Towards my first SE Spyderco

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.
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Evil D
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Evil D » Wed Jan 26, 2022 5:32 am

The points are not very hard to mellow out, but if the ridges are thick they make the sharpening feel "bumpier" as the blade moves over the rods and will force you to have to go slower. If I had a choice I would rather start with sharper points but thinner ridges, as opposed to thick ridges and mellow points. My Rock Jumper retained fairly sharp teeth (well, vs a new knife and vs my Caribbean) but it doesn't snag and it slices really well because the blade grind is pretty thin.
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Matus
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Matus » Wed Jan 26, 2022 6:06 am

I am definitely taking this into consideration. Right now the Endela and Caribbean are the main candidates for a locking SE blade followed by the LC Pacific. If the Caribbean had a little thinner stock it would be easier for me to take the plunge.
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Wartstein » Wed Jan 26, 2022 6:17 am

Matus wrote:
Wed Jan 26, 2022 6:06 am
I am definitely taking this into consideration. Right now the Endela and Caribbean are the main candidates for a locking SE blade followed by the LC Pacific. If the Caribbean had a little thinner stock it would be easier for me to take the plunge.
On the flipside the Caribbean has a rather tall blade, right? This - and the tapering, of which I don't know how it's done - could make up for the thicker stock.

Tough choice though: As said, I think the Caribbean serrations must be even better than the Endelas, but the Endela SE certainly will give you a perfect "SE experience": already: If you don't like how the Endela SE blade cuts, SE generally is not for you.
Otherwise the Endela is very close to the Manix LW in weight (just 4 grams "heavier") and cutting edge (about 2 mm more), but a lot slimmer in carry. And you never tried the Endela/Endura platform...

But on the other hand: You had a Caribbean already, and if you liked it well enough you know what you're getting but PLUS perfect serrations...
Top three going by pocket-time (update April 22):
- EDC: Manix 2 LW in REX 45 , Endela SE in VG10, stainless steel handle Endura in VG10 (hollow grind)
- Mountains/outdoors: Salt 2 SE in LC200N, Pac.Salt 1 SE in H1, Endura in VG10 (Micarta scales).

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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby dsvirsky » Wed Jan 26, 2022 9:55 am

Don't let the thickness of the blade stock deter you from the sheepsfoot Caribbean. In my experience, it outperforms the UKPK Salt, which, as I've previously noted, is a very good slicer (I have both profiled to 15° with just the barest minimum of a bevel on the reverse side).

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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Matus » Wed Jan 26, 2022 10:15 am

I have not cut much carboard when I had de PE leaf Caribbean, but since the stock is nearly as thick as the PM2, I expect similar friction/wedging than what PM2 does (with carboard in mind where these 2 parameters cause the most resistance)
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby dsvirsky » Wed Jan 26, 2022 10:54 am

Guess that depends on how you cut the cardboard. If you're push cutting with a PE knife, yes, a thicker blade will have more issues with friction/wedging. However, with an SE knife, I slice the cardboard, drawing the blade roughly parallel to the material being cut, and thickness at the spine never becomes relevant. On that note, the SE PM3 LW also works very well, with the blade shape contributing to its effectiveness in slicing cardboard.

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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Evil D » Wed Jan 26, 2022 12:50 pm

Matus wrote:
Wed Jan 26, 2022 10:15 am
I have not cut much carboard when I had de PE leaf Caribbean, but since the stock is nearly as thick as the PM2, I expect similar friction/wedging than what PM2 does (with carboard in mind where these 2 parameters cause the most resistance)


I think it does pretty ok 😉


https://youtu.be/R4i-d4HrV0g
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Matus » Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:02 pm

Yeah, could be worse 😁
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Matus » Fri Jan 28, 2022 8:42 am

OK, if everything goes well, then the last new online available Ark SE should be on the way to my friend in SA who will then send it my way. I have nearly ignored the knife as I was not really aware of its existence, but since it was mentioned in this thread I gave it a closer look and realized that it is super cool and I had to have one :)

But this SE story is not going to end there most likely, so I need to ask ...
Evil D wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:25 am
Image
... what made you pick the sheepsfoot over the leaf? Do you in general prefer the blade shape, or do you find that it is more useful with SE?
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Evil D » Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:15 am

Matus wrote:
Fri Jan 28, 2022 8:42 am
OK, if everything goes well, then the last new online available Ark SE should be on the way to my friend in SA who will then send it my way. I have nearly ignored the knife as I was not really aware of its existence, but since it was mentioned in this thread I gave it a closer look and realized that it is super cool and I had to have one :)

But this SE story is not going to end there most likely, so I need to ask ...
Evil D wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:25 am
Image
... what made you pick the sheepsfoot over the leaf? Do you in general prefer the blade shape, or do you find that it is more useful with SE?



It has just a slight amount of belly and I prefer that over a lot of belly. I find them easier to sharpen especially with serrations and especially towards the tip. I definitely wouldn't say the leaf is difficult to work with or anything like that. I also like the lower point on the blade, for the same reason a Yojimbo 2 has a wharnie blade, they maintain a lot of cutting power at the tip of the blade throughout the arc motion of a cut. I reprofiled the spine down to a point because I sometimes need to make holes in things at work and for the outside chance of me needing it for self defense, I do encounter dogs a lot at my job.


The ARK is in a league of it's own. It's the thinnest edge on any SE knife that I'm aware of, and since the edge itself is chisel ground it likely has the thinnest inclusive edge angle of any Spyderco knife, I bet even thinner at the edge than a Nilakka. It's the only one I've had that didn't need reprofiled and the one I'm actually hesitant to do any hard cutting with because the edge is so thin.
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Matus » Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:23 am

Thanks a lot for the explanation on the Caribbean!

Yeah, the thinness of the edge is what made the Ark attractive to try out. And also - it is legal here in DE since it is a fixed blade with edge length under 12 cm :) I indeed don't plan to make any hard cutting with it, but I am super curios about it. I would definitely prefer if it were a LITTLE larger (just that one can get 4 fingers on the grip and maybe a tiny bit little longer blade), but I first need to get my hands on this little one.
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby ladybug93 » Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:26 am

some other reasons the sheepsfoot caribbean is great (that i actually learned from talking to evil d):

- the opening hole sits higher and is not obscured by the handle at all in the closed position. the leaf model hole is slightly covered by the scales.

- the blade on the sheepsfoot is very slightly longer than the blade on the leaf model.

- the tip of the sheepsfoot sits lower in the handle than the tip of the leaf model.


these are minor differences, but they are differences. the most important difference is the one david mentioned. personally, i prefer the more subtle belly for my se knives as well. i carry an se blade on my at all times as a heavy duty cutter, but more importantly as an emergency blade. if i ever have to cut my five kids out of seatbelts, i need something that will work fast without slipping off of the material. for that reason, i carry teeth and i carry them in a blade profile that provides extreme cutting power throughout the cut. that's why you won't find me without either a pacific salt h1 se or a caribbean sheepsfoot se on me at all times.
C101GBN2, MT35, C211TI, C242CF, C217GSSF, C101BN2, C85G2, C91BBK, C142G, LBK, LYL3HB, C193, C28YL2, C11ZPGYD, C41YL5, C252G, C130G, PLKIT1

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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Matus » Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:52 am

ladybug93 wrote:
Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:26 am
some other reasons the sheepsfoot caribbean is great (that i actually learned from talking to evil d):
...
Thank you. I will give a closer look to both Caribbean variants. In the mean time, I am letting my imagination and Powerpoint skills to run wild :zany

I am kind of liking the last one best so far. People keep talking about how they miss serrated Stretch - I have just added a compression lock to it :savouring
Caribbean_mockup.JPG
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby ladybug93 » Fri Jan 28, 2022 10:10 am

i fully intended to give my sheepsfoot caribbean the evil d pointy treatment. when i got it in hand though, it just made more sense to keep the blunt tip. for emergency purposes, it's much safer. for marine environments, it's much safer. if i get stopped by police and they think the blade is longer than it should be, the sheepsfoot looks more like a justifiable safety/rescue tool than a murdery knife. and, if i still need to stab something, all it takes is a little more force and/or a slightly different angle.
C101GBN2, MT35, C211TI, C242CF, C217GSSF, C101BN2, C85G2, C91BBK, C142G, LBK, LYL3HB, C193, C28YL2, C11ZPGYD, C41YL5, C252G, C130G, PLKIT1

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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Matus » Fri Jan 28, 2022 10:22 am

Yeah, for that kind of purpose the blunt tip makes a lot of sense and most likely similar reason led to this particular design.

I tend to think that for a longer sweeping cuts the little more belly on the leaf may be beneficial as I imagine the cutting motion to be a slicing motion, rather than push-cutting. I guess I need to have a closer look how I cut and take it from there. The edge profile on the leaf is not that much different than PM2 (a knife I use a lot)
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby ladybug93 » Fri Jan 28, 2022 10:31 am

if you haven't yet, look at the video in which michael janich describes the purpose behind using a wharncliffe blade. as david mentioned, the sheepsfoot caribbean basically gives you the benefits of a wharncliffe and still has the benefits of a slight belly. david has coined the term "sheepscliffe" to describe this blade shape. it's proven to be a very effective blade in my use.
C101GBN2, MT35, C211TI, C242CF, C217GSSF, C101BN2, C85G2, C91BBK, C142G, LBK, LYL3HB, C193, C28YL2, C11ZPGYD, C41YL5, C252G, C130G, PLKIT1

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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Matus » Fri Jan 28, 2022 11:04 am

Just found it - I am off to educate myself.
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Wartstein » Fri Jan 28, 2022 11:54 am

Evil D wrote:
Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:15 am
Matus wrote:
Fri Jan 28, 2022 8:42 am
Evil D wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:25 am
It has just a slight amount of belly and I prefer that over a lot of belly. I find them easier to sharpen especially with serrations .....

May I ask: Why "especially with serrations"?

In my experience belly or not does matter a lot LESS in serrated knives than in PE knives, where one (with PE knives) has to tilt the blade in order to follow the curve of the belly when sharpening?
Top three going by pocket-time (update April 22):
- EDC: Manix 2 LW in REX 45 , Endela SE in VG10, stainless steel handle Endura in VG10 (hollow grind)
- Mountains/outdoors: Salt 2 SE in LC200N, Pac.Salt 1 SE in H1, Endura in VG10 (Micarta scales).

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Evil D
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Evil D » Fri Jan 28, 2022 12:13 pm

Wartstein wrote:
Fri Jan 28, 2022 11:54 am
Evil D wrote:
Fri Jan 28, 2022 9:15 am
Matus wrote:
Fri Jan 28, 2022 8:42 am
Evil D wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:25 am
It has just a slight amount of belly and I prefer that over a lot of belly. I find them easier to sharpen especially with serrations .....

May I ask: Why "especially with serrations"?

In my experience belly or not does matter a lot LESS in serrated knives than in PE knives, where one (with PE knives) has to tilt the blade in order to follow the curve of the belly when sharpening?



I just find it's easier to maintain the right angle with straighter edges even though the serrations are all ground the same angle or orientation on the blade and, it just seems like I always have issues with upswept blade bellies. It seems like they're even ground at a different angle but it's more likely something to do with my own consistency.
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Re: Towards my first SE Spyderco

Postby Matus » Wed Mar 23, 2022 12:53 am

OK, a little update needed - the Ark my friend in SA has helped me to order does not seem to want to arrive (it has been 4 weeks) and there is nothing but silence around the Ayoob SE. This situation together with that 'gardening knife thread' finally pushed over the edge and now I have a Pacific SE H1 with yellow handle incoming ...
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