Three questions.

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.
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Evil D
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Re: Three questions.

Postby Evil D » Mon Jan 24, 2022 3:43 pm

yablanowitz wrote:
Mon Jan 24, 2022 3:35 pm
Yep, just ribbing you a little. Whittling means something different to me than it does to some people. I'm not a big fan of the Native platform, at least until you get to the Chief. As I see it, the question is less "should it be changed?" and more "is it economically feasible to make expensive new molds at this time?"


I do use the term a little too loosely.

I always like seeing those chains. Those are so cool.
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Xformer
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Re: Three questions.

Postby Xformer » Mon Jan 24, 2022 7:29 pm

yablanowitz wrote:
Mon Jan 24, 2022 3:35 pm
Yep, just ribbing you a little. Whittling means something different to me than it does to some people. I'm not a big fan of the Native platform, at least until you get to the Chief. As I see it, the question is less "should it be changed?" and more "is it economically feasible to make expensive new molds at this time?"
But why making it so blocky in the first place ?

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Re: Three questions.

Postby yablanowitz » Mon Jan 24, 2022 7:38 pm

At a guess, I'd say because the blocky U.S. version sold better than the rounded 3d Japanese version. Just spitballin'.

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Evil D
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Re: Three questions.

Postby Evil D » Tue Jan 25, 2022 8:07 am

I originally uploaded this pic in 2018...this question has been ongoing for quite some time.


Image


That's a Spyderhawk on the left, Maxamet Native 5 on the right.
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nerdlock
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Re: Three questions.

Postby nerdlock » Tue Jan 25, 2022 8:31 am

Fair question regarding the N5 blockiness.

I do agree that we all have different tolerances in regards to handle/scale comfort, but I firmly belong to the "blocky enough to be uncomfortable for an extended period of usage" camp. I think that's what's turning me off from the N5 LW series. I only have 1 in my collection and it's one of my least used Spydercos. I can definitely feel the blockiness especially when gripping the N5 firmly.

I don't have the original Native, but looking at pics, it seems to be slightly more chamfered/rounded at the edges compared to the N5. I don't really understand the design ethos but it seems to me like a downgrade. The N5 has good ergonomics which to me, could have been made perfect with more rounded edges.

The Para3 LW despite its flaws, to me remains one of the top ergonomic knives Spyderco has ever produced and I think is a good improvement in comfort over the G-10 version due to the rounded edges.

That said, Seki FRN and G-10 for me are the champs with regards to comfort due to their edge chamfering.
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Re: Three questions.

Postby ladybug93 » Tue Jan 25, 2022 12:29 pm

the real issue for me with the n5lw is the thick blade. a thinker blade means a more difficult cut, which means you have to grip and push on your knife harder. i bet less people would notice the blackness as much if the blade was thinner like the delica, or if it had kept the hollow grind it was born with.
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Xformer
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Re: Three questions.

Postby Xformer » Tue Jan 25, 2022 3:57 pm

ladybug93 wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 12:29 pm
the real issue for me with the n5lw is the thick blade. a thinker blade means a more difficult cut, which means you have to grip and push on your knife harder. i bet less people would notice the blackness as much if the blade was thinner like the delica, or if it had kept the hollow grind it was born with.
Nah, I'm one of the biggest fan of the Native 5 and I feel the blade is PERFECT in any senses. It's one of the rare Spyderco blade I find beautiful and one I don't fear snapping in half.

The blockiness can be felt even with light use. It sticks out in terms of ergo. It's not dramatic, but once you've held a Para 3 LW, you can't look back and start dreaming about a CQI N5 LW with rounded angles. It also stick out visually, making the knife more cumberstome and massive than it feels.

I read a post from Sal about how making it thinner would take a lot of time/work since it would impact the design.

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Re: Three questions.

Postby ladybug93 » Tue Jan 25, 2022 4:02 pm

i understand how you feel because the blade is only too thick for me compared to other blades. even the manix, which is my favorite, feels like a better slicer because it's a taller blade. knives that are actually thinner though, like the astute, cut so much better than a native that the native feels like the less premium of the two.
keep your knife sharp and your focus sharper.
current collection:
C101GBN2, MT35, C211TI, C242CF, C217GSSF, C101BN2, C85G2, C91BBK, C142G, LBK, LYL3HB, C193, C28YL2, C11ZPGYD, C41YL5, C252G, C130G, PLKIT1

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Re: Three questions.

Postby Ramonade » Tue Jan 25, 2022 4:19 pm

Xformer wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 3:57 pm
ladybug93 wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 12:29 pm
the real issue for me with the n5lw is the thick blade. a thinker blade means a more difficult cut, which means you have to grip and push on your knife harder. i bet less people would notice the blackness as much if the blade was thinner like the delica, or if it had kept the hollow grind it was born with.
Nah, I'm one of the biggest fan of the Native 5 and I feel the blade is PERFECT in any senses. It's one of the rare Spyderco blade I find beautiful and one I don't fear snapping in half.

The blockiness can be felt even with light use. It sticks out in terms of ergo. It's not dramatic, but once you've held a Para 3 LW, you can't look back and start dreaming about a CQI N5 LW with rounded angles. It also stick out visually, making the knife more cumberstome and massive than it feels.

I read a post from Sal about how making it thinner would take a lot of time/work since it would impact the design.
I would be all for a thinner Native 5 since my most carried other than this design are the Chaparral, Watu and Centofante III. However, I would be more enclined to join Xformer on this since the N5 (LW or not) is a knife I've used for almost any task and it performed really well every time. I've only noticed that it's not the best at slicing cardboard, even at 15 dps. But eh, a box cutter is fit for that job :cheap-sunglasses .
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Xformer
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Re: Three questions.

Postby Xformer » Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:19 pm

Ramonade wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 4:19 pm
Xformer wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 3:57 pm
ladybug93 wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 12:29 pm
the real issue for me with the n5lw is the thick blade. a thinker blade means a more difficult cut, which means you have to grip and push on your knife harder. i bet less people would notice the blackness as much if the blade was thinner like the delica, or if it had kept the hollow grind it was born with.
Nah, I'm one of the biggest fan of the Native 5 and I feel the blade is PERFECT in any senses. It's one of the rare Spyderco blade I find beautiful and one I don't fear snapping in half.

The blockiness can be felt even with light use. It sticks out in terms of ergo. It's not dramatic, but once you've held a Para 3 LW, you can't look back and start dreaming about a CQI N5 LW with rounded angles. It also stick out visually, making the knife more cumberstome and massive than it feels.

I read a post from Sal about how making it thinner would take a lot of time/work since it would impact the design.
I would be all for a thinner Native 5 since my most carried other than this design are the Chaparral, Watu and Centofante III. However, I would be more enclined to join Xformer on this since the N5 (LW or not) is a knife I've used for almost any task and it performed really well every time. I've only noticed that it's not the best at slicing cardboard, even at 15 dps. But eh, a box cutter is fit for that job :cheap-sunglasses .
Many people on the forum are fans of very thin blade and hollow grinds. I vastly prefer a versatile blade that feels strong. The native 5 blade is exactly that to me : a blade I can use hard in many ways, not just to finely cut paper or cardboards. Plus, it's very good looking, the lines are perfect.

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Re: Three questions.

Postby ladybug93 » Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:31 pm

i'm not opposed to a thick blade. i enjoy carrying and using a 4max scout, which is much thicker. for such a short blade though, the native is quite thick. i would expect smaller knives to be slicier than the native is. i'm not saying it's wrong, but i don't enjoy it as much for edc. i'm more likely to use it while camping, but i have better options for that as well. for me, the native sits in a weird in-between place and doesn't get carried much because of other knives i prefer.

when it comes to ergos, i think the native is great. for me, it's second only to the manix, which i find perfect. it's funny how different we all are. you like the blade thickness and i don't care for it. i have no problem with the handle and some people think it feels like a lego brick.

side note: i tried to carry the native salt into lego land once. they do not think it's a lego and the "security" at the gate freaked out. "this is why we're here!" is what they said to me, beaming with pride for stopping yet another freedom-loving american from being a threat to absolutely no one.
keep your knife sharp and your focus sharper.
current collection:
C101GBN2, MT35, C211TI, C242CF, C217GSSF, C101BN2, C85G2, C91BBK, C142G, LBK, LYL3HB, C193, C28YL2, C11ZPGYD, C41YL5, C252G, C130G, PLKIT1

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nerdlock
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Re: Three questions.

Postby nerdlock » Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:53 pm

Xformer wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 3:57 pm
ladybug93 wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 12:29 pm
the real issue for me with the n5lw is the thick blade. a thinker blade means a more difficult cut, which means you have to grip and push on your knife harder. i bet less people would notice the blackness as much if the blade was thinner like the delica, or if it had kept the hollow grind it was born with.
Nah, I'm one of the biggest fan of the Native 5 and I feel the blade is PERFECT in any senses. It's one of the rare Spyderco blade I find beautiful and one I don't fear snapping in half.

The blockiness can be felt even with light use. It sticks out in terms of ergo. It's not dramatic, but once you've held a Para 3 LW, you can't look back and start dreaming about a CQI N5 LW with rounded angles. It also stick out visually, making the knife more cumberstome and massive than it feels.

I read a post from Sal about how making it thinner would take a lot of time/work since it would impact the design.

Exactly my sentiments. I hope the next iteration of the Native will have rounded scales, even not to the extent of the Para3 LW, but rounded nonetheless.
VG10:S30V:S35VN:S45VN:SPY27:LC200N:4V:MagnaCut:XHP:204P:M390:20CV:Cru-Wear:Z-Wear:M4:Rex-45:K390:S90V:Z-Max:Maxamet

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nerdlock
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Re: Three questions.

Postby nerdlock » Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:55 pm

Evil D wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 8:07 am
I originally uploaded this pic in 2018...this question has been ongoing for quite some time.


Image


That's a Spyderhawk on the left, Maxamet Native 5 on the right.

I missed this post because the pic wouldn't load, but it's better now. Thanks for the comparison shot, D. The contrast between both edges are dramatic.
VG10:S30V:S35VN:S45VN:SPY27:LC200N:4V:MagnaCut:XHP:204P:M390:20CV:Cru-Wear:Z-Wear:M4:Rex-45:K390:S90V:Z-Max:Maxamet


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