Endura, Delica, Para2/3 New Design

[Luso1143]

Hey everyone,

New to the forum so my apologies if this was already addressed.

The phrase "if it's not broken don't fix it" can be applied to Spyderco all day, their designs are proven to be as good as it gets, however....it's the improvement philosophy that keeps them relevant against new companies/ designs, their CQI, etc.

Therefore my question is: Will we see/ do we need any new improvements/ new designs or updates on models that are almost as good as they can get such as Para, Delica, Endura, Native, etc?

Being a graphic designer I keep on wishing for more designs from Sal & Eric with new materials, etc, however will it ever come to reality?

Cheers

R.

[Michael Janich]

Dear Luso1143:

Welcome to the Spyderco Forum.

Stay safe,

Mike

[JRinFL]

Welcome aboard!

I'm no expert, nor do I have inside information, but is seems that the most likely time to see new designs of older models is when the FRN molds have worn out and Spyderco needs to replace them. That seems like the best time to refresh the design since all new molds are required.

[derangedhermit]

For "mature" models, my guess is it's driven more by sales volume than anything else. When the "base" version (e.g. Endura 4) and variations in blade steel, scales, etc no longer generate enough market excitement to meet sales expectations, it's time to either discontinue the product or introduce a new version ("Endura 5").

It's risky to substantially change a very successful ("cash cow") model when introducing its successor, so the design space is much more open with new models.

[p_atrick]

That seems like the best time to refresh the design since all new molds are required.

I wonder about this. How much real-world data does Spyderco have on their liner-less Salt designs? Is this enough to justify moving the entire production over to this setup? There must be enough data out there to say if this was a flawed design. Since these knives are still in production (and the S2XL has been liner-less from the start), it seems like Spyderco is happy with this design. Of course, this could be wildly unpopular with the consumers.

[JRinFL]

That seems like the best time to refresh the design since all new molds are required.

I wonder about this. How much real-world data does Spyderco have on their liner-less Salt designs? Is this enough to justify moving the entire production over to this setup? There must be enough data out there to say if this was a flawed design. Since these knives are still in production (and the S2XL has been liner-less from the start), it seems like Spyderco is happy with this design. Of course, this could be wildly unpopular with the consumers.

Since I have no real data I have to guess at this based on a couple of decades of reading the forums, but I think most users like the in-hand feel of the models with liners. The preceding comment is: Not scientific, easily influenced by my own prejudices, YMMV, past performance does not guarantee future earnings, more opinion than fact, etc. etc.

[Mushroom]

I just want to point out that CQI is not exclusive to Spyderco and they did not invent the concept. It is a standard practice in the design industry.

I don’t know what exactly would initiate an update to certain models but I imagine sales do play a role in those decisions.

Using the Military Model and Military 2 for example, Spyderco decided to update (or improve) some features of the Military Model by utilizing some of the features from their wildly popular Paramilitary 2. Spyderco has their reasons for doing such but those reasons are not exactly public knowledge. For the time being, we can only speculate.

[sal]

Hi Luso,

Any of the improvements / CQi / Kaizen are generally carried out when Eric and I decide to do so. We study the product, the market, the forums and the ELU's (End Line User) thoughts regarding the models.

As was mentioned, ELU's personal preferences are carefully thought out, but may not apply to the general market. That's one of the advantages of Exclusives in that they cater more to appearance.

There are also manufacturing limitations, such as liners in salts.

As designers, we also appreciate the thoughts of other designers as well. But please keep in mind that function always caries more weight than appearance.

sal

BTW, I sure wish you guys would list your locations. It helps me understand much.

[tonijedi]

Bem-vindo!

BTW, I sure wish you guys would list your locations. It helps me understand much.

From the username I'd say Luso is from Portugal.

[sal]

I sure wish you guys would list your locations.

sal

[apollo]

Hi Luso,

Any of the improvements / CQi / Kaizen are generally carried out when Eric and I decide to do so. We study the product, the market, the forums and the ELU's (End Line User) thoughts regarding the models.

As was mentioned, ELU's personal preferences are carefully thought out, but may not apply to the general market. That's one of the advantages of Exclusives in that they cater more to appearance.

There are also manufacturing limitations, such as liners in salts.

As designers, we also appreciate the thoughts of other designers as well. But please keep in mind that function always caries more weight than appearance.

sal

BTW, I sure wish you guys would list your locations. It helps me understand much.

Sal does this also means that Spyderco learns from the exclusives there special appearances to use those or similar colors , steels and coatings in the normal in house sprints in the future?

[Luso1143]

Thank you for all the replies, quite awsome to see the excitement over future possibilities.

I have read that the creators from time to time would show up in our conversations but never thought they would be so present..quite astonishing really how close they are to their base, that's what makes spyderco so special in my opinion.

I been looking into the "ways" people alter they spyderco's to personalize and in a way change some design points, the skinny scales, the micartas, backspacers etc for me it's an amazing show of appreciation to the original design and the attempt to make it "better".

This question came to my mind since I saw exactly what -nick mentioned about the Military and the compression lock, after seeing that I thought "what could I change In this design?" Delica for ex. and after a lot of sketches that's when I ended up with "how could you change a design/ would it be necessary and when?"

I'm finishing a tour in Iceland and freezing my butt off and after 12 days I only brought 1 knife , the Pacific Salt...and I must say everytime it's used in the kitchen, preparing fish, etc people gravitate towards it and are blown away with it..so am I.

Cheers

Luso from Portugal

[sal]

Hi Luso,

Thanx much for adding your location. I hope more join in my request.

sal

[Rinzler]

Hi Luso,

Thanx much for adding your location. I hope more join in my request.

sal

I use mobile. Could someone please explain how to list location? I’m not seeing anything.

[harpo1]

Hi Luso,

Thanx much for adding your location. I hope more join in my request.

sal

I use mobile. Could someone please explain how to list location? I’m not seeing anything.

I'm not sure if it's the same as mobile but on the desktop. Click on your profile name then user control panel and you'll find the option in there.

[Bill1170]

Hi Luso,

Thanx much for adding your location. I hope more join in my request.

sal

I use mobile. Could someone please explain how to list location? I’m not seeing anything.

I'm not sure if it's the same as mobile but on the desktop. Click on your profile name then user control panel and you'll find the option in there.

It works the same in mobile. I’m in Southern California. The option to edit your profile is just right of your online handle (screen name).

[James Y]

When I'm browsing the forum on my phone, location doesn't appear. It's one of a few things that doesn't show on my phone. Whereas when browsing on my iPad, I see the location (which in my case is Southern CA).

Jim

[Wartstein]

When I'm browsing the forum on my phone, location doesn't appear. It's one of a few things that doesn't show on my phone. Whereas when browsing on my iPad, I see the location (which in my case is Southern CA).

Jim

Weird.
I am on my mobile phone right now snd when I click on your (user)name I do see your location in your profile... I have a pretty old and crappy Android phone btw. Maybe you have an i phone and it does not work with Apple?

[James Y]

When I'm browsing the forum on my phone, location doesn't appear. It's one of a few things that doesn't show on my phone. Whereas when browsing on my iPad, I see the location (which in my case is Southern CA).

Jim

Weird.
I am on my mobile phone right now snd when I click on your (user)name I do see your location in your profile... I have a pretty old and crappy Android phone btw. Maybe you have an i phone and it does not work with Apple?

Hi, Wartstein. I'm talking about when I'm just reading someone's post in a thread. On my phone, when reading someone's post, the part to the far right that says how many posts, the date they joined, and their location does not show, even if I hold my phone horizontally. But it shows on my iPad. Of course, if I decide to actually click on the person's screen name (which I've only done very rarely, when doing PMs), I can see their profile on my phone. It has to do with the screen size on my phone, vs on my iPad.

Jim

[Brotherscinc0]

The liner less FRN knives seem strong enough and have great action. I don't think the design would translate over to the standard offerings, but in a few years it might. The community does seem to enjoy the light weight models quite a bit