Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

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archangel
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby archangel » Sat Jan 22, 2022 2:41 pm

Thanks Sir!
Michael
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby Barmoley » Sat Jan 22, 2022 5:36 pm

Interesting that you guys have good results sharpening these. I haven’t been successful so far using diamond stones of various types. Also, one of my larger knives took a bent to the blade. I didn’t know it could happen and I am very surprised it did. The blade was straight when I got it and was in my knife block. Couple of days ago I saw that someone jammed a smaller steel knife in the same slot, so I was worried that the steel knife might crack the ceramic. When I took the rahven out I’ve noticed that the blade now is bowing, has a bent to it. I don’t know how to straighten it without breaking.

The mule in it would be good and hopefully thicker as these are too flexible for my liking. Also, I hope mules come very sharp from the factory. Rahvens were ok sharp, but not as sharp as I like. My friend also ordered a set and his are not sharp enough to cut tomatoes cleanly, so that’s not good.

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Fireman
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby Fireman » Sat Jan 22, 2022 8:27 pm

There are many collectors now that would take up a lot of the purchases. I wonder how many miles would be made. The next question is what knives after that? Spyderco can sell a bunch of “Salt” knives to recoup the tooling and R&D costs. Sheepsfoot blade sailor knives would be cool. A ceramic waterway? Bow River?
Last edited by Fireman on Sat Jan 22, 2022 8:39 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby LakeOconee » Sat Jan 22, 2022 8:33 pm

Yes, also in at $150, either 1 or 2, whichever is the limit.
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Fireman
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby Fireman » Sat Jan 22, 2022 8:36 pm

Barmoley wrote:
Sat Jan 22, 2022 5:36 pm
Interesting that you guys have good results sharpening these. I haven’t been successful so far using diamond stones of various types. Also, one of my larger knives took a bent to the blade. I didn’t know it could happen and I am very surprised it did. The blade was straight when I got it and was in my knife block. Couple of days ago I saw that someone jammed a smaller steel knife in the same slot, so I was worried that the steel knife might crack the ceramic. When I took the rahven out I’ve noticed that the blade now is bowing, has a bent to it. I don’t know how to straighten it without breaking.

The mule in it would be good and hopefully thicker as these are too flexible for my liking. Also, I hope mules come very sharp from the factory. Rahvens were ok sharp, but not as sharp as I like. My friend also ordered a set and his are not sharp enough to cut tomatoes cleanly, so that’s not good.

Sharpening this material is going to have a learning curve and the right tools. I am going to look into getting 1/2 micron diamond paste or spray to get hair popping sharp. The good thing is you won’t need to sharpen that often. Perhaps there can be someone or some company that will provide a sharpening service for these knives.
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sal
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby sal » Sat Jan 22, 2022 10:37 pm

I have been most impressed with the sharing of knowledge in this sub forum. I'm betting that some will learn a better way and share. When I spoke wit the factory making the blades, she said that they use a diamond belt, That's a good bit of knowledge. I believe we'll teach each other to do it or some will do it and offer it as a service. This is new territory for all of us so we have to assume there will be a learning curve. "We will go where no humans have gone before", Ceramic Mule Team.

sal

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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby Fireman » Sat Jan 22, 2022 11:03 pm

Sal, so are these manufactured in Switzerland?
These mules will make for an amazing light backpack knives.
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby Barmoley » Sun Jan 23, 2022 1:36 am

The material definitely has potential. We just need to figure out an effective way to sharpen these. It is not straight forward and everything gets dull. I tried 1 micron on a leather strop and had very little success. Also tried vitrified diamond stones and edge pro matrix with wd40. Strop and Edge pro matrix were recommended by Roman who helped develop this material for knives. It is good to hear that some of you had success, gives me hope.

Really looking forward to a mule with a stiffer blade. Also hope there will be enough made to be able to get one. Maybe higher price and it not being a steel will make it easier.

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Fireman
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby Fireman » Sun Jan 23, 2022 2:37 am

was your 1 micron a diamond abrasive?
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby Toucan » Sun Jan 23, 2022 3:07 am

sal wrote:
Sat Jan 22, 2022 1:37 pm
Hi Michael,

Could be in the $150 range. Tooling is very expensive as is part cost.

sal
It seems like a shame to invest in expensive tooling for a limited run. Especially considering how novel the material is, is there any chance on this being a continuously produced model?

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archangel
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby archangel » Sun Jan 23, 2022 3:23 am

sal wrote:
Sat Jan 22, 2022 10:37 pm
I have been most impressed with the sharing of knowledge in this sub forum. I'm betting that some will learn a better way and share. When I spoke wit the factory making the blades, she said that they use a diamond belt, That's a good bit of knowledge. I believe we'll teach each other to do it or some will do it and offer it as a service. This is new territory for all of us so we have to assume there will be a learning curve. "We will go where no humans have gone before", Ceramic Mule Team.

sal

CMT. :smiling-cheeks

Imagine this test balloon flies. Maybe there's a chance for at least one or two further models with a Spydiehole? One larger and one smaller than the CMT, both true outdoor blades? Technically it wouldn't be competition to Rahven's kitchen line knives...
Michael
48 Spydies, 44 different models, 43 different steels
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Grail knife, still to be acquired: original Tuff by Ed Schempp Feel free to help me find one at a reasonable price...

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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby Barmoley » Sun Jan 23, 2022 9:19 am

Fireman wrote:
Sun Jan 23, 2022 2:37 am
was your 1 micron a diamond abrasive?
Yes, only used diamond abrasive on this.

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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby FullScaler » Sun Jan 23, 2022 10:29 am

While I have not sharpened this specific type of elastic ceramic. I have spent some time learning on my wife's ceramic kitchen knives.

I found that finer grits of diamond for longer times on the stones was the trick.

I started with coarser grits (300 - 600) and while they felt sharp and cut well in the kitchen, they were not what I would call shaving sharp. After looking closely under a loupe and micro photographs I could see that the coarser grits were not really abrading away and refining the edge. But, were instead, taking tiny micro chips out of the edge and made a very aggressive micro toothed edge.

After stepping up to my finest DMT diamond plate, XX Fine. (About 8000 mesh, 3 micron) I had much better results. Instead of starting at medium grits like I would with most steel I started at X Fine (1200 mesh, 9 micron) and worked for a long time, then stepped up to XX Fine and spent a lot more time.

This gave me great results on my wife's regular ceramic kitchen knives and will be my first plan for the elastic ceramic mules.

My basic tips would be, twice or three times as Fine a grit, for three to five times as long as normal steel. And a very, very, light touch on the stones. Definitely not to be rushed or attempted when you are short on time.
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sal
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby sal » Sun Jan 23, 2022 1:16 pm

Fireman wrote:
Sat Jan 22, 2022 11:03 pm
Sal, so are these manufactured in Switzerland?
These mules will make for an amazing light backpack knives.

Hi Fireman,

She said they were in fact manufactured in Switzerland. I asked specifically because of all of the Chinese manufacturing these days, which seems to be mostly grabbing an existing market, but with a lower price.

They also said they really didn't want to make their own line, but it was a way to get their product out into the market place. We discussed distributing their product in the US, but their financial requirement at this time was more than we were willing to commit. The Mule team is a "first date" to see how and what we can do together.

sal

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Fireman
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby Fireman » Sun Jan 23, 2022 2:02 pm

:smiling-heart-eyes Looks like Spyderco has expanded its international manufacturing. I hope this “date” goes well and we see a variety of successful projects
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Barmoley
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby Barmoley » Sun Jan 23, 2022 5:43 pm

FullScaler wrote:
Sun Jan 23, 2022 10:29 am
While I have not sharpened this specific type of elastic ceramic. I have spent some time learning on my wife's ceramic kitchen knives.

I found that finer grits of diamond for longer times on the stones was the trick.

I started with coarser grits (300 - 600) and while they felt sharp and cut well in the kitchen, they were not what I would call shaving sharp. After looking closely under a loupe and micro photographs I could see that the coarser grits were not really abrading away and refining the edge. But, were instead, taking tiny micro chips out of the edge and made a very aggressive micro toothed edge.

After stepping up to my finest DMT diamond plate, XX Fine. (About 8000 mesh, 3 micron) I had much better results. Instead of starting at medium grits like I would with most steel I started at X Fine (1200 mesh, 9 micron) and worked for a long time, then stepped up to XX Fine and spent a lot more time.

This gave me great results on my wife's regular ceramic kitchen knives and will be my first plan for the elastic ceramic mules.

My basic tips would be, twice or three times as Fine a grit, for three to five times as long as normal steel. And a very, very, light touch on the stones. Definitely not to be rushed or attempted when you are short on time.
Thanks for the recommendation. Roman suggested not to use diamond plates with flexible ceramic, so I haven't tried. I've tried 1200 matrix stone and 2k vitrified diamond in addition to 1 micron on leather.

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Fireman
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby Fireman » Tue Jan 25, 2022 12:56 am

Does anyone else think the ceramic mule might make a good lightweight neck knife? Perhaps a modified swick would too.
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby hereiamu1 » Thu Jan 27, 2022 1:05 am

TomAiello wrote:
Sat Jan 22, 2022 2:07 pm
I'll still be in for two at $150.
Me too

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emanuel
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby emanuel » Fri Jan 28, 2022 11:40 am

Barmoley wrote:
Sun Jan 23, 2022 1:36 am
I tried 1 micron on a leather strop and had very little success. Also tried vitrified diamond stones and
You need a middle ground between too hard and too soft. A diamond stone will micro chip this material. Leather is too soft and seems to round the apex. I believe this is why my sharpening on paper on a cardboard backing with diamond paste of 1 micron is successful, it's similar in its physical attributes to the diamond pad Roman was mentioning in one of his vids regarding sharpening.

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Fireman
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Re: Elastic Ceramic. Wow!

Postby Fireman » Wed Apr 06, 2022 12:01 am

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