michael G73]

Hi Jeff!

My first guess would be cost issues. If I recall, the FRN and SS Delica are almost the same price, but there is quite a difference in price on the SS Dragonfly over the FRN. I agree it doesn't make much sense that the "standard" seems to have been reversed on the Dragonfly.

All I can say is I sure wish my Dragonfly had AT LEAST ATS-55 on it instead of AUS-8. This is my everyday carry knife, and its gets a lot of abuse (as in hard work) and I definitely put the blade through its paces. My preference, of course (as mentioned in another topic) would be VG-10. (I'd also like fish-scale FRN handles and a removeable clip- kind of a Calypso Mini). I say that because when I DO carry my Calypso Jr the blade performs much better- but I like the size of my Dragonfly better.

-Michael

Edited by - Michael G73 on 7/28/2001 1:15:05 PM

[Jeff/1911]

Yes, it is interesting alright. I am glad to hear that you like your Dragonfly so well, as I plan to buy one soon myself.

Personally, I am pleased that the s/s version is the one with ATS-55, it's the one I will buy because I really like s/s handles.
I'd sure like to see one come out in VG-10 as you suggest. To me, it looks like a mini Calypso Jr. anyway. Why not produce it as such?

Jeff/1911.

[Clay Kesting]

Jeff,

I think it's to do with the price point at which the knife is aimed. I think stainless Delica and Endura were aimed at a point below the FRN models in part in an attempt to counter the knock-offs. OTOH the stainless Dragonfly seems to be designed as very elegant "gentleman's" knife and so gets the better steel and higher price. I just checked the "cattle dog" and the stainless Police, Harpy, Copilot and Pro-Grip are all ATS-55, the Native is AUS-10 and the Calypso is AUS-8. The equivalent FRN models are Merlin ATS-55, Pro-Grip AUS-8, Native CPM-440V and Calypso VG-10. I guess it's just a matter of horses for courses <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle>.

BTW the CF Dragonfly is also ATS-55.

Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow, in Australia it's tomorrow already.

[Jeff/1911]

Clay,

This makes perfect sense, when you explain it like that.

Thank you very much for reminding me about the CF Dragonfly. I had forgotten about this option! It's tip down too isn't it? I like tip down. And I love carbon fibre. I will think seriously about one of these.

Cheers, Jeff/1911.

[Clay Kesting]

Yes Jeff, it's tip-down. They are hard to find but certainly worth the trouble. I carry mine in my shirt pocket to compliment the larger knife in the pocket of my jeans.

Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow, in Australia it's tomorrow already.

[Jeff/1911]

Clay,

Perhaps I should have used the example of the Jr. Calypso ltwt and the s/s version in my previous posting. I see these models conceived as "gentleman's folders" as we have previously discussed, yet in contrast to the dragonfly selections; the ltwt Calypso model gets better steel than the s/s model.

The CF Dragonfly knives sure are a nice looking piece. How would you compare the Dragonfly's performance and handling to that of your micarta Calypso Jr. - if that's possible to do... I realize that each of these tools will have it's own niche. Just an interesting question for me.

Jeff/1911.

[Clay Kesting]

Jeff,

I think the case of the Calypsos can be explained by looking at their development. The original micarta model had a flat ground blade in AUS-8 while the stainless version had a hollow ground blade in the same steel. When the micarta version was replaced by FRN with a VG-10 blade, the stainless model remained unchanged. IIRC the stainless Calypso was already selling reasonably well (compared to the micarta) and was probably not seen as needing a change.

The Dragonfly and Calypso have very similar performance due in no small part to their thin flat ground blades. The Dragonfly is limited for some tasks by the length of its blade i.e. cutting up fruit, but otherwise is an extremely useful size. I find the handle fits my hand very well, even better than the Navigator although it is rather thin. My CF Dragonfly is my "city" knife, for those times when I might run foul of our restrictive carry laws.

Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow, in Australia it's tomorrow already.

[sal]

The Dragonfly is still being made as it was in the last modification. AUS-8 has served the model well. The SS version was made later so we tooled for ATS-55. When we get around to refining the design of the Dragonfly, probably some time next year, then we will consider a steel change.

sal

[Jeff/1911]

Sal,

Thank you for your reply and explanation. I certainly have no complaints about AUS-8 steel from Spyderco, as my micarta Calypso Jr. is a fine performing knife. I was merely interested in the design and marketing ideas. Thanks for explaining this.

Jeff/1911.