SD spydies

[clovisc]

there's a homicidal maniac currently at large in my town, and it's got everyone in the area pretty nervous. pretty gruesome murder not long ago -- maybe the worst my town has ever seen. needless to say, it's got me thinking about self-defense more than usual.

i was wondering -- which of your spydies do you carry as emergency self-defense tools? why, where and how do you carry them? do you drill/train with them, and how?

my assortment of SD-only spydies currently includes:

matriarch -- (usually, i only carry it if i'm going somewhere really dark, really late at night, when i know i'll be alone and far from help)

chinook II CE -- (don't carry it so often... last time i did was when i had to go to a really bad neighborhood in philly...)

merlin SE -- (carry it fairly often -- a favorite SD knife because it's rather hard to fatally injure someone with a hawkbill. i'd anticipate using it somewhat like a karambit)

scorpius PE -- (probably my favorite SD knife, just because of how comfortable it feels in my hand, and how familiar i've become with it.)

smith SE -- (don't carry it so often, but boy is it good-looking!)

personally -- a knife would be an absolute LAST resort for me, and i hope i would NEVER have to use one on another human being...

if i were assaulted, i would try to use the SD training i've received while studying hung gar (tiger-crane kung fu) and chin na (chinese grappling and joint manipulation) to neutralize my attacker and escape... but if that failed, and i had no other choice, i'd feel most comfortable with the scorpius, matriarch or merlin in hand...

although, most of the time when i'm out alone at night, i'm training, and i've got my 7' ash pole with me... :D :eek: :D

[Jimd]

I own two types of Spydies: A Dodo, and a few Natives. Either, in my estimation, would make a passable self-defense tool, though not my first choice.

I normally carry a Strider fixed blade and/or folder. In addition, I often have my Sig P228 or my Glock 17 with me. For dire self-d, the handgun would be my choice, not because of awesome stopping power (handguns actually aren't great fight-stoppers), but because it would be the most powerful tool I have with me, short of a shotgun.

As you stated, knives would likely be the last resort.

[greencobra]

clovisc, in my opinion, unless your trained in the use of a knife in SD, it doesn't matter. All the fancy chi ha wa (wax on, wax off) stuff will not help unless you are mentally prepared and confident. Grab a knife that puts the greatest distance between you and the perp and run the other way. I don't believe in knives for SD myself. If someone is that close in a threatening situation, I need to end it ASAP.

I'm not disrespecting you, it's how I strongly feel.

[i.v]

the best knives for self defense IMO are the one's that give you the most options to use them (& they have to be strong of course, but that's not a problem with any spydie).
what are the "options"? slashing, stabbing, back slashing, impacts. the matriarch is desligned as a non leathal slashing tool, it can inflict terrible slashes but you are very limited in the what you can do with it, also, if attacked by a murderer, i'd use lethal force if i must, so, naturally, the knives best suitible for the job are the ones designed for it, chinook, yojimbo, ronin. others that might do the trick: delica, endura, mili, para mili (all great for stabbing), i recommend PE for combat because serrations can get caught on things especially if you're engaged in CQC & have no room for a proper swing\slash\stab.
out of the knives you mentioned, i'd go with the scorpious or chinook.. probably scorpious because it's all PE & it's tail can easily bust a rib\jaw\any other joint & inflict a lot of pain.

[i.v]

just noticed greencobra's reply :D

greencobra my friend, please allow me to correct you, anyone with proper martial arts training (a SD class course someone took 5 years ago does not count, i mean experience & knowledge of years or at the very least months)
has an advantage, the fact is, the no one is born with the ability to do anything, we do what we learn, practice is & it becomes instinctive, that is true for games, school, driving, cooking, gardening, anything you want & it also includes fighting. if you learn how to fight & practice it long enough, your reactions become instinctive, just like, for example, if a child jump on to the road while you are driving, hitting the breaks is an instinctive response limited only to your response time & reflexes.

[druid]

I have no real background or training but it seems that limiting your carry to the one knife you feel most comfortable using and carrying everywhere would be a good step in the right direction. I carry a number of different knives and rotation and it occurs to me, that in a real life or death situation adjusting to tip upward tip down carry the little subtleties from knife to knife with slow me down a bit over carrying one knife consistently like I did back in the beginning when I only had one knife.

[clovisc]

i agree with you completely, greencobra -- no fancy stuff. if i were physically threatened, grabbed, choked, etc., my first line of defense would certainly be the very basic, fast, efficient empty-hand SD techniques i drill in daily... the kinds of things common to most forms of martial arts.

yet if for whatever reason i were unable to break a hold or grab using what i know, i could certainly see using a knife (especially a small hawkbill like the merlin) to pry fingers loose, or inflict enough shock to confuse my opponent so that i could RUN. hope that NEVER happens, though.

although really -- anyone's first line of defense should be COMMUNICATION. i've gotten out of quite a LOT of bad spots just by talking.

[HoB]

I am not "into" SD much but I would really hate being on the wrong side of a Yo or the Karambit. The Karambit would be my first choice really. Especially when you are grabbed, it is a really nasty meat hook and you can defend quite well with the blade back down, too.

[clovisc]

druid -- very true. the best knife to use in an emergency SD situation would be the one you feel most comfortable with.

however -- for SD applications, it's best to have a SD-only knife... something kept as sharp as possible, dedicated to emergency situations that hopefully will never happen.

iv -- also very true. a critical part of understanding a martial art is understanding the difference between the martial, and the ART. true, greencobra, hung gar, like many branches of martial arts, has lots of very long, detailed, beautiful, intricate forms with tiny nuances and funny names such as "single fingertip holding up heaven." yet it's made VERY clear that these are things you would NEVER use in an emergency SD situation. for self defense, we, like many and most martial artists, train every day over and over and over and over again in very expedient, efficient, SIMPLE techniques until they become instinctive. (i'm not going to try to fend off an assailant with "nobel tiger climbs into the clouds" -- i'm more likely to just kick a knee and run!!!) we experiment with mock worst-case scenarios to prepare us -- these emphasize neutralization and escape. for "fighting," if you want to do learn to do it, there's sparring...

[greencobra]

yet if for whatever reason i were unable to break a hold or grab using what i know, i could certainly see using a knife (especially a small hawkbill like the merlin) to pry fingers loose, or inflict enough shock to confuse my opponent so that i could RUN. hope that NEVER happens, though.

I guess where we differ my friend is I wouldn't let the encounter be happening that long. As soon as I was grabbed and I identified the danger, the knife would come out. No trying to to fight off the perp. **** man, it's them or you!


And to my esteemed SpyderColleague, i.v, I do understand where you're at with this. Although I do not believe the majority of people who go through this martial art training have the mental fortitude to remember their training. Maybe a better way to put it is, in the heat of a confrontation, you can have all the index holes in the world on your weapon, but it won't do a bit of good while you're getting pummeled because that's not what's going to be on your mind at the time. Also i.v, I have no doubt that you, just coming from your military service, would have any problem defending yourself.

I'm with Jim on this. I will not put myself in a situation like that. If I am, you can bet I'm armed with a handgun. I will end a conflict where my life, or someone elses, is in mortal danger. I did say mortal.

[i.v]

greencobra my friend, sadly, your point is very true as most people don't have a backround in martial arts or don't have enough backround.
i agree that the best way out is communication or escape, but it is very important to at least learn how keep a clear & focused mind in these situations, our mind is our most powerful weapon & if we can use it, we'll prevail\survive.

[greencobra]

greencobra my friend, sadly, your point is very true as most people don't have a backround in martial arts or don't have enough backround.
i agree that the best way out is communication or escape, but it is very important to at least learn how keep a clear & focused mind in these situations, our mind is our most powerful weapon & if we can use it, we'll prevail\survive.

Very true i.v

[clovisc]

:D :eek: :D okay -- so anyway...

what spydies do people keep reserved for self-defense?

i asked this question mostly because i was interested in seeing which knives OTHER than the knives specifically designed for SD (chinook, scorpius, matriarch, yojimbo, civillian, etc...) people might maintain as self defense tools.

[greencobra]

:D :eek: :D okay -- so anyway...

what spydies do people keep reserved for self-defense?

Very sorry clovisc, I didn't mean to hi jack your thread.

[davec]

I think I'd want something with a little more reach like a Louisville Slugger or even a machete for self defense. Or maybe one of those Asp batons.
As a last ditch sd knife probably the Manix or the Spyderfly.

[clovisc]

heh -- no problem, greencobra! :p

:D yea -- i know very well that if given the choice, we would all choose M1A1 tanks or flamethrowers or chainsaws... but as this is a spyderco knife forum, i'm interested in learning about people and their knives... especially :spyder: 's... :D

[WORKER#9]

But Short Of This Any Knife You Use For Sd You Must Feel Comfortable With, And It Must Be Strong And You Must Be Ready If Not You Are Just Bringing A Weapon Into A Situation Where Maybe There Was Not One Before, Consider Your Knife May Be Taken Away And Used Against You. If You Choose To Carry A Knife For Sd When The Time Comes You Must Be Ruthless And Prepared. Make No Mistake Attack With Force And Failure Is Not An Option. Sd Is Serious Business, Prepare And Train And It May Work When The Time Comes But Murphys Law Is Always Present When Your Under Extreme Pressure. My First Choice Is In The Picture Everything Else I Train For. #9

[Dr. Snubnose]

To answer your question is easy..picking from the knives you have mentioned, put the Chinook in your pocket and you are good to go...If that one is too heavy for you buy a Yojimbo or Ronin...Doc

[clovisc]

ack! okay -- deep breath... let me rephrase my question before i give up on this thread completely...!!! :D

dear spyderco people -- which spyderco knives do YOU own and maintain as SD knives?

i'm especially interested in which knives OTHER than chinook/yojimbo/ronin/civi/matriarch people might choose as THEIR own, PERSONAL SD knife!!

(i've got mine -- this is about you!!!!)

if this doesn't work, i surrender!

[Dr. Snubnose]

For me it's the Ronin, Yojimbo and Chinook and sometimes the Vesuvius...Doc