CPM 15v Manix 2

[WilliamMunny]

You nailed it, Thanks Will, sometimes I think I need an interpreter.

I might not be the sharpest knife around but I eventually get there.

[ns66]

Do we know when it will be for sale? all the vendors will go at the same time or, how will sprint run work? I am totally new to this sprint run thing

[JSumm]

Do we know when it will be for sale? all the vendors will go at the same time or, how will sprint run work? I am totally new to this sprint run thing

Typically sporadically to different dealers. They will get a batch, sell out, then maybe a restock. Never know who will get it first. Keep an eye out on the forum. Some Jedi's on here will alert quickly to stock.

[Ramonade]

Like our boy Jeff said. For once, I'll try to be on of the Jedis. The carbides are strong in me.

[JSumm]

Like our boy Jeff said. For once, I'll try to be on of the Jedis. The carbides are strong in me.

Just don't go to the large carbide side. Stay true to the small finer side and things will grind evenly and shave cleanly.

[Josh Crutchley]

Spyderco Manix 2 CPM 15V Factory Edge

If you look closely you can see the ~23% vanadium carbide volume bristling at the edge.

This picture is a factory edge from a Maxamet Manix LW that looks similar, wasn't sure if it was the carbines or not.

Not sure if I'll get this Manix as I like the LWs better but I would love to try your 15v so you never know! Really curious about the custom HT so I guess I would need some other 15v to compare it to. Now if I could only convince my wife! Hopefully it's not to long of a wait for your collab to drop.

Thanks for everything you share here on the forum!

[Deadboxhero]

Spyderco Manix 2 CPM 15V Factory Edge

If you look closely you can see the ~23% vanadium carbide volume bristling at the edge.

This picture is a factory edge from a Maxamet Manix LW that looks similar, wasn't sure if it was the carbines or not.

Not sure if I'll get this Manix as I like the LWs better but I would love to try your 15v so you never know! Really curious about the custom HT so I guess I would need some other 15v to compare it to. Now if I could only convince my wife! Hopefully it's not to long of a wait for your collab to drop.

Thanks for everything you share here on the forum!

Nice it's always cool when people share microscope images.

Thanks Josh I appreciate the kind words.

[Deadboxhero]

Todd Simpson from "Science Of Sharp" has the best microscope image of a Spyderco factory edge that I've ever seen. He is using SEM.

The steel is k390 and you could see the carbides at the apex like little blisters.




I don't have a SEM but I was able to get a cool picture of the Spyderco Manix 2 15V factory edge with more magnification. It can be difficult to focus on an edge with a light optical microscope because you can be limited by the depth of field which you don't experience with the SEM.



Its really cool to see where that almost ~15% wt of vanadium alloy is going, you could literally see those vanadium carbides bristling at the edge.

[Bemo]

****! If that picture doesn't sell you, nothing will.

[aaronkb]

Finally so I can lean more why would someone chose 15v over S90V? They are booth around the same toughness, have about the same edge retention but 15v is not stainless.

That's a good question, and a question that I've wondered about also. I think there might be more to it than this. I've seen some of the charts of toughness vs edgeholding and I've noticed that S110v and S90V are pretty high up there, in the range of K390 and Maxamet. We go crazy for K390 and now we're talking about 15V, but S110V is much easier to find.

I’m still catching up on this thread so apologies if someone else has already answered this or answered it better.

I don’t think the edge retention is the same, I think you guys are thinking of wear resistance which I could see being in the same ballpark. Wear resistance is one component of edge retention. Another major component of edge retention is edge stability/strength. Edges don’t only wear away via abrasion, they also get dented or bent. Using a couple common examples, wear resistance is more important for cutting through tons of cardboard whereas edge stability is more important for chopping food against a cutting board. If you’re cutting up boxes that have metal staples, you’d better have good wear resistance AND edge strength. If you see Shawn’s videos chopping through nails, that’s all about edge strength.

This is a bit of an oversimplification, but edge strength/stability is generally correlated with Rockwell hardness. So if two different steels have similar wear resistance but one is able to be heat treated substantially harder than the other, a knife in that steel will overall outperform the softer steel with the same wear resistance.

I hope that was helpful! And if anyone who knows more than me wants to jump in, I’m happy to be corrected =)

[aaronkb]

Thanks Shawn, I think that needed to be said. It will be sad when the collectors get their hands on this knife, just to collect dust. Or the folks that will use it for peppers, apples and strawberries...but feel the need for this kind of steel for some reason, and sadly that's probably where a majority of these will be going.

As someone that uses my knives 6 days a week, and quite often throughout the day, and also love the high edge retention steels because of those reasons...I agree, those are made for users!! Not the other way around. There are so many people out that consider sharpening knives as giving them passes on their Sharpmaker brown rods. Which they would then be unsuccessful at actual sharpening, and then likely bash the steel...because they don't have the equipment or skill for it. You really hit the nail on the head with a lot of the things you said. I think people need to step back and think about those things before buying this knife, if they are actually going to be using it. Not just because it's a sprint, a different steel and something even more different with you being so heavily involved. I personally intend on getting one, and will use the crap out of it at work and will be happy to report back my findings, as well as sharpening experience when the time comes.

Again, thanks for that post. I couldn't agree more.

Glad this is being discussed. I am a brown rod sharpmaker guy, which is probably why VG10 works so well for me. Definitely sounds like I need to pass and let someone who can appreciate it more get one

i don't know... i'm totally happy with tougher steels that are softer and more corrosion resistant. shawn's post totally put me off of wanting to try this knife, but not because of my steel preferences... because of his attitude. i don't like the implication that people with different preferences are somehow less than those that think they need the forever retention of his specially heat treated 15v. we're not just newb tourists for being fine with s30v, lc200n, vg10, etc. maybe i'm reading too much into the post, but it comes off as very elitist and condescending to me.

That’s not what he said at all. He took great pains to say explicitly that that’s fine and that the issue is there are already a ton of knives that cater to your preferences, but very few production knives cater to the preferences of edge junkies and he’s frustrated by some of the ignorant comments about a knife that finally does.

[aaronkb]

You just got me even more excited with your "king of the k390/10v range" summary, thank you! Maxamet never won me over like K390 did from M4, so I'm curious as to how this will feel in comparison. If it behaves more like K390 but cuts as long as Maxamet I'll likely be asking for more 15v!
<snip>

No doubt that since apparently it's his collab project, calling it "king of ..." is just more of the same marketing/sales pitch type stuff we saw regarding Magnacut. Of course the product you're putting out is the best thing ever, if you don't say that you're not doing your job as a business person.

All these steels are making various trade-offs, so I'm not really on board with calling 15v a killer/king of anything. Some attributes are being sacrificed for other attributes, a reality which is always going to be present. Currently I'm not excited about taking a step back in toughness from K390/10v, but others may be totally fine making that trade-off, it all depends on each person's particular needs.

You just walked into a movie in the last 15 mins and made a lot of assumptions about the first two hours you missed.

This collab exists BECAUSE Shawn (a MAJOR innovator and educator in the knife steel world) has believed in this steel and been advocating for this steel for YEARS. And he’s been doing that because as a custom knife maker and steel junkie he saw potential in it, it’s not like someone forced him to start using it. His collaboration with Spyderco has been years in the making, and he was talking very publicly about 15v for years before that.

It’s really hard for me to imagine the arrogance that makes someone so willing to be this disrespectful and dismissive to someone who has contributed so much to the community, without bothering to educate yourself about the topic at all before opening your mouth.

I’m not saying Shawn’s infallible or beyond criticism - nobody is - but this criticism was ignorant and disrespectful af. Unreal.

[Manixguy@1994]

[legOFwhat?]

That's a lofty position sir, come on down and lets talk of grander things!

[WilliamMunny]

You just walked into a movie in the last 15 mins and made a lot of assumptions about the first two hours you missed.

This collab exists BECAUSE Shawn (a MAJOR innovator and educator in the knife steel world) has believed in this steel and been advocating for this steel for YEARS. And he’s been doing that because as a custom knife maker and steel junkie he saw potential in it, it’s not like someone forced him to start using it. His collaboration with Spyderco has been years in the making, and he was talking very publicly about 15v for years before that.

It’s really hard for me to imagine the arrogance that makes someone so willing to be this disrespectful and dismissive to someone who has contributed so much to the community, without bothering to educate yourself about the topic at all before opening your mouth.

I’m not saying Shawn’s infallible or beyond criticism - nobody is - but this criticism was ignorant and disrespectful af. Unreal.

Why do you never see elephants hiding in trees? Because they’re so good at it.

What's the difference between a knife and an argument? The knife has a point.

A bartender broke up with her boyfriend, but he kept asking her for another shot.

[Ramonade]

I'm salivating too much... can't touch this conversation

[Deadboxhero]

Did I repeat test on the factory edge.
Especially since I know for some people the factory I just very important for them.

In the test I'm cutting into hard african blackwood with a side load and scraping cuts, this is clear misuse of a knife edge and not what it's intended for. The 15V it's not the toughest steel but it does have enough strength to hold up to some misuse within reason.

The end user will get the best edge performance from sharpening their own knife and customizing the edge angle to meet their needs and preferences.

That's why sharpening is so important, steels like these are not intended to be a solution for not needing to sharpen but a way to prolong the sharpening work you put into it by going longer between sharpenings and giving the ability to sharpen when you want to not because you have to.

For some peoples preferences they will get the best performance with a thicker edge, others will enjoy a thinner edge with more judicious use.

[Enactive]

Did I repeat test on the factory edge.
Especially since I know for some people the factory I just very important for them.

In the test I'm cutting into hard african blackwood with a side load and scraping cuts, this is clear misuse of a knife edge and not what it's intended for. The 15V it's not the toughest steel but it does have enough strength to hold up to some misuse within reason.

The end user will get the best edge performance from sharpening their own knife and customizing the edge angle to meet their needs and preferences.

That's why sharpening is so important, steels like these are not intended to be a solution for not needing to sharpen but a way to prolong the sharpening work you put into it by going longer between sharpenings and giving the ability to sharpen when you want to not because you have to.

For some peoples preferences they will get the best performance with a thicker edge, others will enjoy a thinner edge with more judicious use.

Sweet!

Didn't make me wince as much as your REX45 brass rod carving video, nor the K390 Po-po being stabbed into CMU block... but still good abuse testing.

[Deadboxhero]

Did I repeat test on the factory edge.
Especially since I know for some people the factory I just very important for them.

In the test I'm cutting into hard african blackwood with a side load and scraping cuts, this is clear misuse of a knife edge and not what it's intended for. The 15V it's not the toughest steel but it does have enough strength to hold up to some misuse within reason.

The end user will get the best edge performance from sharpening their own knife and customizing the edge angle to meet their needs and preferences.

That's why sharpening is so important, steels like these are not intended to be a solution for not needing to sharpen but a way to prolong the sharpening work you put into it by going longer between sharpenings and giving the ability to sharpen when you want to not because you have to.

For some peoples preferences they will get the best performance with a thicker edge, others will enjoy a thinner edge with more judicious use.

Sweet!

Didn't make me wince as much as your REX45 brass rod carving video, nor the K390 Po-po being stabbed into CMU block... but still good abuse testing.

Yeah I didn't test those on the factory edges, those had a nice freehand edges which will have some convexity, it looks like the factory will have a slight hollow which should make them easy to touch up with a sharpmaker compared to a convex which would have more material to cut threw.

[Skar]

I'm on the fence with this.
I merely want this because the price is good especially for a exotic steel sprint.

On the other hand I have two sprint run manix's that I hesitate picking another.
Decisions.